Why would anyone be against banding?
- Thread starter Alan
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jgn
Well-known member
I band from 1 hour to 3 days just depending on how quick I can get my hands on them. I've yet to encounter any problems(knock on wood).
CattleAnnie
Well-known member
We band them young with the exception of the odd calf that's got one of those tight scrotums that are hard to get the nuts down into. We just write him down in the book and cut him when we brand in June.
The only problem we've ever had was with one of those tight scrotum calves that Honey finally managed to get the band on after several attempts. Taught us that if you can't get both nuts first try, then apply a new band to the applicator, as this particular calf shed his scrotum but not his testes and got a mild infection. Flipped him over, cut the cord, gave him some antibiotics and he was good as new within a day.
That's the only one out of hundreds that we've ever had that happen to, and have never had a problem with tetanus. That being said, we do calve when it's cold out so it may be that there's more problems with tetanus when you calve on the grass in warmer temperatures.
Take care.
ps. Been there with you on the burning chest thing, Alan. Hauled a 130lb calf up to the house to warm up the other day...what a work out just getting him into the calfsled, not to mention the long haul to and fro. ;-)
The only problem we've ever had was with one of those tight scrotum calves that Honey finally managed to get the band on after several attempts. Taught us that if you can't get both nuts first try, then apply a new band to the applicator, as this particular calf shed his scrotum but not his testes and got a mild infection. Flipped him over, cut the cord, gave him some antibiotics and he was good as new within a day.
That's the only one out of hundreds that we've ever had that happen to, and have never had a problem with tetanus. That being said, we do calve when it's cold out so it may be that there's more problems with tetanus when you calve on the grass in warmer temperatures.
Take care.
ps. Been there with you on the burning chest thing, Alan. Hauled a 130lb calf up to the house to warm up the other day...what a work out just getting him into the calfsled, not to mention the long haul to and fro. ;-)
Jake
Well-known member
we band bulls up to 500# (knock on wood) never had problems and never give a tetanus shot. We've even banded some bigger than that but wouldn't suggest it as an everyday practice. The vets here will band or cut them doesn't matter. They even have BIG bands to use on 900-1000# bulls
cowspider
Well-known member
Anyone use short banding? (push testicales up inside and band sack only)
I have been told it helps them grow and are still sterile.
Any comments on this??? :?: :?: :cboy:
I have been told it helps them grow and are still sterile.
Any comments on this??? :?: :?: :cboy:
CattleAnnie
Well-known member
Never tried it, but sounds like a good way to get docked in the sale ring for having 'staggy' steers.
How does it work for you?
Take care.
How does it work for you?
Take care.
Craig-TX
Well-known member
CattleAnnie":57du3up2 said:
I agree, that would be my concern also. It should render them sterile because of the testicles' inability to function at a higher body temp. But on the other hand, truth be known, we've probably all missed a nut once or twice or had a calf with only one showing and just banded it instead of going deep with the knife. I have. I don't recall those calves looking staggy. But hormones would still be there? The last thing they want in the feedlots are a bunch of proud-cut steers chasing heifers around all day. I wonder if that's an issue.
Craig-TX
CattleAnnie
Well-known member
When I had a calf who had a testicle that didn't come down into his scrotum, I just had the auction market pull him out of the bunch and told the buyers that it's because he hadn't been castrated and why. They didn't dock him very hard, but who knows why.
Figured that if I was going to have repeat buyers, might be worthwhile being honest about the calves. Do the same with my freemartin heifers (they have a FM on their eartag, so makes them easy to sort out of the bunch before they get to the ring). Can't help but put myself in the shoes of the buyers who'd otherwise think that they are buying possible commercial replacements and end up getting burned.
Take care.
Figured that if I was going to have repeat buyers, might be worthwhile being honest about the calves. Do the same with my freemartin heifers (they have a FM on their eartag, so makes them easy to sort out of the bunch before they get to the ring). Can't help but put myself in the shoes of the buyers who'd otherwise think that they are buying possible commercial replacements and end up getting burned.
Take care.
Texan
Well-known member
Treytex, you sound like you might be happier on the PETA boards.treytex":e4z1lwsa said:
Kind of offtopic i guess but anyway.
Alan- for pete's sake get yourself a four-wheeler. you wont regret it. Also, be careful messing with those cows with babies when no one else is around. even gentle cows can get irate, and all it takes is one little bawl from the calf.
Alan- for pete's sake get yourself a four-wheeler. you wont regret it. Also, be careful messing with those cows with babies when no one else is around. even gentle cows can get irate, and all it takes is one little bawl from the calf.
Hutch
Well-known member
Does anyone still "pinch" their bull calfs?
BC
Well-known member
A damn disaster in the making. They are a bullock. When slaughtered the carcass will sell for bull meat prices. Requires more techincal surgery to remove testicles from belly wall. IT IS THE MAIN REASON FEEDLOTS OPPOSE BANDING.
cowspider":22qsyflj said:
Caustic Burno
Well-known member
brokenmouth":20680pcf said:
I am rolling
Same fellow hunts them bad coyotes in city park. Might get licked by some old ladies poodle.
Jeanne - Simme Valley
Well-known member
We cut with a scaple - some at birth, some at spring work-up, and some in the fall prior to weaning. Do love those fall ones - to eat!!!
I always thought - would I like my finger (I'm a female so can't imagine something else :shock: ) anyway, would I like my finger quickly cut off or slooowwwly squeezed off??? Easy answer for me.
Seriously, both are probably good, just so you know how to count - one - two - done.
I still question WHY do you need to give a tetanus shot when banding but not when cutting?? Never have gotten an answer on that one. ALWAYS, see it written in articles warning to give shot when banding. Anyone know why???
I always thought - would I like my finger (I'm a female so can't imagine something else :shock: ) anyway, would I like my finger quickly cut off or slooowwwly squeezed off??? Easy answer for me.
Seriously, both are probably good, just so you know how to count - one - two - done.
I still question WHY do you need to give a tetanus shot when banding but not when cutting?? Never have gotten an answer on that one. ALWAYS, see it written in articles warning to give shot when banding. Anyone know why???
Jeanne - Simme Valley":11cea13s said:
Tetanus is in the clostridium family ( like blackleg ) and tetanus LOVES rubber bands because where ever there is a SLOW necrosis ( tissue death ) there is a higher risk of tetanus. Rubber bands cause slow tissue death.
Horses carry tetanus and shed it in their manure so it makes sense to keep these species in seperate areas if possible and realize you run an even higher risk of tetanus if you have horses and calves.
On another note, I watched several castrations on 2 day old Hereford calves last week and it was blood less.
Only one cut to the bottom third of scrotum and then the testicals were pulled out and the tissue stripped back as usual.
Then the cremaster muscle was pulled until it broke ( you could hear the snap )
The spermatic cord was then pulled until it stretched stretched stretched until it also snapped and recoiled.
The recoil inside stops all bleeding.
Very impressive, very quick and the calves walked away without a sound.
Yea, a 4 wheeler and a cart would be nice, We bought our property about 4 years ago so things come in order of priority and affordablity. But a 4 wheeler is close to the top of the list, or tractor.
I raise gentle Polled herefords.. no worries. Just kidding while my cows are very gentle and use to me getting "hands on" I look over my shoulder most of the time I'm working with thier new calves or walking thru the herd. It was this cows third and a very gentle cow, but like I say about horses, it's true with cows I'm sure. Any cow any day can hurt you.
Again thanks for all the help, new bull calf is racing aroud the pasture with the hiefer calf, it's fun to watch from our window...his name is still "you little S.O.B."
Alan
Alan":2yidjvla said:
I got a cart before calving season and in some instances it is pretty handy, short distances over fairly smooth and level ground. But for most of this plae, particularly since the cows have it so churned up with the mud and all, I am now in the process of building a crate that hangs on the tow hitch on the back of the mule. I thnk that it will improve the moving of calves a whole lot.
dun
Victoria
Well-known member
Hutch":3f0a5w9d said:
Yes. We use the burdizzo method.
I see the need for castration but I think we should do it as nicely as possible. It's part of our duty as cattlemen to do what we can to make a living and at the same time provide a good life for the animals God has put in our care.
I have never banded when the calf is young, then banding probably isn't too tough on them but we have had two orphan males (not on the same year). One we used burdizzos on - he was sore but got up and about pretty quick. The other orphan we used banding. It seemed to bother him for a longer period of time, he was miserable and in pain longer. Of course, one could have just been able to handle pain better than the other but after watching those two I vote for the burdizzo method rather than the banding.
Some European countries have banned banding because officials say that it is inhumane.
Double R Ranch
Well-known member
Alan,
I am glad that you brought this topic up. We have just lost a long time friend and fellow cattleman due to the banding issue.
In the past we have asked him to come help us castrate our calves. Each year, for one reason or another (his reasons not ours), he has not made it out to help us castrate with a knife. (his way)
We do not feel comfortable doing it without knowing what we are doing. That is the reason we need him to come help. Then for future years we would know what we were doing.
Long story short, we have lost money by selling bull calves the last few years and this year we had enough.
Now the calves are 5 months old and still bulls. So I got fed up and banded the calves.
Now since we met we have not banded due to the fact that he thinks that it is the cruelest thing that you can do. He is 100% against banding!!!
He says that it is like kicking a puppy. He says that the calves suffer so terribly! None of our calves have suffered or had any problems.
When he finally found out that we banded he flew off the handle. He said that he can never speek to us again because we are so cruel.
So, there are many opinions on this issue. We say do what ever seems right to you at what ever age. This friends mato however is "Whatever happens on your own ranch is your own business" guess this only means when it suits him ;-)
I am glad that you brought this topic up. We have just lost a long time friend and fellow cattleman due to the banding issue.
In the past we have asked him to come help us castrate our calves. Each year, for one reason or another (his reasons not ours), he has not made it out to help us castrate with a knife. (his way)
We do not feel comfortable doing it without knowing what we are doing. That is the reason we need him to come help. Then for future years we would know what we were doing.
Long story short, we have lost money by selling bull calves the last few years and this year we had enough.
Now the calves are 5 months old and still bulls. So I got fed up and banded the calves.
Now since we met we have not banded due to the fact that he thinks that it is the cruelest thing that you can do. He is 100% against banding!!!
He says that it is like kicking a puppy. He says that the calves suffer so terribly! None of our calves have suffered or had any problems.
When he finally found out that we banded he flew off the handle. He said that he can never speek to us again because we are so cruel.
So, there are many opinions on this issue. We say do what ever seems right to you at what ever age. This friends mato however is "Whatever happens on your own ranch is your own business" guess this only means when it suits him ;-)
