Beef Cattle Breeds

[flaboy]

Radi,

I raise both breeds. I have a small registered Polled Hereford herd, and a small commercial Angus herd. I have one of each bull. I've also been around cattle most of my life. Here are some rules of "thumb", based upon my experiance.

5.) I see the down side to the Herefords to be susceptability to eye problems (pink eye, cancer eye, etc.), udder size/quality, and the lower price they bring at the sale barn.

Hope this was helpful.

Whoa down there now. When I made this statement some time back I was told #5 was purely a herd management problem. Could it be there was some truth to my experiences with this breed? Naw, what do I know.

I agree with the baldie statement also. I did have baldie that developed cancer eye though. I am sure it was a herd management problem though and not related to breed. :lol:

 

[Bez]

The vet thought this was the SECOND time this had happened to the young cow. I kept her in corral panels by the house (where I could check on her repeatedly), unstrung the laces on the big day, pulled the calf by hand, laced her back up, took the staples out a month later, pasture bred her, and sent her to the stockyard as a bred cow and got a 550 pound black baldie heifer out of the deal. Of couse somebody who checked their cows a little less would have lost the both of them.

And now some other poor sucker will go thru stitching her up a third time- if they catch it in time.......

Had a first calf baldy heifer prolapse the other day- with a 3 month old calf at her side....As soon as the calf is weaned and she fattens a little she is going in my deepfreeze...Just as soon get those problem ones out of cycle for good.....

Ya know OT - I am with you on this one. I tend to be one of those who believes a prolapsed animal should never be re-sold. No matter what the breed, it puts some other poor sap on the line.

Morals - ethics - tend to go out the window when it comes to money and we are sometimes our own worst enemies. Plus it has a tendency to perpetuate the "bad rep" of certain breeds.

Not to forget the fact that the gentleman in question screwed over a fellow cattleman - intentionally at that.

Sell her as beef - no probs. Selling her as a bred breeder is out and out wrong.

Tells me lots about this persons character.

Two wrongs never make a right.

Had a Red Angus prolapse on me this Spring. We bottled the calf and shot the mother.

That line is going to end completely when we eat the calf next Spring. In my opinion that is THE ONLY way to go.

Bez

 

[Brandonm2]

Yeah I guess you're right.

My grandparents (still) raise (pure-bred) Herefords. Really enjoy it and make good profits.

I still have long time to make my choice.

You ought to talk to you grandparents about these questions. They probably know as much (or more) than we do and they would probably enjoy having the conversation.

 

[1848]

Whoa down there now. When I made this statement some time back I was told #5 was purely a herd management problem. Could it be there was some truth to my experiences with this breed? Naw, what do I know.

5.) I see the down side to the Herefords to be susceptability to eye problems (pink eye, cancer eye, etc.), udder size/quality, and the lower price they bring at the sale barn.

You are correct they are management problems. Everyone of them can be corrected by good and proper managment....even the price!

Unfortunately, Herefords gained this reputation years ago when they were the dominant breed in the US, and working under some of the worst management and environmental conditions around...but the key word here is worked. They still are used in some of the worst range conditions to be found due to their survivability and ability to forage. Take a look at the Sandhills of Kansas, the deserts of New Mexico and Arizona, the winters of Canada, the humid heat of Florida and the south. You'll find the Hereford still there..still thriving!

If you understand the deficiencies in any breed you can manage them for the better. That's why we cross breed.

Had you bought the better Herefords, (not the cheap ones in the sale barn), with good eye pigment, good eye set, strong, healthy, and under a good management program which pays attention to these common flaws associated with all cattle (maybe with the exception of pigment) then you would still be raising Herefords! ;-)

 

[tapeworm]

I vote to mix em up. But I dont agree with some of you about the Angus being all that great a maternal cow..thats why I like the hereford influence. Not saying theres not good maternal angus cows..just that I like the herefords better for that. Angus for the carcass..herefords for the maternal..mix em up and youve got the best of both worlds


All your questions about prices and other stuff needs to come from somebody closer to you..that can vary a lot by area. I notice your in NY...youve got somebody up there that can help you. I think her name is Janie from New York City...shes a Simi breeder up there in Semen Valley New York. I use to not have much use for eastern folks but let me tell you....Ive read enough of her postings to know...that lady is all cattle...cattle to the bone. She can show up a lot of men Ive got for neighbors. Maybe she can help you on prices

Tape, Her name is Jeanne Semmi-valley, I think Semen valley may be in So. California.Where is your mind at?I believe she's in upstate, N.Y. ;-)

LOL Mister Crowder..that does sound right now that you mention it...I thiought it was Janie but your right it was jeanne from New York City instead...either way shes all cattle. Thank you for clearing that up. Not sure about the valley either..you might be right that its in California...or maybe its in Kentucky?? Or is that the tartar sauce valley Im thinking about??

