Confederate Flag BAN

[TexasBred]

Of course you can, and a very loose union of republics at that, with very little central government pressure.
Look at the EU. Even the old Soviet Union allowed a great deal of autonomy within it's union of different nation states, as have several mideast nation state unions more recently and currently..
Look at Great Britain. Made up of globally scattered Commonwealths, as well as independent nations of England, Scotland, Ireland, and even Wales.

These are hardly good examples and the Republic of Ireland is certainly not part of the British Commonwealth. The USSR was a group of conquered "former" countries living as one country and one government. The EU is in shambles and on the verge of collapse and who knows about the arabs. Today they are your alli, tomorrow they are allies with the highest bidder.

 

[HOSS]

Follow the money. The upstart Republican Party had campaigned for several years on a platform of
what we now call "tax-and-spend." Prior to 1861, there was a certain amount of resistance to federal
taxation and federal spending. But an entire political party based on a tax-and-spend philosophy coming to
power was something new.
For any other political party, it would not have mattered if the Southern States were part of the Union or
independent. But, the new Republican Party favored taxing the South to spend in the North. Average
Southerners were outraged. After all, how much more could the agricultural South be expected to pay to
build up the industrialized North?
The South paid far more that its far share of taxes before the war. Lincoln may have wanted to "save the Union," because he knew that the North could not progress without the South. In 1840 the South paid 84% of the tariffs, rising to 87% in 1860. Shortly before Lincoln had become President the highest tariffs in US history were imposed. Just four Southern States–Virginia,North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia–paid 75% of all federal taxes. Just think, three out of every four dollars sent to Washington, D.C. were from just four Southern States and all the other Southern States contributed as well. Washington could not afford to lose the tax revenue. I think Lincoln actually made some comments about this when secession began.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Follow the money. The upstart Republican Party had campaigned for several years on a platform of
what we now call "tax-and-spend." Prior to 1861, there was a certain amount of resistance to federal
taxation and federal spending. But an entire political party based on a tax-and-spend philosophy coming to
power was something new.
For any other political party, it would not have mattered if the Southern States were part of the Union or
independent. But, the new Republican Party favored taxing the South to spend in the North. Average
Southerners were outraged. After all, how much more could the agricultural South be expected to pay to
build up the industrialized North?
The South paid far more that its far share of taxes before the war. Just four Southern States–Virginia,
North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia–paid 75% of all federal taxes. Just think, three out of every four
dollars sent to Washington, D.C. were from just four Southern States and all the other Southern States
contributed as well. Washington could not afford to lose the tax revenue. I think Lincoln actually made some comments about this when secession began.

You are dead on as this all started with Manifest Destiny, the government needed money to finace the empire.
A popular expression America's mission was elaborated by President Abraham Lincoln's description, in his December 1, 1862 message to Congress. He described the United States "the last, best hope of Earth" The "mission" of the United States was elaborated on in Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, in which he interpreted the Civil War as a struggle to determine if any nation with democratic ideals could survive, has been called by historian Robert Johannsen "the most enduring statement of America's Manifest Destiny and mission"

 

[HOSS]

CB, in 1861 the Morrill Tariff Act was passed which heavily taxed good imported from Europe. That really benefited the industrial north but even further harmed the agricultural south who exported allot of cotton to Europe and imported much of their durable goods from England at a cheaper price than the north could produce them. The Morrill Tariff was put into place to punish the south for importing. The tax burden would have been near 95% if secession hadn't taken place just a few weeks after.

 

[HOSS]

The slavery issue was pushed in order to tie an emotional element to the war to gain support from those that were not politically engaged. They needed a trigger and that one happened to be the biggest hot button issue that they could exploit. If they publicly touted the revenue side it would have highlighted the tax burden disparity and nobody likes taxes.......even the northerners would have been sympathetic.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Somebody please swat the flies! They are annoying.

You can always go back in the house. :mrgreen:

I am going to sit right here on the porch and watch the big dogs run! Flies will follow the stinch.

 

[TexasBred]

CB, in 1861 the Morrill Tariff Act was passed which heavily taxed good imported from Europe. That really benefited the industrial north but even further harmed the agricultural south who exported allot of cotton to Europe and imported much of their durable goods from England at a cheaper price than the north could produce them. The Morrill Tariff was put into place to punish the south for importing. The tax burden would have been near 95% if secession hadn't taken place just a few weeks after.

Seven states had already seceeded before this act was even passed.

 

[TexasBred]

Somebody please swat the flies! They are annoying.

You can always go back in the house. :mrgreen:

I am going to sit right here on the porch and watch the big dogs run! Flies will follow the stinch.

