NCSU Maverick
Well-known member
What's a good white faced homo black simmental bull to breed to angus type cows? Mostly for feeder calves but maybe some replacements?
Simmental bull?
- Thread starter NCSU Maverick
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NoCO
Member
Take a look at Mo Better. He is a Genex bull and his EPD's are on Genex website.
Red Bull Breeder
Well-known member
Just got to ask why the bull has tobe Homo black to breed angus type cattle. If the cows are heavy enough angus you should get black calves out of most any bull.
Avalon
Well-known member
I really like the SVF Star Power Calves. I know that Bovine Elite carries him.
OP
OP
NCSU Maverick
Well-known member
95% sure that's who we're going to use. I didn't mention his name because I wanted to get honest opinions, but since the first response was in favor of him, i guess we're on the same page.
Not all of the herd is heavy enough angus. Some of the cows go back to or are out of a heterozygous simmy bull.
NCSU Maverick":2lx4yj0k said:
MO BETTER M217
CE Brth Wean Year MCE Milk MWW Stay CW YG Marb BF REA Shr API TI
EPD 4.4 1.6 35.5 80.9 7.1 3.4 21.2 22.6 11.0 0.10 0.26 0.02 -0.01 0.07 117.5 65.9
ACC 0.65 0.84 0.78 0.74 0.23 0.46 0.47 0.14 0.55 0.55 0.37 0.46 0.34 0.03
1. MO BETTER DOES HAVE A BLAZE FACE WHICH I DOUBT WILL SHOW IN ANGUS CROSS CALVES
2. I DONT LIKE HIS CALVING EASE
3. WW EPD IS A BIT WEAK ESPECIALLY WITH HIS CED BEING SO LOW (BIGGER AT BIRTH)
4. YW IS DECENT BUT WOULD LIKE TO SEE HIS ACCURACIES IN THE 90'S
5. HE IS A 6 YR OLD BULL AND DOESNT HAVE MUCH PROGENY TO COMPARE WITH OTHER SIRES, WHICH LEADS ME TO BELIEVE IT IS BECAUSE OF WEAK NUMBERS.
6. HIS MM EPD IS ABOUT RIGHT
7. M217'S SIRE (MR MOMENTUM H508 WAS A TWIN) AND HIS CED DATA IS NOT COMPLETE
8. MO BETTER JUST CAN'T COMPETE WITH OTHER SIMM SIRES LIKE:
LUCKY MAN 644N, GW LUCKYONE 686K, DIKEMANS SURE BET, TNT JUMPSTART, WS BEEFMAKER, CNS DREAM ON, OR PODEROSA REY
ALL PURPOSE INDEX (API) IS 117.5 AND IS BELOW PAR
TOTAL INDEX (TI) IS WAY, WAY, WAY, BELOW PAR
I FEEL LIKE THE ONLY REASON YOU ARE CONSIDERING THIS SIRE IS BECAUSE OF THE BLAZE FACE , WHICH YOU WILL NOT GET USING HIM ON ANGUS COWS--- PLUS HIS NUMBERS JUST AREN'T ANY GOOD.....
T
novatech
Well-known member
What do you hope to gain with the white face. Just curious.NCSU Maverick":iavh2jg6 said:
Jeanne - Simme Valley
Well-known member
I have heard the Mo Better calves were good.
As Tophand pointed out, his CE isn't that good for the breed. But he has other traits that are really good.
His YrWt is in the top 4%
His Maternal CE is in top 4%
Stay is top 10%
Carcass wt top 8%
His All Purpose Index is in top 12%
and his Terminal Index is in top 15%
His REA & Shear Force are in the pits.
So, depends on what your are looking for, which I assume you are looking for more than a white face - which I disagree - you should get a fair amount of white faces out of predominantly Angus cows.
As Tophand pointed out, his CE isn't that good for the breed. But he has other traits that are really good.
His YrWt is in the top 4%
His Maternal CE is in top 4%
Stay is top 10%
Carcass wt top 8%
His All Purpose Index is in top 12%
and his Terminal Index is in top 15%
His REA & Shear Force are in the pits.
So, depends on what your are looking for, which I assume you are looking for more than a white face - which I disagree - you should get a fair amount of white faces out of predominantly Angus cows.
TheBullLady
Well-known member
Mo Better is good, but his 1/2 brother Mo Town is better. Mo Town has better bone, and I believe his numbers are better also. I have a heifers out of both.
I don't care for Star Power, as his calves are not consistent, which I think is important. Dream On is a waste on Angus in my opinion. Have you looked at SHS Enhancer? I saw him in Denver, and he is FINE.
My first choice would be Meyer 734, but semen is $$.
I don't care for Star Power, as his calves are not consistent, which I think is important. Dream On is a waste on Angus in my opinion. Have you looked at SHS Enhancer? I saw him in Denver, and he is FINE.
My first choice would be Meyer 734, but semen is $$.
NAME COL CE API TI WW YW MK
SR SR SR SR SR EPD EPD EPD
BM RED 11.0 145 80 47 66 10.0 WS Beef Maker Simm
RD DR RED 16.0 147 76 31 56 10.0 Red Dream Simm
SB BLK 16.4 150 81 43 74 -1.9 Dikeman's Sure Bet Simm
TNTJS BLK 20.3 155 77 29 57 13.0 TNT Jumpstart Simm
MB BLK 4.4 117 66 35 81 3.4 Mo Better Simm
MT BLK 10.2 118 58 18 49 3.9 Mo Town Simm
SHS EH BLK 9.2 92 64 40 69 1.4 SHS Enhancer
CNS DO BLK 15.1 137 74 35 55 0.6 CNS Dream On
Mo Better has bad CED
His API is pretty bad as we have broodcows with higher API's than that.
His TI is pathetic too as the Breed average for Simm is 62
His WW is 35 but with Low accuracies.
His YW is good but with Low accuracies
His MM is ok but again with Low Accuracies.
Mo Town is even worse than his half brother
Good CED but accuracies in the 0.30 range (no help here)
His API is again pretty bad ( same as above for Mo Better
His TI is pathetic he should have been castrated at birth since Breed average is 62
His WW is also Pathetic
His YW is also Pathetic
His MM is ok I guess for a Loser.
SHS Enhancer is even worse than Mo Town
Good CED but with very Low accuracies in the 0.20 range
His API is Pathietic he should have been steered at birth Breed avg is 92
His TI is Pathetic again he should have been castrated at birth Breed average is 62
His WW is 40 but with accuracies in the 0.18 range (not feasible)
His YW is OK but with accuracies again at 0.20
His MM is 1.4 with accuracies in the 0.18 range
I do understand that this Bull is just a 2 yr old and he has no Progeny as yet, but his Stay is Pathetic at 12.3 and there is no way he can compete with other Bulls Like Dream On or Beef Maker or Lucky Man or Sure Bet.
For an Example>>>>
Look at CNS Dream On--EPD 15.1 -1.1 34.5 54.9 11.5 0.6 17.8 19.3 -7.1 0.05 0.49 0.05 0.15 -0.13 137.3 74.4
ACC 0.93 0.97 0.96 0.96 0.91 0.94 0.94 0.26 0.61 0.61 0.83 0.86 0.83 0.27
CED = 15.1 Acc (0.93)
BW = -1.1 Acc (0.97)
WW = 35 Acc (0.96)
YW = 55 Acc (0.96)
MM = 0.6 Acc (0.94) you may say hey that isn't that good, but you aren't thinking --- Simmental cows have no shortage of Milk-- we don't need a sire that shows a huge MM..
His Stay is 19.3, His MCE is 11.5 Acc (0.91) and his Marbling is +0.49 with an Acc of 0.83.
T
SR SR SR SR SR EPD EPD EPD
BM RED 11.0 145 80 47 66 10.0 WS Beef Maker Simm
RD DR RED 16.0 147 76 31 56 10.0 Red Dream Simm
SB BLK 16.4 150 81 43 74 -1.9 Dikeman's Sure Bet Simm
TNTJS BLK 20.3 155 77 29 57 13.0 TNT Jumpstart Simm
MB BLK 4.4 117 66 35 81 3.4 Mo Better Simm
MT BLK 10.2 118 58 18 49 3.9 Mo Town Simm
SHS EH BLK 9.2 92 64 40 69 1.4 SHS Enhancer
CNS DO BLK 15.1 137 74 35 55 0.6 CNS Dream On
Mo Better has bad CED
His API is pretty bad as we have broodcows with higher API's than that.
His TI is pathetic too as the Breed average for Simm is 62
His WW is 35 but with Low accuracies.
His YW is good but with Low accuracies
His MM is ok but again with Low Accuracies.
Mo Town is even worse than his half brother
Good CED but accuracies in the 0.30 range (no help here)
His API is again pretty bad ( same as above for Mo Better
His TI is pathetic he should have been castrated at birth since Breed average is 62
His WW is also Pathetic
His YW is also Pathetic
His MM is ok I guess for a Loser.
SHS Enhancer is even worse than Mo Town
Good CED but with very Low accuracies in the 0.20 range
His API is Pathietic he should have been steered at birth Breed avg is 92
His TI is Pathetic again he should have been castrated at birth Breed average is 62
His WW is 40 but with accuracies in the 0.18 range (not feasible)
His YW is OK but with accuracies again at 0.20
His MM is 1.4 with accuracies in the 0.18 range
I do understand that this Bull is just a 2 yr old and he has no Progeny as yet, but his Stay is Pathetic at 12.3 and there is no way he can compete with other Bulls Like Dream On or Beef Maker or Lucky Man or Sure Bet.
For an Example>>>>
Look at CNS Dream On--EPD 15.1 -1.1 34.5 54.9 11.5 0.6 17.8 19.3 -7.1 0.05 0.49 0.05 0.15 -0.13 137.3 74.4
ACC 0.93 0.97 0.96 0.96 0.91 0.94 0.94 0.26 0.61 0.61 0.83 0.86 0.83 0.27
CED = 15.1 Acc (0.93)
BW = -1.1 Acc (0.97)
WW = 35 Acc (0.96)
YW = 55 Acc (0.96)
MM = 0.6 Acc (0.94) you may say hey that isn't that good, but you aren't thinking --- Simmental cows have no shortage of Milk-- we don't need a sire that shows a huge MM..
His Stay is 19.3, His MCE is 11.5 Acc (0.91) and his Marbling is +0.49 with an Acc of 0.83.
T
bulldealer
Well-known member
Hey Tophand,
Are you an ABS rep?
Are you an ABS rep?
No, but have been breeding Simms and Ang for a long time and not all those Bulls are from ABSbulldealer":2hcl1o6k said:
TNT JumpStart is from Select Sires
Also it just amazes me that some people have omitted looking in their own Sire Summaries...
This info is everywhere and for Simms all you have to to is go directly to
http://herdbook.simmental.org/simmapp/servlet/simmapp/template/anmsrch%2CAnmSrch.vm;jsessionid=3E3BEFCAB8E6AFB35AF74EA2B321C5B1.tomcat2
T
