Cow Size

[CKC1586]

In our area I like a larger frame cow, keeps the groceries up out of the mud and snow.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

This discussion, as it seems that are most of them lately, is beginning to to become specious, and missing the purpose of attempting to moderate the SIZE of our NATIONAL cow herd. Individual BREED differentials will always be cogent in intelligent debate, but let's not digress into just 'barn blind' argument!

DOC HARRIS

 

[dun]

This discussion, as it seems that are most of them lately, is beginning to to become specious, and missing the purpose of attempting to moderate the SIZE of our NATIONAL cow herd. Individual BREED differentials will always be cogent in intelligent debate, but let's not digress into just 'barn blind' argument!

DOC HARRIS

It's not barn blind to realize that "one size does not fit all"! The ideal cow in the desert is totally differnt then the ideal cow on irrigated pasture which is different then the cow for open range.

 

[backhoeboogie]

This discussion, as it seems that are most of them lately, is beginning to to become specious, and missing the purpose of attempting to moderate the SIZE of our NATIONAL cow herd. Individual BREED differentials will always be cogent in intelligent debate, but let's not digress into just 'barn blind' argument!

DOC HARRIS

It's not barn blind to realize that "one size does not fit all"! The ideal cow in the desert is totally differnt then the ideal cow on irrigated pasture which is different then the cow for open range.

Shucks Dun, best deal for me was a cow no one wanted. She came cheap and heavy bred. Short legged but thick. About 1100 lbs average weight. Best eating calves of the bunch too. If she has a bull calf, he gets steered and goes into my freezer. Never a problem. I almost passed on her. Glad I took her.

 

[TxStateCowboy]

I raise longhorns and my average cow weight is probably around 900-1000lbs.

Some benefits in my case:
-Don't have to feed so much hay during winter. (1 bale to every 3 that the beefmaster/hereford/limo herd gets, and same # of head)

-They graze a pasture year-round, whereas the fatties need to be moved every few weeks or so. I believe the longhorns are probably around 50% more efficient in food/energy needs than the average 1200-1600lb cow.

-I like lean beef.

They work for me!

If you could get you long horns up to 1200 to 1600lbs I dont think your numbers would look so great. If I remeber horns are still hard to eat. At least their calves are small. I dont see much use for long horns out side of wall hangers and yard orniments. Just kidding, it just came out easy. Most evey breed has ups and downs; you just have to talk to the write or wrong person. Let me ask you a question though. A contractor is doing some concrete at my parents place. Not to far from my bull pen. He brags up and down about his long horns. He's got the market because no one raises them around here. He looks at my bulls and says "do you cut their sacks when they hang like that". I thought he was joking; he says "If my bulls have baggy sacks we cut'em. Long horns aren't supposed to have baggy sacks." All I could think is he's crazy; and he must not have too many bulls. He still has to finish the job so I don't talk to him to much. Well is he crazy?

I don't think Longhorn bulls naturally have low-hanging sacks- they evolved a tight underside(wouldn't you if you walked across stickers and cactus all day for 400 years?), but I wouldn't cut any other breed because they did. He needs to diversify his knowledge of cattle .

He sounds like one of those fellas that raise longhorns to compare the size of his..horns. They usually don't know much about other kinds of cattle or cattle in general, just their high$ pets.

 

[dun]

This discussion, as it seems that are most of them lately, is beginning to to become specious, and missing the purpose of attempting to moderate the SIZE of our NATIONAL cow herd. Individual BREED differentials will always be cogent in intelligent debate, but let's not digress into just 'barn blind' argument!

DOC HARRIS

It's not barn blind to realize that "one size does not fit all"! The ideal cow in the desert is totally differnt then the ideal cow on irrigated pasture which is different then the cow for open range.

Shucks Dun, best deal for me was a cow no one wanted. She came cheap and heavy bred. Short legged but thick. About 1100 lbs average weight. Best eating calves of the bunch too. If she has a bull calf, he gets steered and goes into my freezer. Never a problem. I almost passed on her. Glad I took her.

Ol Granny was/is that way. FS 4.5 maybe a short 5, weighed 1450 lbs. Folks don;t care for her steers because they;re not framey enough, but they sure do like her daughters. Now at 17/18 she's bony and only weighs 1250.

