Watched the Bern

[gimpyrancher]

When it's all said and done I still believe hillary will be our next president.

I sincerely hope you are wrong.

 

[john250]

When it's all said and done I still believe hillary will be our next president.

I sincerely hope you are wrong.

Wow! Facebook friends deluge me with Sanders meme's. The man is simple minded. Hillary is the same, but she's a woman. 53% of the electorate is women. So Hillary should walk in. Except polls say she'll get 0% of the male vote. She best hope for !00% turnout of women.

 

[greybeard]

I'm glad I don't have friends like that--facebook or otherwise.

 

[greybeard]

Bernie Sanders campaign explained in less than 10 minutes
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6hlM7kixI8[/youtube]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6hlM7kixI8

 

[gimpyrancher]

We may all be on the government's payroll real soon.

If we give anymore tax breaks to the rich, it'll get worse. If we give anymore subsidies to rich corporations, it's gonna get worse. :deadhorse:

 

[lavacarancher]

We may all be on the government's payroll real soon.

If we give anymore tax breaks to the rich, it'll get worse. If we give anymore subsidies to rich corporations, it's gonna get worse. :deadhorse:

Gimp, how many "American" companies are still operating in the USA (rhetorical question - don't expect an answer). They are leaving because the tax rate in the USA is MUCH higher than it is in other countries. Sir, that's a fact, look it up. So if an American company closes its doors and moves to say Mexico, what happens to its workers (like you)? Do you really (really) think you're getting something for free from the dums? Somebody has to pay something. Where is the money coming from? I wish folks would stop and think for a few seconds about how things really work - look beyond your front door - look at how things are effected by "free" education or "free" health care or "free" phones. Harvard wants you to teach economics at their college. It will require 14 hour days and your compensation will be zero, nada, nothing because the dums have said everything will be free.

Come on, Gimp. Really?

 

[ram]

Taxes and the EPA go hand in hand. We all reap the benefits of the government, but only a few pay for those benefits.

 

[Bestoutwest]

Gimp, how many "American" companies are still operating in the USA (rhetorical question - don't expect an answer). They are leaving because the tax rate in the USA is MUCH higher than it is in other countries. Sir, that's a fact, look it up. So if an American company closes its doors and moves to say Mexico, what happens to its workers (like you)? Do you really (really) think you're getting something for free from the dums? Somebody has to pay something. Where is the money coming from? I wish folks would stop and think for a few seconds about how things really work - look beyond your front door - look at how things are effected by "free" education or "free" health care or "free" phones. Harvard wants you to teach economics at their college. It will require 14 hour days and your compensation will be zero, nada, nothing because the dums have said everything will be free.

Come on, Gimp. Really?

1) Businesses leave America because of labor costs and regulations. China allows for workers to work 12 hours/day 6 days/week. Regulations over there are a joke. I read a book on the global business of recycling a few months ago. The author was raised in a scrap yard and said some of the things he saw there were the worst cases of polution he'd ever seen.

2) Free education is absolutely essential to America becoming a super power again. You want to talk about spending? How many billions has the war on drugs and terror cost the American people?

3) I think you and I can both agree that the welfare system is messed up, but according to some things I've read, Walmart and McDonald's employees are some of the biggest groups using those services to survive. Why am I paying for that? Both those corporations make more than enough to do more for their employees. You and I don't.

 

[greybeard]

Depends how many "you and I's" you are referring to.
I covet not, that which others have.
yrmv

 

[Bestoutwest]

Depends how many "you and I's" you are referring to.
I covet not, that which others have.

I don't covet what others have either. I've learned that to make millions as a CEO there's a ton of things you have to sacrifice, which I'm unwilling to honestly. My point is, though, that they have the money to compensate their employees a little better. I'd like more of my money to stay in my pocket, and if that is not a possibility I'd like to to go toward things that have a direct effect on my life (education, infrastructure that I utilize, etc) instead of subsidizing the 'benefits' for a major corporation through welfare.

yrmv

No idea what this means.

 

[greybeard]

YRMV=Your Results May Vary, meaning you may or may not agree or see things the same way.
We all want things that will benefit us or benefit things that we hold important, but for that to happen, someone else almost always has to give up some of their possessions or ideals. We each would rather it be "the other guy" (corps in this case) that has to give something up so we can have what we want--the only way we can get (or keep) what we want is to get what someone else already has (again, in this case, the 'corporations') . Politicians fully understand this phenomenon, and try their best to buy our support every election cycle, at the expense of "someone else". We, of course, are being no less selfish than corporations or whichever the political boogeyman happens to be in any election cycle---sometimes it's the corporations, sometimes it's the labor unions, sometimes it's the immigrants, sometimes it's the religious devout, sometimes it's the farmer--etc, etc etc. Whichever segment of society or group is demonized at any given time, there will always be a politician that proposes to take from "them" and give to "us" and there is always going to be a supporting segment of society that falls for this "Robin Hood" type campaign hoping to profit from taking from someone else.
If this is not coveting, I do not know what is.