 

[flaboy]

Had you bought the better Herefords, (not the cheap ones in the sale barn), with good eye pigment, good eye set, strong, healthy, and under a good management program which pays attention to these common flaws associated with all cattle (maybe with the exception of pigment) then you would still be raising Herefords! ;-)

Hey 1848, you been following me around? How did you know I buy all my stock at the sale barn? Another dang psychic on the board. For your information, I have never bought a single cow/bull/steer at a sale barn. The Herefords I referred to came off a veterinarian registered operation in Alabama. Yeah, we ran registered polled Herefords for a while. We are down to where we only have about 15-20 Hereford/Hereford crosses left in the herd today. I also run a Hereford bull raised from the registered bull we bought out of Alabama. Trust me I like Herefords but it is my experience and many others I know who run them OPINIONS that they are more susceptible to these problems given the same environmental surroundings as other breeds.

 

[tapeworm]

I vote to mix em up. But I dont agree with some of you about the Angus being all that great a maternal cow..thats why I like the hereford influence. Not saying theres not good maternal angus cows..just that I like the herefords better for that. Angus for the carcass..herefords for the maternal..mix em up and youve got the best of both worlds


All your questions about prices and other stuff needs to come from somebody closer to you..that can vary a lot by area. I notice your in NY...youve got somebody up there that can help you. I think her name is Janie from New York City...shes a Simi breeder up there in Semen Valley New York. I use to not have much use for eastern folks but let me tell you....Ive read enough of her postings to know...that lady is all cattle...cattle to the bone. She can show up a lot of men Ive got for neighbors. Maybe she can help you on prices

Tape, Her name is Jeanne Semmi-valley, I think Semen valley may be in So. California.Where is your mind at?I believe she's in upstate, N.Y. ;-)

LOL Mister Crowder..that does sound right now that you mention it...I thiought it was Janie but your right it was jeanne from New York City instead...either way shes all cattle. Thank you for clearing that up. Not sure about the valley either..you might be right that its in California...or maybe its in Kentucky?? Or is that the tartar sauce valley Im thinking about??

Hey Mister Crowder it just now hit me...I didnt even notice before that you have that fancy knoweverthing title under your name now...Crowder is now a GooRoo. Did you have to give your brain up for adoption like the rest of em?? LOL

 

[Tod Dague]

Yeah I guess you're right.

My grandparents (still) raise (pure-bred) Herefords. Really enjoy it and make good profits.

I still have long time to make my choice.

You ought to talk to you grandparents about these questions. They probably know as much (or more) than we do and they would probably enjoy having the conversation.

I'll second that one. They'll probably help you get started with some good stock too from either their herd or from someone else's.

 

[Radi Cilo]

Yep, I was planning on talking to my grandparents next time I visited.

I don't think they'll ever give up raising them. They just won't have their life any other way.

-Radi

 

[flaboy]

Yep, I was planning on talking to my grandparents next time I visited.

I don't think they'll ever give up raising them. They just won't have their life any other way.

-Radi

Radi, I don't know how old you are or how far you live from your grandparents but, I would go there as often as possible and try to help anyway you can. If you express or show interest in the business you might be surprised at what your grandparents might do.

They would probalby be tickled too if you did. It's too late after they are gone.

 

[1848]

Hey 1848, you been following me around? How did you know I buy all my stock at the sale barn? Another dang psychic on the board. For your information, I have never bought a single cow/bull/steer at a sale barn. The Herefords I referred to came off a veterinarian registered operation in Alabama. Yeah, we ran registered polled Herefords for a while. We are down to where we only have about 15-20 Hereford/Hereford crosses left in the herd today. I also run a Hereford bull raised from the registered bull we bought out of Alabama. Trust me I like Herefords but it is my experience and many others I know who run them OPINIONS that they are more susceptible to these problems given the same environmental surroundings as other breeds.

Wow! and how did you guess "I" was a psychic!

As far as the purchases...Maybe it was your selection process then?

Or maybe you bought the Vets culls?

I won't argue the opinions part....everyone has one! :lol:

 

[Radi Cilo]

Yep - I think helping my grandparents will give me a bit of experience to prepare me as a farmer.