 

[Joy in Texas]

As far as, my beefmasters go,I have all colors and sizes.The majority of our cows weigh between 1200-1600 lbs. I do have several that weigh over 2000 lbs. I keep all of my heifers out of the heaviest cows. Most of the time they do not weigh as much as the cows. But they have a good frame and structure to them.

 

[BRG]

I think you need to take it a step further. Samller cows will also have lighter calves at weaning. We all know this, and yes, lighter calves ussually bring more $/cwt than heavier ones, but... Take a look at the same weight class of cattle when they sell, if you have a load of 450 lbs steers that are out of 1200 lbs cows or less, you will see that these calves are smaller in frame and ussually a bit more fleshy, shorter in length, and finer boned compared to a 450 lbs calf out of a heavier cow. (In most cases these 450 lbs calves are the younger batch out of a larger group of calves.) This group will stand up taller, be a bit greener, and have more muscle potential and because of this, they will out sell the first group by a minimum of $10/cwt owhich is $45/calf or $5000 for a 50,000 lbs semi load, which is how most cattle up here sell. To me that is huge and I think that is what should be produced. Now I am not saying that everyone needs 1500 lbs or heavier cows. But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

 

[KNERSIE]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

That just about settles this debate.

 

[Jovid]

I think you need to take it a step further. Samller cows will also have lighter calves at weaning. We all know this, and yes, lighter calves ussually bring more $/cwt than heavier ones, but... Take a look at the same weight class of cattle when they sell, if you have a load of 450 lbs steers that are out of 1200 lbs cows or less, you will see that these calves are smaller in frame and ussually a bit more fleshy, shorter in length, and finer boned compared to a 450 lbs calf out of a heavier cow. (In most cases these 450 lbs calves are the younger batch out of a larger group of calves.) This group will stand up taller, be a bit greener, and have more muscle potential and because of this, they will out sell the first group by a minimum of $10/cwt owhich is $45/calf or $5000 for a 50,000 lbs semi load, which is how most cattle up here sell. To me that is huge and I think that is what should be produced. Now I am not saying that everyone needs 1500 lbs or heavier cows. But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

Our 1200 lb cows wean 650 lb calves. Could be because our cows are Red Polls.

 

[BRG]

450 lbs was just an example. Guys in our area pretty much wean and sell in October or ealy November whether they are April or February born. Some use creep and some do not. Some have good water and grass, while others don't. So you can't compare ones weights to another. But you can compare type/style of animal.

 

[SEC]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

That just about settles this debate.

That is the exact truth

 

[Badlands]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

 

[BRG]

Not true, you can do both.

Would love to stay and argue, but I gotta leave, to do the Schmitz Sale.

 

[MikeC]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

Solution: Small cows + Big bulls for feeder calves.
Small bulls for replacements.

 

[dun]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

Solution: Small cows + Big bulls for feeder calves.
Small bulls for replacements.

Gee, kind of a rotational crossbreeding system. What a concept!

 

[MikeC]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

Solution: Small cows + Big bulls for feeder calves.
Small bulls for replacements.

Gee, kind of a rotational crossbreeding system. What a concept!

Glad you like it Dun. I cannot take credit for the idea though. It's been around for many moons. :lol:

 

[dun]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

Solution: Small cows + Big bulls for feeder calves.
Small bulls for replacements.

Gee, kind of a rotational crossbreeding system. What a concept!

Glad you like it Dun. I cannot take credit for the idea though. It's been around for many moons. :lol:

Really?

 

[Wisteria Farms]

But produce what your enviroment and calf buyer tells you to produce.

This arrangement has favored the calf buyer for the last 30+ years, resulting in increased mature cow weights. The statement is wrong in action, correct in theory. The "calf buyer" part of the statement completely overshadows the "environment" part of the statement as it has been applied for the last number of years.

Badlands

Solution: Small cows + Big bulls for feeder calves.
Small bulls for replacements.

Am I missing something sarcastic here? Small cows + Big bulls... arent you setting yourself up for a nightmare come calving time?

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

No. If you have smaller frame mature cows, you can easily breed them to larger frame, growthy type bulls.