Better get that swatter then or cut a hole in the seat of your pants.

 

[backhoeboogie]

There is an old saying about wallering in the mud with pigs. That comes to mind at this point.

 

[HOSS]

CB, in 1861 the Morrill Tariff Act was passed which heavily taxed good imported from Europe. That really benefited the industrial north but even further harmed the agricultural south who exported allot of cotton to Europe and imported much of their durable goods from England at a cheaper price than the north could produce them. The Morrill Tariff was put into place to punish the south for importing. The tax burden would have been near 95% if secession hadn't taken place just a few weeks after.

Seven states had already seceeded before this act was even passed.

True....but it was being debated heavily when secession happened. The south was heavily outnumbered in Congress and had no hope of defeating it. It was one thing that pushed the south along on the path to secession. If they hadn't seceded the tax rate would have been astronomical.

 

[TexasBred]

CB, in 1861 the Morrill Tariff Act was passed which heavily taxed good imported from Europe. That really benefited the industrial north but even further harmed the agricultural south who exported allot of cotton to Europe and imported much of their durable goods from England at a cheaper price than the north could produce them. The Morrill Tariff was put into place to punish the south for importing. The tax burden would have been near 95% if secession hadn't taken place just a few weeks after.

Seven states had already seceeded before this act was even passed.

True....but it was being debated heavily when secession happened. The south was heavily outnumbered in Congress and had no hope of defeating it. It was one thing that pushed the south along on the path to secession. If they hadn't seceded the tax rate would have been astronomical.

Well HOSS with free labor they certainly could have probably paid it. :hide: ;-) It probably ws at least a talking point but there were those on both sides who were determined that this war WAS going to happen. And it did.

 

[skyhightree1]

did I create all this ?

 

[Anonymous]

No sky. We're not talkin about how the Indians were enslaved, mistreated, run off their own land into concentration camps even today. That's not the cause de'jour

 

[TexasBred]

did I create all this ?

Just having fun bud. Not gonna change anybodies thinking but always a good conversation. :tiphat:

 

[skyhightree1]

I know texas I was just teasing.. I don't fly a confed flag so either way doesnt hurt my feelings.. okely dokely hook

 

[Anonymous]

I should be more angry about how my ancestors were treated. And are treated. But the black entrenchment have scooped up all the pity there is out there and have run with it.
I don't know of any other group that is still treated badly, still kicked off their land, but gets so little recognition. Just calling it like I see it

 

[IABeef]

Was de southern states really worth fighting over, ya'll? :lol:

 

[Caustic Burno]

I know texas I was just teasing.. I don't fly a confed flag so either way doesnt hurt my feelings.. okely dokely hook

Sky I don't fly one either don't own one.
What get's my panties in a wad is the trampling of our right's no matter where you stand on this flag or any other.
It has come down to some of our citizen's have right's and other's don't.
The government is lighting the fuse on a powder keg.
Just this year you have had search's without warrant's.
Marshal Law under the disguise of public safety over one teenager called a lock down. That is Marshal Law.
An American citizen being denied his 5th admendment right's to remain silent. Are you or I next.
We have the IRS acting as the SS of 1930's Germany targeting political enemies of the current regime.
We have flat out been lied to about Bengazi by the government that supposedly work's for us.
We are being spied on by our own government conjureing up image's of Soviet Block countries.
The 1 st admendment is under attack by the Justice dept. targeting the current regime's critic's.

I don't care what party you back this should scare every American to death.

 

[HOSS]

[/quote]

Seven states had already seceeded before this act was even passed.[/quote]
True....but it was being debated heavily when secession happened. The south was heavily outnumbered in Congress and had no hope of defeating it. It was one thing that pushed the south along on the path to secession. If they hadn't seceded the tax rate would have been astronomical.[/quote]

Well HOSS with free labor they certainly could have probably paid it. :hide: ;-) It probably ws at least a talking point but there were those on both sides who were determined that this war WAS going to happen. And it did.[/quote]
:lol: labor was definetly not free but it was cheaper than up north. I saw an old receipt from my great, great grandfather where he paid 1,800 for a slave which would be a huge sum in today's dollars. Add food, shelter and medical care and it took a chunk out of free. I was surprised at how much a slave cost. Many slaves were treated very well because they were an investment. The slaves used to have an old saying that they would rather be a slave than be a poor white man because they had it much better than poor whites. That being said I don't believe any man should be a slave good treatment or not.

 

[Commercialfarmer]

Was de southern states really worth fighting over, ya'll? :lol:

You should pull back a little. You're trollish slip is showing.