Moderate sized cows

[CattleMan1920]

My heifers are bigger than GAR bulls, LOL!

He ain't joking! His heifers are as big as my cows.

LOL! Jurassic Ranch!

 

[CattleMan1920]

He ain't joking! His heifers are as big as my cows.

BALONEY!

No baloney. My average cow is about the same size on a frame and weight basis as his heifers.

My heifers are usually between 1500-1600 pounds when they have their calf. Smallest would be around 1300 pounds.

 

[True Grit Farms]

Quoted from the article: "The smaller cattle averaged 38 to 40 inches (frame score 2.6) at the hip at fall weaning, and the larger cattle averaged 43 to 44 inches (frame score 4.9). The smaller-framed cows were designated as "range" and the moderately framed cows were designated as "beef." Interestingly, the average mature (6 to 8 years of age) weight was 1,295 pounds for the "range" cows and 1,522 pounds for the "beef" cows."

I would consider the "beef" cows in this study to be moderate also. I would have been more interested in a study with the "beef" herd being frame score 6 1800 lb cows.

Everything is based off averages and the study is pretty much is dead on. Only hobby farmers or people who have more money than sense have 1800lb cows.

I'm a hobbyist and I don't even own scales but I'm afraid that based on the frame sizes of most of our herd, if properly fed and cared for, they'd be pushing that 1,800 pound mark.

Good thing I neglect them I suppose.

I don't know your cows, but I know one of the bulls you used starting out. And I can't see one of Mr Danny's polled Hereford bulls being capable of producing a 1800 lb cow. He breeds for consistency and at one time he said 1200 to 1400 lb is what his cows averaged, has that changed? You also used a Bismarck son which is know as a calving ease heifer bull and moderate growth. Maybe your scale is broken?

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Comparing a calf to a herd sire ...Ive been a fan of net worth. Hes a hoss.But I like better examples than that...

 

[Bright Raven]

BALONEY!

No baloney. My average cow is about the same size on a frame and weight basis as his heifers.

My heifers are usually between 1500-1600 pounds when they have their calf. Smallest would be around 1300 pounds.

Exactly. My cows are not that big. I think TT has a bad memory. Just ask bball, Kentuckyguy or ringer. They have seen my herd.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Everything is based off averages and the study is pretty much is dead on. Only hobby farmers or people who have more money than sense have 1800lb cows.

I'm a hobbyist and I don't even own scales but I'm afraid that based on the frame sizes of most of our herd, if properly fed and cared for, they'd be pushing that 1,800 pound mark.

Good thing I neglect them I suppose.

I don't know your cows, but I know one of the bulls you used starting out. And I can't see one of Mr Danny's polled Hereford bulls being capable of producing a 1800 lb cow. He breeds for consistency and at one time he said 1200 to 1400 lb is what his cows averaged, has that changed? You also used a Bismarck son which is know as a calving ease heifer bull and moderate growth. Maybe your scale is broken?

The big cows go back before my time Grit. Most of what we've raised since 2013 has been very moderate indeed. Still have quite a few big gals left however.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Comparing a calf to a herd sire ...Ive been a fan of net worth. Hes a hoss.But I like better examples than that...

I was just making a generalization, but even when the GAR bull is fully mature he wouldn't hold a candle to Net Worth. I've seen Net Worth daughters and they are excellent.

 

[callmefence]

Or a bull like this?

https://youtu.be/3lHv6oy90CQ

His azz is to big...looks like a hippopotamus

 

[Silver]

Kinda funny how folks will sing the praises of CAB and the wonderful marketing tool that it is and then raise Angus cattle that will never qualify for the program and expect the masses to beat a path to their door for these wonder cattle.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Or a bull like this?

https://youtu.be/3lHv6oy90CQ

His azz is to big...looks like a hippopotamus

I thought all Angus were "hatched-azzed"?

 

[Stocker Steve]

Up here in dairy land we prefer the traditional heavy milking mix of BA with some stein. Don't think he is that kind. Need a DNA test on that big boy to find out what is in the woodpile. :nod:

 

[True Grit Farms]

Comparing a calf to a herd sire ...Ive been a fan of net worth. Hes a hoss.But I like better examples than that...

I was just making a generalization, but even when the GAR bull is fully mature he wouldn't hold a candle to Net Worth. I've seen Net Worth daughters and they are excellent.

We're not holding candles we're producing beef to eat. A GAR bull will beat a Net Worth bull in a overall carcass quality every time, and do it on less imputs. I know your not worried about inputs but real cattlemen are.

 

[callmefence]

Or a bull like this?

https://youtu.be/3lHv6oy90CQ

His azz is to big...looks like a hippopotamus

I thought all Angus were "hatched-azzed"?

Wth is a hatchet azz

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Beats me, just some slang I picked up along the way.

 

[callmefence]

Beats me, just some slang I picked up along the way.

Gotcha...I wonder who came up with that
Don't even make sense.

 

[Bright Raven]

His azz is to big...looks like a hippopotamus

I thought all Angus were "hatched-azzed"?

Wth is a hatchet azz

Hatchet azzed is a reference to lack of muscling on the pelvis and thighs. Angus have been the target of the term. But there are certainly Angus bloodlines which don't reflect that trait.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Beats me, just some slang I picked up along the way.

Gotcha...I wonder who came up with that
Don't even make sense.

Limo guys most likely.

 

[Bright Raven]

Beats me, just some slang I picked up along the way.

Gotcha...I wonder who came up with that
Don't even make sense.

Limo guys most likely.

I doubt they coined the term but at least one limo guy used it often.

 

[bigbluegrass]

Quoted from the article: "The smaller cattle averaged 38 to 40 inches (frame score 2.6) at the hip at fall weaning, and the larger cattle averaged 43 to 44 inches (frame score 4.9). The smaller-framed cows were designated as "range" and the moderately framed cows were designated as "beef." Interestingly, the average mature (6 to 8 years of age) weight was 1,295 pounds for the "range" cows and 1,522 pounds for the "beef" cows."

I would consider the "beef" cows in this study to be moderate also. I would have been more interested in a study with the "beef" herd being frame score 6 1800 lb cows.

Everything is based off averages and the study is pretty much is dead on. Only hobby farmers or people who have more money than sense have 1800lb cows.

I think the study has merit and I wasn't intending to take away from that. However, do you know of many commercial cattle operations who seek frame score 3 or lower bulls. What about a frame score 5 or smaller?

 

[callmefence]

You'd think they'd be more worried with what grows along the backbone....
In all seriousness. Does anyone see the advantage in trying to turn the Angus breed into these giant and overweight outlier's. That for the most part are going to be of poorer quality than their smaller counterparts.

I mean we already have large framed heavy muscling cattle to fill this niche.
Where the black Angus has long been known as a moderate framed animal that produces a quality and perfect sized steak. The Angus had reined king of that. I would say if you want to improve on the black Angus. Make him smaller.
With the even better marbling waygu