Snake identification

[Margonme]

spreading viper
I've heard that called a "spreadnatter" or "spread adder" too.

That's what we call them here.

Craig is you ever wonder why scientist resort to Latin names to identify species, this thread is a great lesson. It all started with the following:

Carl Linnaeus, also known after his ennoblement as Carl von Linné, was a Swedish botanist, physician, and zoologist, who formalised the modern system of naming organisms called binomial nomenclature.

 

[Margonme]

Check this one out Margo.

One of our pit vipers, Crotalus.

Now, there are numerous species of Crotalus but I am guessing you being in Georgia and from the pattern, that is Crotalus horridus

 

[ga.prime]

I saw a black spreading adder while I was on the tractor Friday. They're not commonly seen around here.

 

[ga.prime]

Check this one out Margo.

One of our pit vipers, Crotalus.

Now, there are numerous species of Crotalus but I am guessing you being in Georgia and from the pattern, that is Crotalus horridus

No, it is Crotalus adamanteus. Eastern Diamondback. I'll post a better pic so you can plainly see. It was a full grown one, between 5 and 6 feet long and a good four inches thick.

 

[dun]

Sure would make a pretty hat band

 

[ga.prime]

 

[Margonme]

Check this one out Margo.

One of our pit vipers, Crotalus.

Now, there are numerous species of Crotalus but I am guessing you being in Georgia and from the pattern, that is Crotalus horridus

No, it is Crotalus adamanteus. Eastern Diamondback. I'll post a better pic so you can plainly see. It was a full grown one, between 5 and 6 feet long and a good four inches thick.

OK. I know their ranges overlap in Georgia.

Those pictures are better. I can see the difference.

 

[Margonme]

Regarding the dull/shiny issue. Pit vipers have keeled scales. It does give the appearance that they are dull. So if you exclude the coral snake, venomous snakes in North America do appear dull.

On a broader scope, that rule does not hold true. For example, the King Cobra is very shiny and also very venomous. There are many worldwide examples of venomous serpents that are shiny. Vice versa, there are dull snakes like the common water snake that are harmless.

 

[cowgirl8]

So, if you are identifying a snake in the US and are unsure if its poisonous, noting the shine is way better than looking at the scales around its nose/eyes or whatever the ID on the head is? I'm guessing that you'd be pretty safe in using the shiny/dull vs looking close at the arrangement of scales to ID if its poisonous? Although there are a few here that i'd suggest getting right up in there and ID them like you think you should, get really close up to their face just to be sure...lol Other ways are shape of body and head, but sometimes thats hidden...Look at the shine, if its shiny, its probably ok...of course there is the coral snake that most of us have learned early on the color is what sets it different from the others. But from rattlers, moccasins and copperheads..... if its dull, its probably poisonous..

 

[Margonme]

So, if you are identifying a snake in the US and are unsure if its poisonous, noting the shine is way better than looking at the scales around its nose/eyes or whatever the ID on the head is? I'm guessing that you'd be pretty safe in using the shiny/dull vs looking close at the arrangement of scales to ID if its poisonous? Although there are a few here that i'd suggest getting right up in there and ID them like you think you should, get really close up to their face just to be sure...lol Other ways are shape of body and head, but sometimes thats hidden...Look at the shine, if its shiny, its probably ok...of course there is the coral snake that most of us have learned early on the color is what sets it different from the others. But from rattlers, moccasins and copperheads..... if its dull, its probably poisonous..

No, I do not use the dull/shiny criteria.

Please don't be insulted! I been studying snakes my entire life. I am 66.

Edited to add: It is not difficult to observe the Pit. All our venomous snakes have the Pit between the eye and nostril except the coral snakes. For me, that is a more accurate criteria than the dull/shiny. If dull/shiny works for you, then I see no issue.

 

[cowgirl8]

So, if you are identifying a snake in the US and are unsure if its poisonous, noting the shine is way better than looking at the scales around its nose/eyes or whatever the ID on the head is? I'm guessing that you'd be pretty safe in using the shiny/dull vs looking close at the arrangement of scales to ID if its poisonous? Although there are a few here that i'd suggest getting right up in there and ID them like you think you should, get really close up to their face just to be sure...lol Other ways are shape of body and head, but sometimes thats hidden...Look at the shine, if its shiny, its probably ok...of course there is the coral snake that most of us have learned early on the color is what sets it different from the others. But from rattlers, moccasins and copperheads..... if its dull, its probably poisonous..

No, I do not use the dull/shiny criteria.

Please don't be insulted! I been studying snakes my entire life. I am 66.