I've always found it rather comical and perplexing tho, where "they" would eventually draw the line. I (and I assume Gimpy does too) own land and cattle. Compared to "the guy down the road", both of us are"rich". Eventually, "they" will come for what we have too. History has shown that to be the case time after time.

 

[john250]

YRMV=Your Results May Vary, meaning you may or may not agree or see things the same way.
We all want things that will benefit us or benefit things that we hold important, but for that to happen, someone else almost always has to give up some of their possessions or ideals. We each would rather it be "the other guy" (corps in this case) that has to give something up so we can have what we want--the only way we can get what we want is to get what someone else already has (again, in this case, the 'corporations') . Politicians fully understand this phenomenon, and try their best to buy our support every election cycle, at the expense of "someone else". We, of course, are being no less selfish than corporations or whichever the political boogeyman happens to be in any election cycle---sometimes it's the corporations, sometimes it's the labor unions, sometimes it's the immigrants, sometimes it's the religious devout, sometimes it's the farmer--etc, etc etc. Whichever segment of society or group is demonized at any given time, there will always be a politician that proposes to take from "them" and give to "us" and there is always going to be a supporting segment of society that falls for this "Robin Hood" type campaign hoping to profit from taking from someone else.
If this is not coveting, I do not know what is.

I've always found it rather comical and perplexing tho, where "they" would eventually draw the line. I (and I assume Gimpy does too) own land and cattle. Compared to "the guy down the road", both of us are"rich". Eventually, "they" will come for what we have too. History has shown that to be the case time after time.

Indeed! Farmers and ranchers have always been "live poor, die rich". The most evil will be done when O and Buffet get the capital gains tax up to confiscatory rates.

 

[TexasBred]

Yep. If a democrat doesn't pander to the far left above all else, they have no shot in their primary.

At least it's the far left instead of a couple of billionaires that want the best for the country, right?

I'm sure you mean the Koch brothers.....how soon you forget George Soros, the liberal democrat nazi who helped with the murder of millions of his own people.

 

[Bestoutwest]

We all want things that will benefit us or benefit things that we hold important, but for that to happen, someone else almost always has to give up some of their possessions or ideals. We each would rather it be "the other guy" (corps in this case) that has to give something up so we can have what we want--the only way we can get what we want is to get what someone else already has (again, in this case, the 'corporations') . Politicians fully understand this phenomenon, and try their best to buy our support every election cycle, at the expense of "someone else". We, of course, are being no less selfish than corporations or whichever the political boogeyman happens to be in any election cycle---sometimes it's the corporations, sometimes it's the labor unions, sometimes it's the immigrants, sometimes it's the religious devout, sometimes it's the farmer--etc, etc etc. Whichever segment of society or group is demonized at any given time, there will always be a politician that proposes to take from "them" and give to "us" and there is always going to be a supporting segment of society that falls for this "Robin Hood" type campaign hoping to profit from taking from someone else.
If this is not coveting, I do not know what is.

I've always found it rather comical and perplexing tho, where "they" would eventually draw the line. I (and I assume Gimpy does too) own land and cattle. Compared to "the guy down the road", both of us are"rich". Eventually, "they" will come for what we have too. History has shown that to be the case time after time.

I understand what you mean. My wife and I make a combined income that is over 2X the county average. We have land, cows, a new truck, new trailer, too large house (didn't build it, bought it), etc. and we've worked hard to get where we're at but we're also lucky that we haven't hit any snags along the way. Where I'm fed up is states/counties/cities giving tax breaks to large corporations to stay or move in. Where are the tax breaks to the independent guys (the plumbers, HVAC, electricians, etc)?

At least it's the far left instead of a couple of billionaires that want the best for the country, right?

I'm sure you mean the Koch brothers.....how soon you forget George Soros, the liberal democrat nazi who helped with the murder of millions of his own people.[/quote]

And that's the problem with giant money in politics. It's not new, won't ever change, but it's frustrating. B/c on billionaire thinks it's a good idea, we all get stuck with it. It's getting old.

 

[Bestoutwest]

We all want things that will benefit us or benefit things that we hold important, but for that to happen, someone else almost always has to give up some of their possessions or ideals. We each would rather it be "the other guy" (corps in this case) that has to give something up so we can have what we want--the only way we can get what we want is to get what someone else already has (again, in this case, the 'corporations') . Politicians fully understand this phenomenon, and try their best to buy our support every election cycle, at the expense of "someone else". We, of course, are being no less selfish than corporations or whichever the political boogeyman happens to be in any election cycle---sometimes it's the corporations, sometimes it's the labor unions, sometimes it's the immigrants, sometimes it's the religious devout, sometimes it's the farmer--etc, etc etc. Whichever segment of society or group is demonized at any given time, there will always be a politician that proposes to take from "them" and give to "us" and there is always going to be a supporting segment of society that falls for this "Robin Hood" type campaign hoping to profit from taking from someone else.
If this is not coveting, I do not know what is.