Plus give me time to ask him questions as I help.

 

[1848]

Cilo,

Do you ever rest?

 

[Beefy]

i voted for angus

 

[Radi Cilo]

Uhmm, I guess not!

 

[Brandonm2]

Yep - I think helping my grandparents will give me a bit of experience to prepare me as a farmer.

Plus give me time to ask him questions as I help.

We can answer your internet questions and a good book, a Cattle Today subscription, and a list of internet links can give you a LOT of information from Buelingo cows to the name of the top price cow at last weeks purebred sale; but at 14 the knowledge you most need is "HOW to....." Most of that can only come from doing. Since your grandparents seem to have all the "HOW to..." knowledge, I would make a conscientious effort to develop and maximize that relationship.

 

[flaboy]

Hey 1848, you been following me around? How did you know I buy all my stock at the sale barn? Another dang psychic on the board. For your information, I have never bought a single cow/bull/steer at a sale barn. The Herefords I referred to came off a veterinarian registered operation in Alabama. Yeah, we ran registered polled Herefords for a while. We are down to where we only have about 15-20 Hereford/Hereford crosses left in the herd today. I also run a Hereford bull raised from the registered bull we bought out of Alabama. Trust me I like Herefords but it is my experience and many others I know who run them OPINIONS that they are more susceptible to these problems given the same environmental surroundings as other breeds.

Wow! and how did you guess "I" was a psychic!

As far as the purchases...Maybe it was your selection process then?

Or maybe you bought the Vets culls?

I won't argue the opinions part....everyone has one! :lol:

Well ya got me 1848. Yes, I buy culls that no body else wants. Yes, Herefords are the best breed in the world. Yes, I only buy cattle at sale barns. Yes, all breeds problems are herd management issues. I now know from what you have taught me that Herefords don't have a tendency to get pink eye or cancer eye. I am so glad you told me that. Now I can run out and change my herd mix. Yes, I now understand you have years and years of experience that I should take advantage of. Yes, I understand that you know it all and I should just soak up your immense wealth of knowledge and forget the decades of experience I have and just listen to you.

Please, please, please post some pictures of your herd so I will know what real cattle should look like. I so much want to model my operation after yours.

 

[1848]

Well ya got me 1848. Yes, I buy culls that no body else wants. Yes, Herefords are the best breed in the world. Yes, I only buy cattle at sale barns. Yes, all breeds problems are herd management issues. I now know from what you have taught me that Herefords don't have a tendency to get pink eye or cancer eye. I am so glad you told me that. Now I can run out and change my herd mix. Yes, I now understand you have years and years of experience that I should take advantage of. Yes, I understand that you know it all and I should just soak up your immense wealth of knowledge and forget the decades of experience I have and just listen to you.

Please, please, please post some pictures of your herd so I will know what real cattle should look like. I so much want to model my operation after yours.

Boy I'm glad, cause I sure was gunning for ya! :roll: Those years of experience you have hasn't opened up your eyes. Just thought I would state some facts. Of course me being the psychic and all I should have known years of experience was on your side, and you knew all about Herefords. You don't need pictures or a model, you need a positive attitude!

Psychicly speaking of course! :lol:

 

[flaboy]

[Boy I'm glad, cause I sure was gunning for ya! :roll: Those years of experience you have hasn't opened up your eyes. Just thought I would state some facts. Of course me being the psychic and all I should have known years of experience was on your side, and you knew all about Herefords. You don't need pictures or a model, you need a positive attitude!

Psychicly speaking of course! :lol:

No, no you are the great know it all Hereford expert. You straightened me and many others out on the pink eye/cancer eye stuff. My past experience and others I know including the vet I purchase Herefords from is all wrong. Please start tape recording everything you say so I might learn from your all consuming knowledge. I don't want to miss anything you might say.

Let's make sure I write this down properly. I stated that given the "same environment" (swampy mosquito ridden marsh land)(dry dusty fly ridden sand)(thought maybe you didn't understand environment), Herefords are more susceptible to pink eye, cancer eye. You said (basically) I am full of it and this is not the case. Do I have your permission to write this in my book of facts by you so I can reference it for future use? I will name my book "Facts by the Psychic 1848".

Please, please post pictures of your cows (if you have any). I really need to know what a real cow looks like. You know since all I have is culls and sale barn stuff. :lol:

 

[1848]

Yes, you have my permission...and it's "psychic" not physic.

Don't beat yourself up too much! :lol2: