Simmental bull

[Ky hills]

Looked at sone Simmental bulls yesterday.
Was real impressed with the outfit, and their cattle.
Really liked this bull, picture doesn't do him justice when seeing him in person, but his sheath looks like a concern to me.
Does it look like a potential problem or am over thinking it.

 

[Silver]

I don't see anything to be concerned about. Good looking bull.

 

[Warren Allison]

I don't see anything wrong with this bull, Ky. If the price is right,. get him.

 

[50/50Farms]

Looks like one we had named Bud. Made great calves.

 

[coachg]

Looks like normal bull gear .

 

[Ky hills]

He was coming in and out, and with hanging loose we were concerned, cause we've had a couple bulls that got part injured. Other bulls there were doing that too, probably just being young bulls He was the most pronounced in that area, others were cleaner made. Like I said we really like the bull. He is a tank and seems like everything you want in a beef bull.

 

[coachg]

Sounds like he's a teenager and is proud of his junk .

 

[50/50Farms]

He was coming in and out, and with hanging loose we were concerned, cause we've had a couple bulls that got part injured. Other bulls there were doing that too, probably just being young bulls He was the most pronounced in that area, others were cleaner made. Like I said we really like the bull. He is a tank and seems like everything you want in a beef bull.

I wouldn't be too worried.

 

[simme]

95# birth weight?

 

[Ky hills]

95# birth weight?

If I remember and heard right I think it 88.

 

[simme]

Based on the info, thinking this might be the bull?

 

[Ky hills]

Based on the info, thinking this might be the bull?

Might be, thanks, I didn't look at any papers. How does that bull look pedigree wise, I know nothing about Simmental pedigrees or numbers.

 

[chaded]

I see what your saying on the sheath and I have to admit I am not a fan of it but I have seen way worse. Not sure I'd let it stop me from buying him though?

 

[wbvs58]

I can only see the one photo of him beside the gate and the rail seems to blend in with his tackle. I can't make out whether it is mostly hair or skin there.

Ken

 

[simme]

As far as pedigree, there are plenty of recognizable bulls in the pedigree. And some angus ones back 3 to 4 generations. Traveler, some Ohlde lines, Champion Hill. Overall, not a calving ease pedigree. The % row under the epd's and the accuracies show the numbers relative to all simmentals in the database. Low numbers are near the top of the breed. High numbers are near the bottom. A % of 20 means top 20% of breed for the trait. A % of 80 means bottom 20% for the trait. The bull has been dna tested and the epd's enhanced based on the dna. Should be more accurate epd's due to the dna.

The craigslist ad has a second picture looking straight on the bull from the front. Looks to me that he is a little wide in the shoulders. Birth weight, epd for CE and BW, and wider shoulders would say to me to be cautious on what he would be bred to.

 

[Ky hills]

As far as pedigree, there are plenty of recognizable bulls in the pedigree. And some angus ones back 3 to 4 generations. Traveler, some Ohlde lines, Champion Hill. Overall, not a calving ease pedigree. The % row under the epd's and the accuracies show the numbers relative to all simmentals in the database. Low numbers are near the top of the breed. High numbers are near the bottom. A % of 20 means top 20% of breed for the trait. A % of 80 means bottom 20% for the trait. The bull has been dna tested and the epd's enhanced based on the dna. Should be more accurate epd's due to the dna.

The craigslist ad has a second picture looking straight on the bull from the front. Looks to me that he is a little wide in the shoulders. Birth weight, epd for CE and BW, and wider shoulders would say to me to be cautious on what he would be bred to.


View attachment 28883

Yeah, I definitely would not breed heifers to him just based on visual appraisal.

 

[Josher]

We had a limousine bull with similar sheath and he only lasted a month into breeding snagged it on some brush while breeding I think. I would keep him away from bush as much as possible during the peak of breeding season would be my pleasure only suggestion. Nice bull otherwise

 

[Ky hills]

So if I'm reading the EPD's and across breed EPD's his BW is comparable to Angus bulls like GAR Gridmaker, or SAV Harvestor with +5 something BW?
Milk EPD is in the lowest percentile, yet the cow he is out of looked to have a good udder and milk.

 

[simme]

So if I'm reading the EPD's and across breed EPD's his BW is comparable to Angus bulls like GAR Gridmaker, or SAV Harvestor with +5 something BW?
Milk EPD is in the lowest percentile, yet the cow he is out of looked to have a good udder and milk.

Based on the simmental dna genomic testing I have done, it appears that the milk epd is not included in genomic enhanced epds. That epd did not change on the ones I have done. On this bull, notice that the accuracy listed for the milk epd is only 13%. Accuracies for CE, BW, WW, YH, ADG are around 40% - higher due to the genomic testing. Point is that his milk epd seems to be only based on parent epd's and not very accurate. A visual of his dam and and siblings might be more accurate. Simmental offers a 100k HD genomics test and a microLD test that I think is a 9k test. Note sure which the bull had, but I suspect the low density based on the accuracies shown. No actual weaning weight or yearling weight was submitted for the bull.

This bull has a +3.8 bw epd. Across breed adjustment factor for bw (converts to angus AAA basis) for simmental is +1.9. Add 1.9 to 3.8 to get 5.7. So the across breed estimate is that this bull would be "equal" to a +5.7 for an angus bull.

Another way to compare. There are many angus bulls in the simmental database. I searched the simmental database for an angus bull with a 3.8 bw epd and found Nichols Trust H236. Looked him up in the AAA database and he is +5.4 there (bottom 5% in the AAA database). So similar comparison between the two methods. So yes, this bull would be predicted to be comparable to an angus bull of around a 5.5 bw epd. I don't think there are published numbers for CE epd comparison across breeds. The "experts" advise to place more emphasis on CE epd than BW epd. SAV Harvestor is 4.3 in the simmental database. GAR Gridmaker is 3.3 in the simmental database.

Simmental database also lists genetic conditions under the "Traittrac" button. Status of defects and other genetic conditions of an animal will be shown if available.

 

[Ky hills]

Here is a picture of the dam with her new calf.