I've always found it rather comical and perplexing tho, where "they" would eventually draw the line. I (and I assume Gimpy does too) own land and cattle. Compared to "the guy down the road", both of us are"rich". Eventually, "they" will come for what we have too. History has shown that to be the case time after time.

I understand what you mean. My wife and I make a combined income that is over 2X the county average. We have land, cows, a new truck, new trailer, too large house (didn't build it, bought it), etc. and we've worked hard to get where we're at but we're also lucky that we haven't hit any snags along the way. Where I'm fed up is states/counties/cities giving tax breaks to large corporations to stay or move in. Where are the tax breaks to the independent guys (the plumbers, HVAC, electricians, etc)?

I'm sure you mean the Koch brothers.....how soon you forget George Soros, the liberal democrat nazi who helped with the murder of millions of his own people.

And that's the problem with giant money in politics. It's not new, won't ever change, but it's frustrating. B/c one billionaire thinks it's a good idea, we all get stuck with it. It's getting old.

 

[greybeard]

Where I'm fed up is states/counties/cities giving tax breaks to large corporations to stay or move in. Where are the tax breaks to the independent guys (the plumbers, HVAC, electricians, etc)?

If tax breaks are given to independents (and I'm not saying they don't deserve them) then a shortfall will exist in tax revenues. That will have to be made up somewhere, and the most likely source will be those further down the economic ladder--you and I--the consumer. First they came after the revenues of the conglomerates, then after the revenues of the mid caps, then after the revenues of the small factories, then after the revenues of the independents. By the time they came after the revenues of you and I, there was no one left to complain.
The proletariat (working masses that sell their labor and the landless) will always come after what is possessed by those they consider to be the Bourgeoisie (the 'haves') , but anyone having $1 more than the very bottom of the ladder will eventually find themselves at some point---branded as Bourgeoisie.
Remember, Karl Marx,described and saw the bourgeois during Middle Ages usually as a self-employed businessman – such as a merchant, banker, or entrepreneur. These are the same folks you are asking to get a break in taxation.

In other words, it never stops. There will always be someone further down the hill that believes anyone further up the hill "owes" more just so the ones down below owe less.
Covet not.

Bernie lives in a glass house as well. Even tho his net worth is 230 times smaller than the Clintons, his net worth is also 8 times larger than the median US household. IOW, to most of the US, Bernie IS the bourgeois.

 

[lavacarancher]

Best and Gimp, you folks want something for nothing. Unfortunately, the "nothing" comes from someone like me and the millions of others who work for a living and pay too high taxes. Get a job, work for a living.

I'll tell you what, Best. Give me $200K. I need a new tractor, hay mower and baler so I can continue to make a living. PM me and I'll give you the bank transfer information.

 

[Bestoutwest]

Best and Gimp, you folks want something for nothing. Unfortunately, the "nothing" comes from someone like me and the millions of others who work for a living and pay too high taxes. Get a job, work for a living.

I'll tell you what, Best. Give me $200K. I need a new tractor, hay mower and baler so I can continue to make a living. PM me and I'll give you the bank transfer information.

Wow, way to miss my point. Why don't you work on your reading comprehension skills before I give you that check? I'd hate to have you get screwed b/c you couldn't understand the fine print. I'm not saying that we should all be given something for nothing. I'm saying I'm sick to death of seeing the uber rich (which I, and I'm assuming you, are not part of) being able to hide all their money away in this and that while the rest of us pay up.

I say 'Good day!' :tiphat:

 

[greybeard]

I'm saying I'm sick to death of seeing the uber rich (which I, and I'm assuming you, are not part of) being able to hide all their money away in this and that while the rest of us pay up.

I say 'Good day!' :tiphat:

To the 'uber' poor, even those just above the national poverty line (but miles above the poorest) are 'uber' rich.
Everything is relative...it just depends what is being compared and to what or who.
Those folks down the road, driving the ragged old Honda Civic and eating Raman Noodles???...
They very clearly and firmly believe you and I (and those like us) have untold wealth 'hidden' in land, timber, hay and livestock, while they "pay up".

 

[TexasBred]

Best and Gimp, you folks want something for nothing. Unfortunately, the "nothing" comes from someone like me and the millions of others who work for a living and pay too high taxes. Get a job, work for a living.

I'll tell you what, Best. Give me $200K. I need a new tractor, hay mower and baler so I can continue to make a living. PM me and I'll give you the bank transfer information.

Wow, way to miss my point. Why don't you work on your reading comprehension skills before I give you that check? I'd hate to have you get screwed b/c you couldn't understand the fine print. I'm not saying that we should all be given something for nothing. I'm saying I'm sick to death of seeing the uber rich (which I, and I'm assuming you, are not part of) being able to hide all their money away in this and that while the rest of us pay up.

I say 'Good day!' :tiphat:

Many of those tax shelters are available to all of us. We simply have to save enough to utilize them. Can't blame a person for being successful and utilizing all the tools that are available to him and not right to discriminate against him because he is successful. Keep working, keep savings you may get there.