Another update on Ethanol.

[Hook]

Hook,
Sorry, I missed that last part.

Does that case answer the question of what your stake in the discussion is?

No.
My only interest is, as was SL's, the welfare of cattle and the cattle industry. I hold no special interest nor did SL.
Liz

So, if it's known that there are several causes and sulfur is only one of them, why donyounchose to harp on the sulfur only? In the interest of truth and equality i would think you would educate us on all the causes and not just one

 

[NC Liz 2]

Hook,

So, if it's known that there are several causes and sulfur is only one of them, why do you chose to harp on the sulfur only? In the interest of truth and equality i would think you would educate us on all the causes and not just one

Something you just have to do on your own. It is not my job to educate you. All I am doing is presenting the facts/evidence.
If you think my position is incorrect, it is up to you to prove it.

SL stated this investigation back in 1985 ( I think ) and I have read everything he, and others, have posted on the Think Tank.
When I first got interested, I was like you, I was skeptical. Very skeptical.
But as the evidence piled up I had to face the facts.

Now SL and I have provided you with university after university saying exactly what we are saying.
We have furnished you with statements from the executive director of the Distillers Grains Technology Council himself confirming what we are saying is true.
We have even given you an appellate court decision that what we are saying is true.

Now I don't know what else I can do to bring you out of denial.
If you don't believe numerous universities, the Distillers Grains Technology Council and two district court judges:

What would it take to convince you if all this evidence does not?

Liz

 

[Hook]

You keep referring to yourself as "we"
First off, Drop the act if you want to be taken serious.
Secondly, I've been, as a bunch of others have, reading what you have posted as facts. Which in reality are one sided diatribes about the evils of sulfur as if they are fed without limitations. Which they are not. If haven't read one study that you posted yet that isn't biased or that doesn't have a flaw. I can reach a scientific conclusion real easy when I feed straight anything to an animal and it reacts badly. Problem with that it feeding it out in real world circumstances. But real world doesn't result in the same conclusions.
So, I ask again, why are you hyper focused on sulfur?

 

[NC Liz 2]

Denial :
a statement saying that something is not true or real : a statement in which someone denies something
psychology : a condition in which someone will not admit that something sad, painful, etc., is true or real
:nod:

 

[ibetyamissedme]

Sir loin what ethanol plant produced this feed in question?

 

[NC Liz 2]

what ethanol plant produced this feed in question?

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.
Liz

 

[ibetyamissedme]

what ethanol plant produced this feed in question?

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.
Liz

I'll ask again sir loin what ethanol plant produced the feed in question?

 

[mwj]

what ethanol plant produced this feed in question?

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.
Liz

I'll ask again sir loin what ethanol plant produced the feed in question?

Open the door and yell the same question, and you will get a better answer. :cowboy: Please remember to close the door or you could get frostbite! It's amazing that millions of tons of this poison have been fed and millions of cattle have survived. From all of the study's and ''facts '' posted on this board I would expect at least 100,000 dead cattle or more per year! :shock:

 

[TexasBred]

what ethanol plant produced this feed in question?

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.
Liz

The sulfur issue, for example, popped up in two states this past year, with distillers grains quickly being ruled out as a possible source in both cases.

 

[NC Liz 2]

The sulfur issue, for example, popped up in two states this past year, with distillers grains quickly being ruled out as a possible source in both cases.

By whom?? the executive director of the Distillers Grains Technology Council, the manufacture and their attorneys, as they did in the Newman vs A. E. Staley MFG. Co. and lost in the appellate court.

"Most of them are not completely put to bed," "and they may raise their heads in the future,"

Liz

 

[TexasBred]

The sulfur issue, for example, popped up in two states this past year, with distillers grains quickly being ruled out as a possible source in both cases.

By whom?? the executive director of the Distillers Grains Technology Council, the manufacture and their attorneys, as they did in the Newman vs A. E. Staley MFG. Co. and lost in the appellate court.

"Most of them are not completely put to bed," "and they may raise their heads in the future,"

Liz

This was a quote in your original post. I guess you overlooked it.

 

[Lucky_P]

Oh, look... grazing cattle developing polioencephalomalacia...with no feeding of ethanol byproducts:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC340301/
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19178473

Read 'em, if you dare, SL.

 

[NC Liz 2]

Lucky,

Thanks for the sources, but there is nothing new in the first one.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC340301/

The symptoms are exactly as has been reported in my area and that 4 Vets have diagnosed as PEM.
So IMO there is no doubt we are dealing with PEM.
Now is this case they found an excess of sulfur coming from water, but they did not test the feed.
In our area we tested the water and it was found to be safe, Plus some of the sick and dead animals were on city water and the water co stated it was reported on every test to be almost unmeasurable.
In our cases, as in this case no one wanted to pay to test the feed.

So as I see it:
We agree on the diagnosis as PEM
In this case water was found to be the source but feed was not tested..
In our cases water was ruled out but feed was not tested.

Sounds to me like it's time for someone to test the feed.
Would you like me to send you a sample to test?

I will read your other link later and get back to you.
Thanks again.
Liz

 

[ibetyamissedme]

Sir loin what ethanol plant produced the feed in question?

 

[NC Liz 2]

Sir loin what ethanol plant produced the feed in question?

As I said before.

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.

See: Newman VS A. E. Staley MFG. Co. ( AL )
All manufactures of ethanol are suspect, as they all use sulfur in the manufacturing of ethanol, and ship all over the country as well as the world.
Liz

 

[ibetyamissedme]

Sir loin what ethanol plant produced the feed in question?

As I said before.

Well obviously the first case SL uncover was A. E. Staley MFG. Co.
As yet we ( those of us on the Think Tank ) have not uncovered the suspected last two cases yet.

See: Newman VS A. E. Staley MFG. Co. ( AL )
All manufactures of ethanol are suspect, as they all use sulfur in the manufacturing of ethanol, and ship all over the country as well as the world.
Liz

Sir loin as I asked before what was the name of the ethanol plant that produced the feed in question. AE Staley is a very diversified company. Please provide me with the name and location of the ethanol plant the produced the feed in question. After all you are a member of the think tank right? When you use a court case to bash something obviously you know all the facts right? Like what plant produced the feed in question right?

 

[NC Liz 2]

ibetyamissedme
Why can't you do your own research if you fell you have a right/need to know? It's all on the web! And on CT boards.
If I give it to you all you will do is go into denial. Just maybe if you do a little work on your own, it may become more meaningful to you.
All you have to do is Google "A. E. Staley manufacturing co" and you will find the answers to all you question, and more.
Let me know when you find out who the parent co is so I know you have actually tried, then maybe I will help you from there.
Liz

Edited to add:

When you use a court case to bash

BASH???
I am bashing no one! All I am doing is providing you facts from public records.
Liz

 

[OakCreekRanch]

Sounds like Liz cannot give an answer for that question.

 

[NC Liz 2]

OH FOR GOD SAKE!
Here!
Google: A. E. Staley manufacturing co
TADA!
http://start.cortera.com/company/resear ... turing-co/

Now what the he11 was so hard about that?
Now you're on your own. Or would you like to stay with you and hold your hand?
Bazinga!
Liz

 

[ibetyamissedme]

OH FOR GOD SAKE!
Here!
Google: A. E. Staley manufacturing co
TADA!
http://start.cortera.com/company/resear ... turing-co/

Now what the be nice was so hard about that?
Now you're on your own. Or would you like to stay with you and hold your hand?
Bazinga!
Liz

You better hold my hand, because regardless if this feed from the ethanol plant was actually the cause or not, you have made one thing very clear, this feed must have been some magical kind of stuff. And magic makes me scared.