Local Hereford Influence Sale Results

[Campground Cattle]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

 

[Susie David]

Can't get in on the Hereford deal. Hate to say it but thoes prices are what they have been getting all month up here...black hided get the top dollar and good colored cattle only a few cents less...but the weight ranges and $$ are the same. The buyers seem to be paying more for larger lots of matched weight and score animals...and that's how I see it. Still waiting to buy some 6-7 wts for next year.

 

[Brandonm2]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

 

[Crowderfarms]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

I Disagree. You'd have to give me a more valid reason for Angus.

 

[Campground Cattle]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

I agree it is hard to beat a super baldie cow or one of the old tigers when it comes to a mama cow. Point is black doesn't make it better, good cattle are great and profitable because of great management. A great PR department doesn't replace proper management.

 

[Brandonm2]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

I Disagree. You'd have to give me a more valid reason for Angus.

Reasons to use Angus.....
1) they are the undisputed masters of the quality grade,
2) they come with the most comprehensive and detailed set of EPDs in the beef industry (giving breeders the most possible information to make decisions),
3) they cross well with almost everything,
4) Angus cross calves are plentiful and mixed at the yard your Angus cross calves make for more uniform loads at the feedlots
5) Angus cows typically milk better than Herfs or Limos
6) bring eye pigment to white faced cattle
7) clean up horns
8) sheer numbers give them tremendous genetic diversity in the breed
9) classic Anguses are easy fleshing easy keeping momas (we both know there are exceptions out there in some new cow families)
10) CAB means there is demand for Angus cross calves.

 

[Campground Cattle]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

I Disagree. You'd have to give me a more valid reason for Angus.

Reasons to use Angus.....
1) they are the undisputed masters of the quality grade,
2) they come with the most comprehensive and detailed set of EPDs in the beef industry (giving breeders the most possible information to make decisions),
3) they cross well with almost everything,
4) Angus cross calves are plentiful and mixed at the yard your Angus cross calves make for more uniform loads at the feedlots
5) Angus cows typically milk better than Herfs or Limos
6) bring eye pigment to white faced cattle
7) clean up horns
8) sheer numbers give them tremendous genetic diversity in the breed
9) classic Anguses are easy fleshing easy keeping momas (we both know there are exceptions out there in some new cow families)
10) CAB means there is demand for Angus cross calves.

I could argue the points as no bovine is perfect for every enviroment. But this is what I was talking about if I ever meet an Angus breeder that doesn't sound like a preacher at a creek crossing hollering up a revival would be great.
By the way the British White association hollers the same thing along with most ever other breed.

 

[Crowderfarms]

I'll agree with #3, As far as CAB, I think it's a train wreck waiting to happen. You can acheive a level of excellent "Crossability" with a Hereford too. I have quite a few Black Cattle, but I'm not sold on Angus, and never will be.

 

[TLCfromARK]

"if I ever meet an Angus breeder that doesn't sound like a preacher at a creek crossing hollering up a revival,"


Now that's funny Camp, I don't care who you are. I've got to give you a amen on that one.
;-)

 

[Crowderfarms]

"if I ever meet an Angus breeder that doesn't sound like a preacher at a creek crossing hollering up a revival,"


Now that's funny Camp, I don't care who you are. I've got to give you a amen on that one.
;-)

Friends, and I do mean friends, we are gathered here today at Crowder's Creek to forever debate the Black Breed. It'll all start when the bubbles stop.

 

[la4angus]

I'll agree with #3, As far as CAB, I think it's a train wreck waiting to happen. You can acheive a level of excellent "Crossability" with a Hereford too. I have quite a few Black Cattle, but I'm not sold on Angus, and never will be.

I have to agree with Crowder on CAB, being a train wreck waiting to happen.There is going to come a time when it will take more than a black hide to call a bovine Angus. We are already getting enough static from others that want to see CAB fail, and I expect there will be some law suits to come at us, to prove that black is not Certified Angus.This will not come from our friends the Hereford people but from some of the other breeds that have been brought into the states since the early 60"s, and are trying to capitalize on the Angus's black hide by turning themselves black from the use of Angus in their breeding program and trying to pass themselves off as CAB.

 

[Scotty]

This is what I am talkng about. People rooting for others to fail in the same business.


Scotty

 

[Scotty]

I am also not promoting CAB, just the breed itself. Never claimed it was the only breed to use. I think it is the best for use on cross bred cattle. But if the guilty will admit it, several others on these boards preach their breed. Hereford, Char., Limos. and even the Murry Greys. No one breed will fix all but consitancy and quality will sell more beef. I have had other breeds of bulls and never had any more consitant as far as quality and sale price as Angus. This was all befor I started rasing purebreds. That is what sold me on the breed. Consitancy, quality, and a demand for those type of cattle.



Scotty

 

[rwtherefords]

I expect there will be some law suits to come at us, to prove that black is not Certified Angus.This will not come from our friends the Hereford people

I agree, la4angus!

I didn't start this post to fuel the Hereford vs. Angus debate. My intent was to report that Hereford demand seems to be on the rise in middle TN, as evidenced by the recent sale.

My feelings about CAB being misleading to the consumer has been made known here in the past. I've polled many people that I work with and ask, "If you go to a restaurant that has a sign stating that they serve Certified Angus Beef, what percent of Angus do you think the animal your steak came from is required to be Angus?" They have all said they expect it to be 100% pure Angus. They're amazed when they find out that, technically, it isn't required to have any Angus. Just having a black hide and grading choice or better isn't Angus in their mind. Even 50% Angus isn't Angus in their minds.

I'm all for programs which enhance the demand for quality beef, but I think CAB, CHB, Hereford Verified, etc. better be careful not to create an illusion of something they're not. The backlash could be very negative. I think that if you're going to certify that something is Angus, it better be 100% Angus, and if your going to certify that something is Hereford, it better be 100% Hereford. Otherwise, sell it as Angus influenced, or Hereford influenced with a percentage not to be less than 50%.

 

[Scotty]

I expect there will be some law suits to come at us, to prove that black is not Certified Angus.This will not come from our friends the Hereford people

I agree, la4angus!

I didn't start this post to fuel the Hereford vs. Angus debate. My intent was to report that Hereford demand seems to be on the rise in middle TN, as evidenced by the recent sale.

My feelings about CAB being misleading to the consumer has been made known here in the past. I've polled many people that I work with and ask, "If you go to a restaurant that has a sign stating that they serve Certified Angus Beef, what percent of Angus do you think the animal your steak came from is required to be Angus?" They have all said they expect it to be 100% pure Angus. They're amazed when they find out that, technically, it isn't required to have any Angus. Just having a black hide and grading choice or better isn't Angus in their mind. Even 50% Angus isn't Angus in their minds.

I'm all for programs which enhance the demand for quality beef, but I think CAB, CHB, Hereford Verified, etc. better be careful not to create an illusion of something they're not. The backlash could be very negative. I think that if you're going to certify that something is Angus, it better be 100% Angus, and if your going to certify that something is Hereford, it better be 100% Hereford. Otherwise, sell it as Angus influenced, or Hereford influenced with a percentage not to be less than 50%.

I can live with this. Sorry to take way from your original post.



Scotty

 

[Frankie]

I agree, la4angus!

I didn't start this post to fuel the Hereford vs. Angus debate. My intent was to report that Hereford demand seems to be on the rise in middle TN, as evidenced by the recent sale.

My feelings about CAB being misleading to the consumer has been made known here in the past. I've polled many people that I work with and ask, "If you go to a restaurant that has a sign stating that they serve Certified Angus Beef, what percent of Angus do you think the animal your steak came from is required to be Angus?" They have all said they expect it to be 100% pure Angus. They're amazed when they find out that, technically, it isn't required to have any Angus. Just having a black hide and grading choice or better isn't Angus in their mind. Even 50% Angus isn't Angus in their minds.

Do you hold CHB to the same standard? The Phenotype
requirement for CHB is much the same as CAB. They have to look like Herefords.

http://www.ams.usda.gov/lsg/certprog/sc ... laspec.htm

I'm all for programs which enhance the demand for quality beef, but I think CAB, CHB, Hereford Verified, etc. better be careful not to create an illusion of something they're not. The backlash could be very negative. I think that if you're going to certify that something is Angus, it better be 100% Angus, and if your going to certify that something is Hereford, it better be 100% Hereford. Otherwise, sell it as Angus influenced, or Hereford influenced with a percentage not to be less than 50%.

CAB has been on the market for about 30 years and demand continues to grow. I think you're wrong to suggest that consumers don't know what they're getting when they plunk down the extra $$ for CAB.

 

[Frankie]

I'll agree with #3, As far as CAB, I think it's a train wreck waiting to happen. You can acheive a level of excellent "Crossability" with a Hereford too. I have quite a few Black Cattle, but I'm not sold on Angus, and never will be.

I have to agree with Crowder on CAB, being a train wreck waiting to happen.There is going to come a time when it will take more than a black hide to call a bovine Angus. We are already getting enough static from others that want to see CAB fail, and I expect there will be some law suits to come at us, to prove that black is not Certified Angus.This will not come from our friends the Hereford people but from some of the other breeds that have been brought into the states since the early 60"s, and are trying to capitalize on the Angus's black hide by turning themselves black from the use of Angus in their breeding program and trying to pass themselves off as CAB.

I don't think CAB is a train wreck waiting to happen. What grounds would someone have to sue? The USDA approved specifications are being met and that's the legal description of CAB. Would you sue Ford because some parts in your truck aren't made in a Ford plant?

CAB has been around for about 30 years. CHB jumped into the branded beef field using basically the same phenotype requirements as CAB: they have to look like Herefords.

I think when we get a national ID program in place, there will eventually be some sort of requirement for Angus in CAB.

No one I know who buys CAB seems to be bothered by the fact it's not 50% or 100% Angus. They're willing to pay for the quality they get.

 

[Frankie]

Its not the Angus cattle it's the Angus breeders that think Angus is the solution for everything. Thank goodness the beef industry has not followed all the Angus hype or it would be as screwed up as the dairy gene pool.
Angus have there place just not in every herd.

I think Angus (red or black) could be and maybe should be used in every commercial herd in this country; but I don't think that should be the ONLY genetics in a commercial herd. Unless you are in the business of selling replacement females, I don't think most commercial herds are well served by straightbreeding (Angus, Herf, Limousin, Charolais, Simmental, Brahman, etc). The crossbred mama cow (if some thought has gone in to her genetics) will outwork and outproduce straightbred mamas of the same frame under the same management conditions year after year.

I Disagree. You'd have to give me a more valid reason for Angus.

Reasons to use Angus.....
1) they are the undisputed masters of the quality grade,
2) they come with the most comprehensive and detailed set of EPDs in the beef industry (giving breeders the most possible information to make decisions),
3) they cross well with almost everything,
4) Angus cross calves are plentiful and mixed at the yard your Angus cross calves make for more uniform loads at the feedlots
5) Angus cows typically milk better than Herfs or Limos
6) bring eye pigment to white faced cattle
7) clean up horns
8) sheer numbers give them tremendous genetic diversity in the breed
9) classic Anguses are easy fleshing easy keeping momas (we both know there are exceptions out there in some new cow families)
10) CAB means there is demand for Angus cross calves.

An impressive list. Can I use it in other discussions?

 

[Campground Cattle]

I expect there will be some law suits to come at us, to prove that black is not Certified Angus.This will not come from our friends the Hereford people

I agree, la4angus!

I didn't start this post to fuel the Hereford vs. Angus debate. My intent was to report that Hereford demand seems to be on the rise in middle TN, as evidenced by the recent sale.

My feelings about CAB being misleading to the consumer has been made known here in the past. I've polled many people that I work with and ask, "If you go to a restaurant that has a sign stating that they serve Certified Angus Beef, what percent of Angus do you think the animal your steak came from is required to be Angus?" They have all said they expect it to be 100% pure Angus. They're amazed when they find out that, technically, it isn't required to have any Angus. Just having a black hide and grading choice or better isn't Angus in their mind. Even 50% Angus isn't Angus in their minds.

I'm all for programs which enhance the demand for quality beef, but I think CAB, CHB, Hereford Verified, etc. better be careful not to create an illusion of something they're not. The backlash could be very negative. I think that if you're going to certify that something is Angus, it better be 100% Angus, and if your going to certify that something is Hereford, it better be 100% Hereford. Otherwise, sell it as Angus influenced, or Hereford influenced with a percentage not to be less than 50%.

I can live with this. Sorry to take way from your original post.



Scotty

Scotty I have nothing against any breed you should raise what is most profitable to your operation. I personally don't like contentials thats like the little boy that kissed the calf in the butt everyone to their own taste.

 

[memanpa]

you put 5 steaks from like QUALITY animals on a plate hot off the grill i would be willing to bet $100 there are not 10 people in 1000 that could idenitify the color of the animal the steaks came from!!! or the sex of the animal either!!!!! by taste alone!!!!