Angus. I don't get this...........

[robert]

the junk of the 80's was an abberation in most breeds, and pretty safe to say that most of that crap got washed away.

The bulls listed can be found in many, many pedigrees today, if I had the ability I'd put photo's of at least some of those bulls up for comparison, I doubt fat hogs would be accurate. The Angus breed has always had good big bulls, fads and fashion have determined how much they got used but over time you have to come back to some semblence of form and functionality. If I could go back I'd use bulls like Jeshurun, The Black Knight and Ballot in a heartbeat. Quality never gets old.

 

[Jovid]

I will agree that anyone that thinks Angus has never diluted its bloodlines with some other breeds along the way is dillusional.

Amen on that a big Angus bull weighed 800-900 pounds and poof they went to 2000 pounds overnight.
It is impossible to put that much frame on what they started with without something else.

Somebody stuck something in the woodpile.

How about the 1988 Denver Grand Champion Angus Bull. Weighed 2527 lbs at 32 mos. of age. He was a Frame 10+ bull.

 

[Kingfisher]

Ballot of Belladrum c. 1954 1850lbs at maturity, can be found in many popular pedigrees today.

Conan of Wye c.1963 yrling wt of 1243lbs

Emulation 31 c. 1968 yrling wt 1319lbs

Sayre Patriot c. 1976 wean wt. 765lbs, yrling wt 1220

PS Power Play c. 1977 mature wt 2640

just a few of those influential " little" angus

Good morning. Have you got any examples that are not 30 plus years old? I guess in terms of genetics 30 years
is not that long.

 

[Kingfisher]

The problem I have seen at the sale barn if it's black it sells for more no matter if it's crap or not.

Friday a week ago it was different. Angus 5 month bred solid teeth were bringing anywhere from $600 to as high as $825. The same brindles were bringing $900 on up. It went on for a couple of hours. This was the Dublin, TX sale barn.

Why?? Was it the quality of the brindles or just happenstance?

 

[ALACOWMAN]

turn him gray he'd pass as a chianina,,,, seems like chi.. had their peak popularity during the eighties.. lota people wanting to get their cattle off the ground, well they did it.. now their wanting to slam em again

 

[ALACOWMAN]

The problem I have seen at the sale barn if it's black it sells for more no matter if it's crap or not.

Friday a week ago it was different. Angus 5 month bred solid teeth were bringing anywhere from $600 to as high as $825. The same brindles were bringing $900 on up. It went on for a couple of hours. This was the Dublin, TX sale barn.

Why?? Was it the quality of the brindles or just happenstance?

nope,, its the united state of Texas :cowboy:

 

[vclavin]

Ballot of Belladrum c. 1954 1850lbs at maturity, can be found in many popular pedigrees today.

Conan of Wye c.1963 yrling wt of 1243lbs

Emulation 31 c. 1968 yrling wt 1319lbs

Sayre Patriot c. 1976 wean wt. 765lbs, yrling wt 1220

PS Power Play c. 1977 mature wt 2640

just a few of those influential " little" angus

Good morning. Have you got any examples that are not 30 plus years old? I guess in terms of genetics 30 years
is not that long.

My old herd bull, a son of Fame, was 2740lbs when we sold him. He was a 7.1 frame and NOT fat. When standing on the scale his feet were at each edge of the 8' long platform with his head extending several feet further. We had to back him on the scale in order to weigh him.
Valerie

 

[Kingfisher]

"You can also make the argument that the CAB brand is deceptive, but I don't believe that was the intent from the beginning. It's what those other breeds did that has caused the deception, not what the Angus people did."

I know what you want to say but.......".how can what the other breeds did " cause deception? They still get certified by a process from the association. Supply and demand causes greed I suppose.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

"You can also make the argument that the CAB brand is deceptive, but I don't believe that was the intent from the beginning. It's what those other breeds did that has caused the deception, not what the Angus people did."I know what you want to say but.......".how can what the other breeds did " cause deception? They still get certified by a process from the association. Supply and demand causes greed I suppose.

looks like you do get it after all

 

[robert]

Ballot of Belladrum c. 1954 1850lbs at maturity, can be found in many popular pedigrees today.

Conan of Wye c.1963 yrling wt of 1243lbs

Emulation 31 c. 1968 yrling wt 1319lbs

Sayre Patriot c. 1976 wean wt. 765lbs, yrling wt 1220

PS Power Play c. 1977 mature wt 2640

just a few of those influential " little" angus

Good morning. Have you got any examples that are not 30 plus years old? I guess in terms of genetics 30 years
is not that long.

Of course but the post was in response to the erroneous claim that Angus were traditionally little 900lb puds and to assert that it was only the introduction of outside blood that gave them size, when this is clearly not the case.

 

[KMacGinley]

10905374 Grubbs Mckensie ; heard this was a rather TALL Angus bull. Know nothing else about him.
If Holstein was used for size - I heard this as well), you'd have thought milk EPD's would have soared as well.
Valerie

I believe they have.

 

[vclavin]

10905374 Grubbs Mckensie ; heard this was a rather TALL Angus bull. Know nothing else about him.
If Holstein was used for size - I heard this as well), you'd have thought milk EPD's would have soared as well.
Valerie

I believe they have.

How in the world would you go about checking on Holstein, or any other breed for that matter, that may have been introduced? Most pedigrees start in mid air with just that animal and no way to know bloodlines back.
Valerie

 

[Jovid]

10905374 Grubbs Mckensie ; heard this was a rather TALL Angus bull. Know nothing else about him.
If Holstein was used for size - I heard this as well), you'd have thought milk EPD's would have soared as well.
Valerie

I believe they have.

How in the world would you go about checking on Holstein, or any other breed for that matter, that may have been introduced? Most pedigrees start in mid air with just that animal and no way to know bloodlines back.
Valerie

This is where the problem starts. The person registering the animal is the one that states which bull and which cow the calf was out of. So I breed some Angus cows to a Holstein bull and a couple of the calves are all black and bigger that my other calves. All I have to do is register them as being out of my registered Angus bull and like magic the size of my registered Angus calves have now increased.

The integrity of the breed is only as good as the integrity of the breeders. Angus didn't get to be a frame score 10 by breeding Angus to Angus.

 

[vclavin]

10905374 Grubbs Mckensie ; heard this was a rather TALL Angus bull. Know nothing else about him.
If Holstein was used for size - I heard this as well), you'd have thought milk EPD's would have soared as well.
Valerie

I believe they have.

How in the world would you go about checking on Holstein, or any other breed for that matter, that may have been introduced? Most pedigrees start in mid air with just that animal and no way to know bloodlines back.
Valerie

This is where the problem starts. The person registering the animal is the one that states which bull and which cow the calf was out of. So I breed some Angus cows to a Holstein bull and a couple of the calves are all black and bigger that my other calves. All I have to do is register them as being out of my registered Angus bull and like magic the size of my registered Angus calves have now increased.

The integrity of the breed is only as good as the integrity of the breeders. Angus didn't get to be a frame score 10 by breeding Angus to Angus.[/quote]
Don't see how anyone in their right mind would want a bull large enough to walk over the fences!!!
Anyway. Since we have dna profiling now, think it would be possible to see what is in a certain animal/bloodline using the dairy dna. I was thinking each breed has a specific dna profile. Or would you think it is too diluted now to show up?
Valerie

 

[Jovid]

Since we have dna profiling now, think it would be possible to see what is in a certain animal/bloodline using the dairy dna. I was thinking each breed has a specific dna profile. Or would you think it is too diluted now to show up?
Valerie

DNA testing does not have the capability to differentiate breeds. There are no breed specific DNA profiles. Once again you have to "believe" the person that is registering the animal is honest and would never lie about the sire or dam of the calf.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Of course but the post was in response to the erroneous claim that Angus were traditionally little 900lb puds and to assert that it was only the introduction of outside blood that gave them size, when this is clearly not the case.

900 was pretty big for the angus I remember back in my youth.

 

[Dylan Biggs]

Here is an 1980's model "Angus" bull from Canada sold for big money to a breeder in Texas.

 

[vclavin]

Since we have dna profiling now, think it would be possible to see what is in a certain animal/bloodline using the dairy dna. I was thinking each breed has a specific dna profile. Or would you think it is too diluted now to show up?
Valerie

DNA testing does not have the capability to differentiate breeds. There are no breed specific DNA profiles. Once again you have to "believe" the person that is registering the animal is honest and would never lie about the sire or dam of the calf.

I sure hope cattleman and honesty can remain in the same sentence and does not become a joke like Lawyer and honest in the same sentence :lol2:

You mean they have not completely profiled all the breeds yet? I know you can get this profile on dogs to determine what breeds they are and you can get this for humans to find out your heritage. I thought they had this for cattle too.
Valerie

 

[ALACOWMAN]

dam,, you can almost see all the landscape behind him...

 

[robert]

there's a world of difference between a breeder of cattle and a marketing, multiplying hype-ster.....

the most important item on any certificate of pedigree is the name of the breeder, if you don't trust that, what is the paper really worth?