Aubrac cattle breed

[Aubracusa]

Gus --

I agree with you. But how much growth can the industry sustain if corn inventories -- as we've seen very clearly -- continue to be shifted toward other uses?

The other side of the coin is that we've been very slow in finding ways to add value to what we produce.

We're in such a traditional, commodity mindset that we've refused to identify opportunities in the marketplace to differentiate ourselves, our products and our genetics as a way of adding value to what we produce.

Continental cattle breeders can't move quick enough to convert everything they produce into black-hided animals. In doing so, they lose key opportunities not only to manage their genetics more effectively, but also to differentiate themselves in a marketplace that's already saturated with Angus-branded products.

I don't know about you, but there aint much more room for me and my neighbors to reduce costs around here. If it hadn't been for appreciating land values, most people I know would have been out of business five years ago.

It's time we do something different.

 

[OK Jeanne]

Hi, Mike and Wewild --


Hi, OK Jeanne --

There has been some tendernesss work done on some of these cattle. I will check with the individual breeders and email it your way when I get the okay to send it.

aubracusa

A good way to share the tenderness test results is to
scan the report page, then put it in the photo gallery,
and then paste in the image into your message. The
owners of the animals tested must not have allowed
Bovigen to post the results into the "public results"
section---there's no such breed listed there. If they
have good results(i.e. a 6 star rating) they are missing
a good advertising route if they do not allow public
posting of the results.

 

[Aubracusa]

Del and Gus --

Thank you for the support, but I suspect MikeC is long gone.

Having an intelligent conversation with guys like Mike is a lot like "running the Atlantic" in a Liberty boat.

Just when you least expect it, he rises from the murky depths to try and try and torpedo your ship.

But just like last night, when things got too hot in his kitchen, he couldn't cut and run fast enough.

aubracusa

 

[Aubracusa]

Hi, OK Jeanne --

Thanks for the tip.

Best regards,

aubracusa

 

[Gus]

Gus --

I agree with you. But how much growth can the industry sustain if corn inventories -- as we've seen very clearly -- continue to be shifted toward other uses?

The other side of the coin is that we've been very slow in finding ways to add value to what we produce.

We're in such a traditional, commodity mindset that we've refused to identify opportunities in the marketplace to differentiate ourselves, our products and our genetics as a way of adding value to what we produce.

Continental cattle breeders can't move quick enough to convert everything they produce into black-hided animals. In doing so, they lose key opportunities not only to manage their genetics more effectively, but also to differentiate themselves in a marketplace that's already saturated with Angus-branded products.

I don't know about you, but there aint much more room for me and my neighbors to reduce costs around here. If it hadn't been for appreciating land values, most people I know would have been out of business five years ago.

It's time we do something different.

Aubrac,

I agree totally. The good producers have done all the things needed to become low cost producers and will continue to adjust as the "rules of the game" change. The rules now become grass land values relative to feed grain prices. Up until now I could dry lot cows and feed them during summer grazing months rather than to rent grass. A cow/calf unit was costing $30-35 dollars per month for a 5.5 month season. Along with this cost you had trucking and gas money to sometimes travel long distances to check cattle. I could dry lot them cheaper with cheap grain. Now one is going to have to refigure with both land and roughage as well as grains being high. Those close to ethanol plants who can utilize DG have a huge advantage over those who are not.

Gus

 

[Gus]

Gus --

I agree with you. But how much growth can the industry sustain if corn inventories -- as we've seen very clearly -- continue to be shifted toward other uses?

The other side of the coin is that we've been very slow in finding ways to add value to what we produce.

We're in such a traditional, commodity mindset that we've refused to identify opportunities in the marketplace to differentiate ourselves, our products and our genetics as a way of adding value to what we produce.

Continental cattle breeders can't move quick enough to convert everything they produce into black-hided animals. In doing so, they lose key opportunities not only to manage their genetics more effectively, but also to differentiate themselves in a marketplace that's already saturated with Angus-branded products.

I don't know about you, but there aint much more room for me and my neighbors to reduce costs around here. If it hadn't been for appreciating land values, most people I know would have been out of business five years ago.

