5 yrs for burning 139 acres of BLM

[True Grit Farms]

TB, he just didn't seem like that type of guy. Where's LaVoy's body? And the family should know how many times he was shot, and where his truck is and what it looks like. The country sure hasn't heard much out of his family, just like the Hammonds, why?

 

[Cross-7]

I just feel there are better ways than to take a man's life

Think about it
All they did was camp at a government building
Is that worth killing someone ?

I had always wondered how when evil comes into power why people would be loyal and they always have such a following

Cross like it not the man that got killed wanted to get killed. Now he's a martyr instead of in prison and everybody else is left to clean up the mess.

I agree. He could have laid face down in snow at any point and be alive today but he kept pushing

 

[JMJ Farms]

TB, he just didn't seem like that type of guy. Where's LaVoy's body? And the family should know how many times he was shot, and where his truck is and what it looks like. The country sure hasn't heard much out of his family, just like the Hammonds, why?

We are like a bunch of cows. They feed us only what they want to.

 

[farmguy]

"I had always wondered how when evil comes into power why people would be loyal and they always have such a following"

Evil is in the eye of the beholder. To me evil is someone who threatens violence, ignores the law, intimidates people, makes their own rules all for own profit or their own agenda. I did not vote for our president or governor so I should ignore laws? We either have a rule of law that is enforced or we have chaos as we see in the middle east. In a democracy or a republic, if you will, no one should be completely happy. Our laws are compromise between many ideologies and interests. Also I am a Viet Nam vet and I know decisions have to be made in a fraction of a second by our law officers. The rest of us can be Monday morning quarterbacks. When someone reaches for a weapon you have less than a second to make a decision. I have seen the video. thank you

 

[gimpyrancher]

It's reportedly costing the Taxpayers, mostly Oregon Taxpayers, $100,000 per week. Heck yes they should pay the costs. With an already poor economy, the locals don't need any help raising costs.

PS: This whole recent event started with old man Bundy's "event." If the feds had charged them for those costs, perhaps they might have thought twice about coming to Oregon back in October threatening future violence. When lives lost and as these families financial ruins start piling up, perhaps a fight not involving threats of death (protesters to LEO) will be the fight of choice in the future. Violence brings violence. Just as the video proves.

Farmguy, Thanks for your Service. I'm sorry you understand.

 

[fenceman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwHxUvMbIIw

I had my wife watch this video. Her response was, that woman is afraid.
To afraid to say what she wants to say.

 

[Cross-7]

The whole idea was ignorant and ill concocted
No way the the government was going hand over the lands to the states because they took over a building in the refuge.

But I can understand why they were protesting against the BLM
This all started with the sentencing of the Hammonds and escalated from there.
Or may be with Cliven Bundy and the 50 other ranchers that lost their allotment to the desert tortoise.
There have been many cases that the public is unaware of

They brought attention to what's happening
They could have protested in the streets of Burns or taken it to Washington and got they're message out there.
Formed a committee, hired an attorney and filed a suit

Heck most anything would have better than what they chose.

Now one man is dead the rest are in jail. They are most likely in financial ruin and left their families to suffer the consequences all alone.

Very poorly thought out

 

[Ryder]

I'm certainly sympathetic to the ranchers although I don't completely understand all this.
But it seems to me like some citizens sort of went overboard when they didn't have to and it backfired.

"Don't Take Your Guns to Town Son. Leave Your Guns at Home."

I'm from dairy country and when I was a little boy the dairymen formed a union and went on strike against the milk plants. New Orleans was the biggest market.
Road blocks were set up by armed men to stop trucks from bringing in out of state milk.
Dairymen would milk their cows and pour the milk in the ditches.
Calves and hogs were very well fed.
Milk was being brought in by train in the mail car. They held up the train, broke into the mail car (federal) and dumped the milk.
Fortunately nobody got shot.
The strike failed and a lot of good men had a vacation in the pen.
Seeing that has made me very wary of getting all fired up in a group and jumping the gun without the outcome being well thought out.


There may come a time for armed revolution. But it's not now.

 

[True Grit Farms]

We'll the one thing that I've seen and learned is that the government isn't playing nice. And I don't think the BLM has nothing on the EPA. When the time comes you need to be prepared to do what you think needs to be done. It's going take a a few more of these events to get the ball rolling, but I do believe that the ball is out of the closet.

 

[Cross-7]

I see it as a way how not to handle it
We've been through one civil war.
That is the last thing we need
But this whole government overreach( I guess that's the term) needs to be addressed

The scary part is I really have no idea as a whole how to address it
As you alluded to the EPA and its agenda could put us all in jeopardy

All I know to do is take care of me and mine, but if the rules and regulations get to where I can't do that and my livelyhood and my life are at risk I might see it differently

 

[Bigfoot]

I hope nobody gets me wrong.

I'm not condoning what they did, or how they did it.

Lavoy's actions on that afternoon, led to what happened.

I do think they they drew attention to a problem that wasn't getting attention.

I also think that worse occurs everyday.

I also don't appreciate being spoon fed one side of the confrontation. Whatever the truth is, even if it's the original narration of the video, that's fine. I'd like to see a more detailed report. Just like fenceman said. Even if they got scared and starting shooting, if that's what happened, then I can handle the truth. If I was standing in the middle of that rode, I might would have shot to.

I also think this hits close to home for some of us, and not others. It involves values, land, family, livestock, and a way of life. This wasn't about drugs. It wasn't about knocking over a liquor store. This was people that made a stand for something they believed in. However be it a poorly thought out not well executed plan, that ended in tragedy.

I hope it never happens to me and mine. I hope we never have to decide that we are tired of crawfishing, but we've all taken steps backwards on the moral ground in the last few years. At some point, more people are going to decide that they've back pedaled as far as they are going to go.

 

[OwnedByTheCow]

So ,I think I'm gonna give up trying to follow this and ask for a summary when this is all over. LOL :lol:

 

[Caustic Burno]

I hope nobody gets me wrong.

I'm not condoning what they did, or how they did it.

Lavoy's actions on that afternoon, led to what happened.

I do think they they drew attention to a problem that wasn't getting attention.

I also think that worse occurs everyday.

I also don't appreciate being spoon fed one side of the confrontation. Whatever the truth is, even if it's the original narration of the video, that's fine. I'd like to see a more detailed report. Just like fenceman said. Even if they got scared and starting shooting, if that's what happened, then I can handle the truth. If I was standing in the middle of that rode, I might would have shot to.

I also think this hits close to home for some of us, and not others. It involves values, land, family, livestock, and a way of life. This wasn't about drugs. It wasn't about knocking over a liquor store. This was people that made a stand for something they believed in. However be it a poorly thought out not well executed plan, that ended in tragedy.

I hope it never happens to me and mine. I hope we never have to decide that we are tired of crawfishing, but we've all taken steps backwards on the moral ground in the last few years. At some point, more people are going to decide that they've back pedaled as far as they are going to go.

Amen brother amen.
Great post

 

[dun]

Evil is in the eye of the beholder. To me evil is someone who threatens violence, ignores the law, intimidates people, makes their own rules all for own profit or their own agenda.

You mean like our founding fathers?

 

[Cross-7]

Very good post BF
Most of us it hasn't hit home. Same way the guys along the Red River in Texas felt.
Then the BLM steps in and says hey we're moving the property line from the south bank to the high water mark that's a 1/2 mile into your property that you bought and paid for and have paid taxes on for years.
That's ours now so you need to vacate the property

That type thing and many more like it is why the people are against the BLM

 

[JMJ Farms]

It's reportedly costing the Taxpayers, mostly Oregon Taxpayers, $100,000 per week. Heck yes they should pay the costs. With an already poor economy, the locals don't need any help raising costs.

PS: This whole recent event started with old man Bundy's "event." If the feds had charged them for those costs, perhaps they might have thought twice about coming to Oregon back in October threatening future violence. When lives lost and as these families financial ruins start piling up, perhaps a fight not involving threats of death (protesters to LEO) will be the fight of choice in the future. Violence brings violence. Just as the video proves.

Farmguy, Thanks for your Service. I'm sorry you understand.

Thank your local and federal authorities that are so effective at liberally overspending taxpayers dollars. Didn't have to cost anything.

Bigfoot, good post. Very well thought out and expressed.

 

[Kathie in Thorp]

Take-over, by armed people, saying they would be willing to die. Take-over of a federal building -- not just a building, but a place of business where people went to work every day and did their jobs. And the armed "peaceful" protestors took it over, stopped the day-to-day work there, guarded the access with guns, as they went through the files and other information/some Native American relics stored there. And traveled all over that site (that they'd blocked off) that provided access to local cattle people, their cattle, and water for their cattle; and over Native sites special to them. Those arrested deserved it and should have seen it coming. They were offered safe movement out. OUT! Not back and forth -- not trying to run their program from town to town, and keeping that federal facility tied down, and the whole community shook up. Damm right, they got stopped on a highway and someone got killed trying to run a road block. What did they expect? It started with WE WON'T LEAVE, WE'LL DIE FIRST! They got what they asked for. FBI/State people did NOT move in on the Range encampent; did not move at other public meetings. This craap does not go on forever before it comes to an end. Feds STILL have not moved in to remove the other 4 sitting there. The people in the truck(s) cannot get a straight story put together about what happened. I remain same about this -- waiting for the official reports.

 

[W.T]

Burns Oregon is little more than a ghost town. They have sold more motel rooms, more restaurant meals, and more liquor in the bars in the last 30 days than they have sold in the last five years. All they had to do was IGNORE the Bundys.. Today 200 of the Pacific Patriots are there sleeping and eating until they leave. This all adds up to a financial boom for Harney County Oregon. In 1990"s The AIM came to town to protest the Horse gather from The Dann ranches. There were many different Indian rights groups here with guns and god only knows what else. I remember one of the Danns Grabbing a FBI agent and pouring gas over both of them and pulling out a cigarette lighter. Things got pretty wild. But the local Sherriff kept his cool and didn't allow the BLM cops to do anything. I still admire that local Sherriff things could have gone south real quick. In the end Russell Means and Dennis Banks were part of the crowd. And they have proven they have little regard for the FBI. So this entire deal of how dangerous the Bundys are is blown way out of proportion.

 

[Kathie in Thorp]

Burns Oregon is little more than a ghost town. They have sold more motel rooms, more restaurant meals, and more liquor in the bars in the last 30 days than they have sold in the last five years. All they had to do was IGNORE the Bundys.. Today 200 of the Pacific Patriots are there sleeping and eating until they leave. This all adds up to a financial boom for Harney County Oregon. In 1990"s The AIM came to town to protest the Horse gather from The Dann ranches. There were many different Indian rights groups here with guns and god only knows what else. I remember one of the Danns Grabbing a FBI agent and pouring gas over both of them and pulling out a cigarette lighter. Things got pretty wild. But the local Sherriff kept his cool and didn't allow the BLM cops to do anything. I still admire that local Sherriff things could have gone south real quick. In the end Russell Means and Dennis Banks were part of the crowd. And they have proven they have little regard for the FBI. So this entire deal of how dangerous the Bundys are is blown way out of proportion.

Burns is not a ghost town. Where did you get that from, WT? It's small town USA. But they just need to quit -- the Bundys and followers there. Harney county motels and restaurants have business, but not the way they'd like to have business. Means and Banks were there ??? If so, it gets crazier.

 

[W.T]

1970 3,293 −6.5%
1980 3,579 8.7%
1990 2,913 −18.6%
2000 3,064 5.2%
2010 2,806 −8.4%
Est. 2014 2,722 [26] −3.0%

Burns Oregon population from 1970 to current levels. I was there in December to visit relatives. It is a Vastly different community than it was in the 1990's vacant buildings and no manufacturing jobs left. It is similar to many small towns across America, no money no jobs and little hope to create new jobs. In 1990 there was 20,000 people in Harney County Oregon and today there are 7,260. I don't see that as a thriving community. Too much Government regulations and EPA restrictions have turned Harney County into a stagnant community. I can remember several lumber mills. Today there are none. So today I see Burns Oregon as little more than a ghost town of a once wonderful thriving small American community.