Would you use this bull sired by a bull from Frei Angus?

[CattleMan1920]

Branded: I've seen the bulls Stone Gate has used and it's not towards my liking, as if my opinion matters. The bulls they have trumpeted aren't my thing.

Hence my reason for AI.

They do however produce what 90% of the Angus buyers in Kentucky are looking for. I'm pretty confident of the percentage I used as well.

 

[True Grit Farms]

Branded: I've seen the bulls Stone Gate has used and it's not towards my liking, as if my opinion matters. The bulls they have trumpeted aren't my thing.

Hence my reason for AI.

They do however produce what 90% of the Angus buyers in Kentucky are looking for. I'm pretty confident of the percentage I used as well.

Ya'll know way more than I do about DNA and EPD'S. But that 3870 bull might be passing his best genes to his offspring. I'd believe more off what I see than what I hear. Is that a $2k bull Branded?

 

[CattleMan1920]

Branded: I've seen the bulls Stone Gate has used and it's not towards my liking, as if my opinion matters. The bulls they have trumpeted aren't my thing.

Hence my reason for AI.

They do however produce what 90% of the Angus buyers in Kentucky are looking for. I'm pretty confident of the percentage I used as well.

Ya'll know way more than I do about DNA and EPD'S. But that 3870 bull might be passing his best genes to his offspring. I'd believe more off what I see than what I hear. Is that a $2k bull Branded?

He won't be sold for $2k, but less than the $6k his half brother sold for.

 

[True Grit Farms]

Hence my reason for AI.

They do however produce what 90% of the Angus buyers in Kentucky are looking for. I'm pretty confident of the percentage I used as well.

Ya'll know way more than I do about DNA and EPD'S. But that 3870 bull might be passing his best genes to his offspring. I'd believe more off what I see than what I hear. Is that a $2k bull Branded?

He won't be sold for $2k, but less than the $6k his half brother sold for.

Well if no one wants him, I do before you send him off as hamburger. He's the type of bull that would probably work for us. I'll even pick him up, and pay with cash.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Ya'll know way more than I do about DNA and EPD'S. But that 3870 bull might be passing his best genes to his offspring. I'd believe more off what I see than what I hear. Is that a $2k bull Branded?

He won't be sold for $2k, but less than the $6k his half brother sold for.

Well if no one wants him, I do before you send him off as hamburger. He's the type of bull that would probably work for us. I'll even pick him up, and pay with cash.

We will be in touch. He's definitely potent, and efficient, and slick, which would work well in your environment.

 

[Allenw]

If he is some thing you really want to sample I would have him collected before selling or sell with the right to collect him later.

 

[CattleMan1920]

I didn't see a registration number for your bull.....but he looks good, I don't think he's over conditioned, he is conditioned, but he's obviously got enough forage to work with. And 697 at weaning, no creep, that is perfectly fine. I think we see some of these outlandish numbers (SAV) and start thinking those are the norm, they aren't.

AAA # 18878494

I thought I was the only one who had EPD nightmares. Honestly I don't know how to feel about this one, I like him, really like his dam, don't like his sire in any way, shape or form, EPD's are a disaster and his parents are newer models so his EPD's should be better than that. If I bought him from you, it's only for his mama and it appears her genetics are strong. He would be like New Day for me, I would keep every heifer and cut every single bull, but my concern is his progeny may not perform. I'm in a quandary with this guy. Here's my question for you James, with my own opinion in here, I don't like the sire, what is it that you like about the sire that made you not steer this guy? Other than feet.

Creek, here is a daughter out of the 3870 bull. She is bred to SAV Raindance with sexed semen and will calve in about 10 days from now.

[image]308[/image]

http://bit.ly/2HyZK87

I expect our 3870 son Pure Alpha to produce daughters equally as nice if not better. I'm posting this because you have not seen a daughter from Crook Mt. Black Cedar 3870.

Also, one of our SAV President sons is a 1/2 sibling to this female.

 

[CreekAngus]

She's a very nice looking cow, I still wonder if he genetics are doing any of the heavy lifting or if it's the dam. Is 3870 a herd improver? Apparently he doesn't screw up a good thing.

 

[CattleMan1920]

She's a very nice looking cow, I still wonder if he genetics are doing any of the heavy lifting or if it's the dam. Is 3870 a herd improver? Apparently he doesn't screw up a good thing.

That's not a cow, she's a heifer. Seriously.

 

[CreekAngus]

She's a very nice looking cow, I still wonder if he genetics are doing any of the heavy lifting or if it's the dam. Is 3870 a herd improver? Apparently he doesn't screw up a good thing.

That's not a cow, she's a heifer. Seriously.

Cow is a general term and she is a really fine heifer, the bull throws good off spring.

 

[CattleMan1920]

She's a very nice looking cow, I still wonder if he genetics are doing any of the heavy lifting or if it's the dam. Is 3870 a herd improver? Apparently he doesn't screw up a good thing.

That's not a cow, she's a heifer. Seriously.

Cow is a general term and she is a really fine heifer, the bull throws good off spring.

I knew what you were saying, just messing with you.

Thank you though. I value your opinion and I know that you would tell me straight if you didn't think much of her. In conversation, Ron has spoken highly of you and said your words matter.

I think her Raindance daughter will be pretty nice. You may not agree with this plan, but she will be bred back to SAV America later this year. The combination should produce the feet I want and the power that America brings to the equation. I would use President on her, you know I love that bull, but I think America will add the frame and mass I'm looking for in a cow.

 

[True Grit Farms]

She's a very nice looking cow, I still wonder if he genetics are doing any of the heavy lifting or if it's the dam. Is 3870 a herd improver? Apparently he doesn't screw up a good thing.

That's not a cow, she's a heifer. Seriously.

Cow is a general term and she is a really fine heifer, the bull throws good off spring.

What are you trying to drive the price up? Come on now, I'm just a poor redneck from south Georgia.

 

[Lazy M]

You seem to do this a lot when pushing a bull. This bull, you're focusing on its feet because it is a hard sell on anything else.

I don't mean that in a mean way. I am stating, IMO...You also know, he's a hard sell. You KNOW EPD's. You know, he's just pretty.

Without feet, you don't have sh.t, at least in our area. I would put his feet up against any bull at any sale in the country. His 1/2 sister is a tank of a heifer 1400 pounds, getting ready to have a Raindance daughter in a week.

I agree with the EPD's, you know I like them to look like Byergo Titus in that category, but again, what I'm asking is why Stone Gate and Frei would use the sire which has basically the same EPD's and use him extensively.

My line of thinking is that I can use a bull like Vermilion Spur E143 on Pure Alpha daughters, or even Hoover Dam on his daughters and get numbers and excellent feet.

Ask anyone in Kentucky, this environment completely thrashes feet, even the best of them. I could take that top selling cow from the DVF sale, and in 3-4 years on this terrain, she wouldn't look so hot. Ask Ron if you don't believe me.

I'm going for steel toed White's on my cattle not cheap Chinese throw away work boots if you get my drift.

Going by the new scoring, this bull didn't fare too well for his feet.. :hide:
https://www.angus.org/Animal/EpdPedDtl.aspx?aid=FAAAAKQgG5loeEyqlMcJRHDjuopwC4S0fswBZBAOsC%2ft1A2D&time=LAAAAOg8iixLHixoFHL2NdOZHJN0LVMjDV94MgdaqCvSzsiECp%2bXt9U00LeKFT9QGVAzBQ%3d%3d&pct=t&gt=1

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Feet? Seriously? Feet?

 

[Lazy M]

Feet? Seriously? Feet?

Yep, feet. It has already been established that he sucked at everything else from an EPD perspective. So with that being said, my official answer is "NO, I would not use that bull sired by Frei Angus. Thanks though".

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Feet? Seriously? Feet?

Yep, feet. It has already been established that he sucked at everything else from an EPD perspective. So with that being said, my official answer is "NO, I would not use that bull sired by Frei Angus. Thanks though".

Well that makes more sense. The feet EPDs don't really bother me.

Milk isn't bad.

 

[NEFarmwife]

Feet? Seriously? Feet?

Yep, feet. It has already been established that he sucked at everything else from an EPD perspective. So with that being said, my official answer is "NO, I would not use that bull sired by Frei Angus. Thanks though".

Well that makes more sense. The feet EPDs don't really bother me.

Milk isn't bad.

You want to buy a bull that may come up lame?

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Yep, feet. It has already been established that he sucked at everything else from an EPD perspective. So with that being said, my official answer is "NO, I would not use that bull sired by Frei Angus. Thanks though".

Well that makes more sense. The feet EPDs don't really bother me.

Milk isn't bad.

You want to buy a bull that may come up lame?

I didn't think we put much faith in EPDs around these parts?

 

[Bright Raven]

Well that makes more sense. The feet EPDs don't really bother me.

Milk isn't bad.

You want to buy a bull that may come up lame?

I didn't think we put much faith in EPDs around these parts?

TT. You took the words out of my mouth. One post, they tell you EPDs and the AAA ain't worth a cup of spit. Next post they are using them to cut down a bull and prove he ain't worth a damm.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Well that makes more sense. The feet EPDs don't really bother me.

Milk isn't bad.

You want to buy a bull that may come up lame?

I didn't think we put much faith in EPDs around these parts?

TT, If you bought Pure Alpha, took care of him, and if he came up lame, I would buy him back for 3 times what you paid for him. I'm that confident in him.

See who else will offer you that deal.

I put my money where my mouth is....

You don't see his videos with him deep in straw right?