It's time we do something different.

Aubrac,

I agree totally. The good producers have done all the things needed to become low cost producers and will continue to adjust as the "rules of the game" change. The rules now become grass land values relative to feed grain prices. Up until now I could dry lot cows and feed them during summer grazing months rather than to rent grass. A cow/calf unit was costing $30-35 dollars per month for a 5.5 month season. Along with this cost you had trucking and gas money to sometimes travel long distances to check cattle. I could dry lot them cheaper with cheap grain. Now one is going to have to refigure with both land and roughage as well as grains being high. Those close to ethanol plants who can utilize DG have a huge advantage over those who are not.

Gus

Concerning the black hided race....it was and continues to be driven for non economic reasons. There are value added programs now other than CAB to market into. Net economic return will control cow size relative to feed cost for those with good business records. For those who will not calcuate returns relative to cost....they won't be in business long enough to worry about.

Gus

Gus

 

[Brandonm2]

The claim has been made in this string that Aubracs somehow convert forage into beef more efficiently than other breeds of cattle and that the Aubrac female will produce more pounds of beef per pound of cow when raised on forage. Some have asked for evidence too back up those claims. What breeds has Aubrac been tested against? How was this efficiency measured? Where were the other breeds obtained? And most importantly who was running this test and what are their credentials?

If Aubrac REALLY is a superior forage convertor proving it should be relatively easy.....though perhaps not as easy as claiming it to be so.

 

[la4angus]

If Aubrac REALLY is a superior forage convertor proving it should be relatively easy.....though perhaps not as easy as claiming it to be so.

Brandom; You know you are right in this statement. I for one also would like to see this evidence. Mr Aubracusa sould you please post this info.

 

[MikeC]

Having an intelligent conversation with guys like Mike is a lot like "running the Atlantic" in a Liberty boat.

Just when you least expect it, he rises from the murky depths to try and try and torpedo your ship.

But just like last night, when things got too hot in his kitchen, he couldn't cut and run fast enough.

aubracusa

Just to set the record straight. You won't see me runnin' Bubba.

Just show us something that will help us believe that these cattle can convert forage better and produce 33% more beef from the same resources and I'll quit badgering you.

Up til now you're all snake oil.

Carcass data. Bull test results. Feedlot data. Anything at all is a lot better than a bunch of blowing.

Come on Bubba, step up to plate.

I will be at the Bull test station in Marianna, Fl. in a few days, and I will be sure to get the latest scoop from Dr. Gary Hansen on your claims.

C'mon let's see what you got.

 

[Aubracusa]

Good morning, everyone.

Glad to see such vigorous interest in the breed.

Increased production is derived from several different sources: health, fertility, smaller mature size, which requires significantly less feed, without sacrificing weaning weights.

On health, we posted information from a multi-breed test from the University of Minnesota in which Aubracs had the lowest sickness and deathloss.

On increased production from existing resources, I believe Del has sufficiently explained his position -- and why he expects to increase his production by a third through the introduction of Aubrac genetics. Having visited his operation - and spent many days viewing his cow herd -- I believe he has no reason to fabricate some fictitious number for you to criticize.

On carcass, an article was posted earlier showing the carcass traits of a group of Aubrac fed cattle slaughtered in Minnesota this fall.

Our organization is sponsoring a roughage-based bull test this winter, and we will have substantial gain and conversion data derived from that effort.

Best,

Aubracusa

 

[MikeC]

Breed information



Geographical - historical info

The development of the Aubrac breed started during the 17th century at the Benedictine Abbey of Aubrac, situated on the mountain of the same name, in the bordering area of the departments of Aveyron and Lozère. (...) Selective breeding was promoted by the government between 1840-80. In order to improve these cattle imported British Durham (Shorthorn), Highland and Devon sires were used, but more important was the use of Swiss Brown blood. In 1982 the first herdbook for Aubrac cattle were established, followed by a breed society in 1914. The breed gradually absorbed several closely related breeds and strains, such as:

- The Gévaudan

- The Cevennes

- The Mézenc.



After World War II the Aubrac started to diminish in numbers and in 1976 a conservation programme was started by the government. In 1979, 20% of the breed - consisting of 80,000 cows - were found to be infected with brucellosis, which caused a further decline. In 1992 the Aubrac had 29,400 registered breeding cows, out of a total of about 60,000 female stock, bred in the departments Aveyron, Cantal, Lozère and Haute-Loîre.



Morphological info

Transformed from a triple-purpose breed into a sturdy beef breed, the Aubrac cow averages 130 cm at the withers and weighs 580 kg. The bull stands 140 cm and weighs 825 kg. These cattle are of the same coloration as the Parthenais, and show the same outward growing, lyre-shaped horns as the Salers. Cows today are frequently used as sucklers for F1 Charolais crosses. They are noted for their specific ease in calving and a well-developed maternal instinct. On average eight calves are produced per cow and the average culling age is 11 years.



Source: Marleen Felius, Cattle breeds - an encyclopedia, Doetinchem, Netherlands : Misset, 1995

http://www.tiho-hannover.de/einricht/zu ... s/c5_1.htm

 

[Aubracusa]

Hi, Mike --

Thanks for your posting.

Your information is good, but I'd like to add a few things to it.

Since the late 1970s, the French breed also underwent a significant breed-improvement effort sponsored by its association, Union Aubrac.

A large part of this effort was increased control by the association over the genetic selection and general direction of the breed.

I posted earlier their selection scheme through which they identify the best young bulls (roughly 2500, based on phenotype and maternal performance of dams, granddams, etc.) in the breed, and place the very best of these calves (roughly 150 head) on a forage-based test through the winter. The bottom 50% are slaughtered, the top (roughly) 50% are sold back to the breeders themselves, and the very top two or three animals are used in progeny testing. If these elite bulls clear the progeny testing hurdle, they are then approved for artificial insemination, and used on a widespread basis both in France and abroad.

At this test, we routinely see yearling bulls weighing 1100 pounds plus at a year of age on a ration that has very little grain. (I can get the precise ration for you later).

The unified selection system has also resulted in a great deal of uniformity from herd to herd, and the cattle also have superb structural soundness, since association technicians are very involved in helping producers select sires to use on their cow herds.

A great deal of the commercial Aubrac cows in the region are bred to extremely heavily muscled Charolais bulls. Most of these Charolais bulls are double-muscled, possessing some of the most extreme muscle pattern I've ever seen in any cattle of any breed anywhere. The bulk of the bull calves are purchased by Italian cattle feeders and shipped from the mountains of France to the Po Valley, one of Italy's primary grain-growing regions.

Many of the halfblood and fullblood heifers are kept by French breeders and used to produce Fleur d'Aubrac (Flower of Aubrac), a primarily grass-fed beef product. These heifers are slaughtered at 22 to 24 months of age, and the beef product they use is available on a seasonal basis -- something that creates an artificial "run" on the product when it's comes to the marketplace. Another branded Aubrac product is called Beouf Fermier d'Aubrac, which recently received the designation "Label Rouge" for its outstanding quality.

Since the information you submitted was written, the Aubrac breed has enjoyed substantial growth. In fact, since I first began investigating the breed in the early 1990s, I believe Aubrac numbers have doubled in France. We routinely see breeders from Ireland, Germany, England, Bulgaria and Russia who in the Aubrac region. Many of them are repopulating their herds following BSE and FMD, and have chosen Aubracs to do it with.

Because of Europe's heightened environmental concerns (when compared to America), the emphasis on forage-based beef production is much greater there than it is here. There are also much more stringent regulations governing the production of beef, particularly in Germany, and producers there have been pressured to find alternatives to the traditional, more grain-dependent breeds they once used.

I was with the director of Union Aubrac several years ago after he was involved with the exportation of several hundred Aubrac heifers to a former collective "Soviet" farm in Siberia. Management was terrible to non-existent. Facilities were rundown. No one there took any leadership in ensuring the cattle were fed or cared for. When my friend returned a year later to see the results, the majority of the Aubrac heifers had survived, while most of the other breeds exported there had great difficulties with deathloss and disease.

A direct result of this is that Aubracs are now among Europe's fastest-growing beef breeds. We see herds of Aubrac cattle across France, where we used to never see them at all.

Thanks,

Aubracusa

 

[Aubracusa]

MikeC, check your inbox.

THanks,

Aubracusa

 

[wsrutherford]

Do they work on KY-31 Fescue:?:

 

[Aubracusa]

Hello, WSrutherford --

We have a breeder in northcentral Missouri who has been raising Aubrac cattle successfully there for over a decade. I don't know what strain of fescue he has on his farm, but I know it's something he has to manage. I will contact him today, and see if I can provide you with a more specific answer.

Thanks for your interest,

aubracusa

 

[Frankie]

For those who will not calcuate returns relative to cost....they won't be in business long enough to worry about.

Gus

Gus

I'd disagree with this one. In my area, most small producers probably don't have a clue if they're profitable or not. They have some land, they like to mess with cows. They benefit from tax breaks. They'll keep on doing what they're doing as long as they're able. They're not especially interested in joining any organization that requires them to use specific breeds, background calves, give vaccinations. They switched to a black bull because black calves usually bring more than similar calves of another color at the sale barns.

 

[Crystalized]

Hello from Montana,

There is no information on the web that I have not studied when it comes to Aubrac Cattle. The hannover website also states that Aubrac cattle have natural resistance to Trypanosoma(parasite infestation). This is referenced in other sites as well, we have not as of yet been able to support this claim with documentation. Another reason for working with U of F. CSIRO has identified this charatoristic at the top of there research priority list. When you talk about efficiency on grass...world beef production....this is "big". We(AubracInt) are confident that our research efforts will document this trait.
Like it or not.
The main reason that I stuck my neck out back in 1995 when purchasing 120 units of Aubrac semen was that we had a target for production. How else can the Beef industry any efficiencies when we don't know were we are going. The Aubrac breed standard has been clear for many years and so has mine.
Thanks for all your comments

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Ladies and Gentlemen-

I have perused the posts on the Aubrac Cattle Breed for the last several days (and nights!) and find it interesting that pessimism, cynicism, sarcasm and - yes - even rudeness seem to be the 'talking points' of the moment.

Aubracusa has responded to each one of these acerbic commentaries in an intelligent, friendly, non-competitive manner, attempting to inform ALL of us as completely as he can within the purview of his authority, given his responsibility to the Aubrac Breeders involved in this under-taking, which is an on-going work in progress.

In My Opinion - we should ALL be grateful that this subject has been presented in an unbiased attitude, and has not regressed into a contentious battle involving quarraling, insults, and ultimately turning into a knock-down-and-drag-out fight embracing egotism and arrogance! Aubracusa has approached each of us with dignified courtesy, respect and politeness without ONE SINGLE remark which would belittle or disparage ANY other breed of cattle OR their enthusiasts or breeder's.

I feel that the very least we can do is to respond in kind, and return his efforts in like manner! After all, isn't this what the CattleToday and ranchers.net Forum's are all about in the first place? If not - I have been contributing to the wrong group of people here!

Thank you for your consideration!

DOC HARRIS

 

[Aubracusa]

Thanks so much for your letter, Doc.

I am new to the CattleToday.com Q&A boards, but I realized soon enough that you are respected by all, and that your reputation carries a great deal of weight within the cattle industry.

Your support of a constructive and positive dialogue about Aubracs and the future of the cattle business is greatly appreciated.

Best regards,

Aubracusa

 

[Aubracusa]

Hello, All --

Below is an information that we developed several years ago about Aubrac cattle. It contains general and some specific information about the breed, and I hope it answers some of the specific questions that have been raised during our conversation.

History and Genetic Base. The French Aubrac herdbook was organized in 1894, but the breed had informally established itself hundreds of years earlier in this remote region of France. The breed currently has over 35,000 active cows (this is much larger today) and has recently enjoyed rapid growth at the expense of other French breeds. An additional 70,000 Aubrac cows (this number has increased substantially as well) are found in commercial herds, crossed primarily with Charolais bulls for a branded beef product line.

The breed organization administers an aggressive, but balanced performance program. The historical breed goal has been simple, "one calf, per cow, per year", which has resulted in cows that match an all-forage production environment.

A breed-sponsored bull test pull the top bulls to a central test station each year. An all-forage test identifies the bulls that best combine the breed's traits with a desirable level of growth performance. The top bulls from this test are the only bulls allowed to be used through artificial insemination.

Maternal Traits. French breed research confirms that the Aubrac breed ranks first in age at first calving, have the shortest calving interval, and the greatest longevity of all the French breeds. Maternal calving ease is a breed strength and Aubrac cows have the highest percentage of unassisted calvings.

Calving Ease. The breed average birth weight for fullbloods in France is currently 86 lb. for bulls and 79 lb. for heifer calves. Cattlemen in the United States have experienced birth weights in the high 70's to mid 90's for halfblood Aubrac calves, with very little calving difficulty.

Milking Ability. As is the case with many European breeds, the Aubrac have a multi-purpose history of draft, milk and meat production. Milk production appears to be slightly higher than Angus cattle in this country. Aubrac cows have excellent udder capacity, attachment and teat size.

Mature Size. Aubrac cattle will measure a frame 5 or 6 on the U.S. system. Mature bulls range from 1875 to 2475 lb. according to French data. At a recent National Show in France, 36 mature bulls (4 to 11 years old) averaged 2217 lb. Production environment has a big influence on mature cow size, and we anticipate that Aubrac and Aubrac cross cows will impress cattle producers with their efficiency and production. Aubrac cows possess depth, capacity and fleshing ability, another product of their developmental environment.

Growth. Cattlemen often equate smaller mature size with reduced performance, but this is not the case with Aubrac cattle. Although it is rare to see creep feeders in the Aubrac region, producers consistently wean 600+ lb. calves. The 114 bulls that entered a recent French bull test averaged 759 lb. at an age of 269 days.

:idea: During the test the bulls received grass hay with protein, mineral and vitamin supplementation, but NO GRAIN. Bulls consistently weighed 1000 lb. at 365 days of age, and the average weight at the end of the test was 1129 lb. :idea:

Beef producers who have used Aubrac semen are impressed with the weaning weights of their calf crop. Preliminary bull development tests in the U.S. and feedlot performance of steers indicate rapid gains with the ability to flesh and finish at desirable weights.

Puberty. Earlier continental imports frequently had delayed puberty and smaller testicle development in yearling bulls. French Aubrac breeders have not historically concerned themselves with this trait; nonetheless, estrous in weaned heifers has been witnessed by North American cattlemen visiting Aubrac herds. The Aubrac Alliance provided the French herdbook with a scrotal tape and asked that the bulls be measured in the test. The 114 bull calves averaged 30.1cm on the "on-test" weigh day at an average age of 297 days and 36.5 cm at the conclusion of the test (14 months of age). Midatest, the AI cooperative, reports the Aubrac bulls consistently produce high-quality semen.

Structural Correctness. Aubrac cattle are produced in more extensive production environments and in much larger herds than most of the European breeds. Selection for functional traits has resulted in correct, good-footed cattle that can navigate their terrain. Longevity records support the soundness and trouble-free characteristics of the breed.
Muscling and Carcass Quality. Astute livestock breeders have long recognized that "form follows function", and this is evident in the Aubrac population.

Emphasis on maternal traits has prevented Aubrac breeders from pursuing the extremes in muscle development that are characteristic of some breeds.

The U.S. beef grading system necessitates a compromise between retail yield and muscle quality traits. While selection for muscle increases retail yield and reduces fat trim, there is also a strong tendency toward reduced marbling in heavily muscled cattle. On the other hand most of the high marbling breeds have lower muscle scores and excess outside fat cover. Preliminary carcass data on Aubrac crosses indicate that they are superior to high-percentage Angus cattle in muscle score without sacrificing the ability to attain the Choice grade and even the "upper two-thirds" of the Choice grade that is so popular with many branded product labels. Aubrac genetics will contribute to more profits for progressive producers marketing cattle on the grids that pay premiums for quality cattle.

Best,

aubracusa