Sale barn pairs

[BC]

Watch what you buy. Cows and cow calf pairs are typically at the sales barn for a reason and it's never a good one.

Different areas are different in how producers handle cattle. I go to some sales that are as you describe - if a cow is there she is used up. At others we see some good cows every week. They have cultivated a stock cow market and get lots of "death or divorce" sell outs. Right now, because of hay shortage people are having to sell cows because they cannot feed them. They have let them get too thin hoping the price would improve or they could get another cutting.

 

[wbvs58]

I'd ear notch both the cows and calves for BVD PI's before letting them any where near the herd. That is if you are confident your herd is clean.

Ken

How long does it take to be sure that your herd is really clean? A negative cow can have a positive calf or so I understand.

That is correct Kenny, the majority of PI's would come from clean cows that just had the transient infection during early pregnancy and they recover completely but the calf if it survives stays persistently infected shedding virus. It doesn't take long for a cow herd to develop immunity if exposed to PI's. Testing then practicing good biosecurity and a vaccination programme. In Australia we don't have the live vaccine so we can do an antibody test on a group like retained heifers that should have no immunity to use as a barometer of any PI's in the herd.

Ken

 

[Stocker Steve]

Pairs sell well here right at green up. Otherwise not so much. They do not mouth pairs here so it is buyer beware.

I bought one pair (great Tarentaise cow but I think she was too protective for the previous owner) and sold four pairs this year. Two were man killing limi crosses (sold very well) and two were late calvers (should have kept them and split them later).

 

[SPH]

It's a rough market right now for females. We lost some summer pasture for next year and will have to cut back on the number of females we have. We already have culled pretty tight so will have to make some tough decisions so we're going to calve out what we have now and see what we have for calves before we have to turn the cows on grass as we have plenty of hay stockpiled for the winter. We haven't even set a bale out yet and the cows are looking as good as we have seen them at this time in recent memory. Our hope is we can put a group of pairs together in the spring and someone will buy them as a group. If not selling them as pairs in the spring instead of bred females now we hopefully should be able to get a better price with a live calf at side.

 

[kenny thomas]

I'd ear notch both the cows and calves for BVD PI's before letting them any where near the herd. That is if you are confident your herd is clean.

Ken

How long does it take to be sure that your herd is really clean? A negative cow can have a positive calf or so I understand.

That is correct Kenny, the majority of PI's would come from clean cows that just had the transient infection during early pregnancy and they recover completely but the calf if it survives stays persistently infected shedding virus. It doesn't take long for a cow herd to develop immunity if exposed to PI's. Testing then practicing good biosecurity and a vaccination programme. In Australia we don't have the live vaccine so we can do an antibody test on a group like retained heifers that should have no immunity to use as a barometer of any PI's in the herd.

Ken

Ken can you tell us more about the immunuty. Or start a different topic.

 

[HDRider]

it would be nice if the sale barn cows would come with a quick story from the seller. like late calver, mean bi itch, bad feet, or real good cows just selling out, needed christmas money, etc. it really wouldnt take a extra 10 seconds per cow through the ring

Sometimes that can be shared with the guy in the ring. They will say a few words.

I wish there was a better way to go farm to farm, ignore the barn. FB, CL and stuff gets cumbersome.

 

[Caustic Burno]

it would be nice if the sale barn cows would come with a quick story from the seller. like late calver, mean bi itch, bad feet, or real good cows just selling out, needed christmas money, etc. it really wouldnt take a extra 10 seconds per cow through the ring

A good percentage of the stories told are lacking in the truth or at least the entire story. Better to learn to trust you eyes. For years I bought 50-60 head of breds and pairs every year. They weren't all winners but I got better over time. Education isn't cheap if it is at a university or at the sale yard.

The salebarn is not evil place it's our lifeblood. It's not a story telling place either, it's for the cattlemen.
Dave is right education isn't free.
If you have tender feelings this is a game best not played.
The story here are you cowman enough to pick a money maker or money pit.
There is opportunity money there every week if you know what your doing.

Most of my cows are salebarn cattle like these.



And these turned into two of three above.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

How long does it take to be sure that your herd is really clean? A negative cow can have a positive calf or so I understand.

That is correct Kenny, the majority of PI's would come from clean cows that just had the transient infection during early pregnancy and they recover completely but the calf if it survives stays persistently infected shedding virus. It doesn't take long for a cow herd to develop immunity if exposed to PI's. Testing then practicing good biosecurity and a vaccination programme. In Australia we don't have the live vaccine so we can do an antibody test on a group like retained heifers that should have no immunity to use as a barometer of any PI's in the herd.

Ken

Ken can you tell us more about the immunuty. Or start a different topic.

If a cow is negative - she is negative for life. If she gets sick during early stage of pregnancy, she is NOT a PI animal - but, her calf is - if it survives.
Ken - how viable are the calves that survive? Are some just as healthy acting as a non-PI calf? Or are they puny at birth and we manage to keep them alive?

 

[Cdcollett]

If you go to the sale bottom feeding you are taking that risk. If you buy good healthy looking cattle you generally do fine.

 

[wbvs58]

That is correct Kenny, the majority of PI's would come from clean cows that just had the transient infection during early pregnancy and they recover completely but the calf if it survives stays persistently infected shedding virus. It doesn't take long for a cow herd to develop immunity if exposed to PI's. Testing then practicing good biosecurity and a vaccination programme. In Australia we don't have the live vaccine so we can do an antibody test on a group like retained heifers that should have no immunity to use as a barometer of any PI's in the herd.

Ken

Ken can you tell us more about the immunuty. Or start a different topic.

If a cow is negative - she is negative for life. If she gets sick during early stage of pregnancy, she is NOT a PI animal - but, her calf is - if it survives.
Ken - how viable are the calves that survive? Are some just as healthy acting as a non-PI calf? Or are they puny at birth and we manage to keep them alive?

Jeanne, a bit of both. Most times they are smaller, stunted and just have that look to them but I have also heard of successfull show cattle turning up as being PI's. Nowadays I think they have to be tested before going to shows.

Kenny the immunity from natural infection was supposed to be lifelong but now I think they believe not that long however if a heifer group is exposed to a PI well before joining then most will be protected by the time they are bred. The actual disease of BVD is mainly a risk in intensive livestock situations like a feedlot where it lowers the immunity and the likes of pneumonia takes hold. In a breeding herd it is mainly a fertility problem with the biggest crashes being in a naieve herd where you get a lot coming up open and some unproductive calves however after a year or two without any action things will revert to normal as the breeding cows develop their immunity.

Ken

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

that's quite interesting. thanks
Yes, all our show cattle have to be tested (also any breeding sale cattle).

 

[kenny thomas]

Ken can you tell us more about the immunuty. Or start a different topic.

If a cow is negative - she is negative for life. If she gets sick during early stage of pregnancy, she is NOT a PI animal - but, her calf is - if it survives.
Ken - how viable are the calves that survive? Are some just as healthy acting as a non-PI calf? Or are they puny at birth and we manage to keep them alive?

Jeanne, a bit of both. Most times they are smaller, stunted and just have that look to them but I have also heard of successfull show cattle turning up as being PI's. Nowadays I think they have to be tested before going to shows.

Kenny the immunity from natural infection was supposed to be lifelong but now I think they believe not that long however if a heifer group is exposed to a PI well before joining then most will be protected by the time they are bred. The actual disease of BVD is mainly a risk in intensive livestock situations like a feedlot where it lowers the immunity and the likes of pneumonia takes hold. In a breeding herd it is mainly a fertility problem with the biggest crashes being in a naieve herd where you get a lot coming up open and some unproductive calves however after a year or two without any action things will revert to normal as the breeding cows develop their immunity.

Ken

So I might test now and show no positives even after having one test positive?