I'm not insulted...just suggesting a quick way to id a snake by a nonsnake person without looking down at arrangement of scales... I cant imagine any of these guys picking up a snake. But, if they wanted to, how is the best way to ID one from a safe distance or while its slithering out of sight? Do you look at it and decide on color alone? Some of these guys have no idea what color snakes are suppose to be.. Do you get a closer look at how the scales are arranged on its head? Or do you look at it from a distance and see that its scales are dull, so, maybe then get a closer look? From a distance, i cant think of an easier way to ID one that might be poisonous as to look at if its shiny or dull after looking at shape.

 

[Margonme]

So, if you are identifying a snake in the US and are unsure if its poisonous, noting the shine is way better than looking at the scales around its nose/eyes or whatever the ID on the head is? I'm guessing that you'd be pretty safe in using the shiny/dull vs looking close at the arrangement of scales to ID if its poisonous? Although there are a few here that i'd suggest getting right up in there and ID them like you think you should, get really close up to their face just to be sure...lol Other ways are shape of body and head, but sometimes thats hidden...Look at the shine, if its shiny, its probably ok...of course there is the coral snake that most of us have learned early on the color is what sets it different from the others. But from rattlers, moccasins and copperheads..... if its dull, its probably poisonous..

No, I do not use the dull/shiny criteria.

Please don't be insulted! I been studying snakes my entire life. I am 66.

I'm not insulted...just suggesting a quick way to id a snake by a nonsnake person without looking down at arrangement of scales... I cant imagine any of these guys picking up a snake. But, if they wanted to, how is the best way to ID one from a safe distance or while its slithering out of sight? Do you look at it and decide on color alone? Some of these guys have no idea what color snakes are suppose to be.. Do you get a closer look at how the scales are arranged on its head? Or do you look at it from a distance and see that its scales are dull, so, maybe then get a closer look? From a distance, i cant think of an easier way to ID one that might be poisonous as to look at if its shiny or dull after looking at shape.

I do pick up snakes. I use a Pillstrom Tongs. In my case, I know one when I see one. I don't happen to like the dull/shiny identification criteria. I have read others who recommend it for those totally unfamiliar with venomous herptiles.

 

[cowgirl8]

I don't happen to like the dull/shiny identification criteria. I have read others who recommend it for those totally unfamiliar with venomous herptiles.

For you no..........but for someone who isnt going to go in for a close look????

 

[Margonme]

I don't happen to like the dull/shiny identification criteria. I have read others who recommend it for those totally unfamiliar with venomous herptiles.

For you no..........but for someone who isnt going to go in for a close look????

It is a useful criteria to be used with other information.

 

[dun]

If it's slithering out of sight who cares what it is. If it's approaching you that's a whole different issue

 

[cowgirl8]

I don't happen to like the dull/shiny identification criteria. I have read others who recommend it for those totally unfamiliar with venomous herptiles.

For you no..........but for someone who isnt going to go in for a close look????

It is a useful criteria to be used with other information.

The only other is color and shape, for someone who is looking from a distance. I can tell, from a distance and up close. I do not only use whether its shiny or dull but it helps when i cant get a good look at anything else....but some of these posters could use it because they wont get near enough to use any other means. This shiny or dull will save some nonpoisonous snakes from being killed like chicken snakes who are kill more than any because people think they are poisonous. They are always shiny, long and slender....very very easy to ID from a nonpoisonous...

 

[Margonme]

If it's slithering out of sight who cares what it is. If it's approaching you that's a whole different issue

When it's headed away is when I use the tongs. If it is coming my way, I got it. Unless, I am collecting for laboratory specimens. I always let them loose.

 

[cowgirl8]

If it's slithering out of sight who cares what it is. If it's approaching you that's a whole different issue

Oh, in that case, and i'm sure it happens a lot to you....Be sure you bend down and look really close at the arrangements of the scales on its head to 'make' sure it is or isnt poisonous....You may need to hold it just right in the light to see this arrangement...lol.... :roll:

 

[Margonme]

If it's slithering out of sight who cares what it is. If it's approaching you that's a whole different issue

Oh, in that case, and i'm sure it happens a lot to you....Be sure you bend down and look really close at the arrangements of the scales on its head to 'make' sure it is or isnt poisonous....You may need to hold it just right in the light to see this arrangement...lol.... :roll:

Now you are exaggerating. Identification is difficult if you are not trained. The best advice is to avoid picking up or exposing any part of your body to a snake if you do not know what species it is.

 

[cowgirl8]

If it's slithering out of sight who cares what it is. If it's approaching you that's a whole different issue

Oh, in that case, and i'm sure it happens a lot to you....Be sure you bend down and look really close at the arrangements of the scales on its head to 'make' sure it is or isnt poisonous....You may need to hold it just right in the light to see this arrangement...lol.... :roll:

Now you are exaggerating. Identification is difficult if you are not trained. The best advice is to avoid picking up or exposing any part of your body to a snake if you do not know what species it is.

Exactly..... but obviously dum is having a hard time with all these snakes that come after him...lol.... :lol2: