Polled Herfs- the next superstar?

[shutskytj]

I know he is horned but I haven't heard DR Achiever mentioned yet. I know semen now is limited but wasn't he a great female bull. I also have a Embracer daughter that I am thrilled with

 

[dun]

We've used legend a bit in the last couple ofyears, won;t do that again. We cross most everything so the cert issue with 774 doesn;t affect us, but I like his calves much better then 242, or the real looser Limited Edition. We used a lot of KCF Bennett H119 and really liked the calves, one did very well at the fair for one of the kids. We also used KCF Bennett E153 but he's dead and his semen is gone. So far he was the Hereford bull I like the best of the ones we've used, even ahead of 774. Calves fattened on droughty pasture and the one heifer we got has turned into a power cow according to the breeders that keep trying to buy her for a recip. She also had a bull calf that did well at the fair.

 

[KNERSIE]

We've used legend a bit in the last couple ofyears, won;t do that again. We cross most everything so the cert issue with 774 doesn;t affect us, but I like his calves much better then 242, or the real looser Limited Edition. We used a lot of KCF Bennett H119 and really liked the calves, one did very well at the fair for one of the kids. We also used KCF Bennett E153 but he's dead and his semen is gone. So far he was the Hereford bull I like the best of the ones we've used, even ahead of 774. Calves fattened on droughty pasture and the one heifer we got has turned into a power cow according to the breeders that keep trying to buy her for a recip. She also had a bull calf that did well at the fair.

dun, are you refering to VIP Limited Edition? I'd like to know more about his calves and in which way they ere disappointing. he himself looked good on the semen catalogue photo if I remember correctly

 

[THG]

I know he is horned but I haven't heard DR Achiever mentioned yet. I know semen now is limited but wasn't he a great female bull. I also have a Embracer daughter that I am thrilled with

Already crowned.

THG

 

[THG]

just my humble opinion, but here goes. Legend 242 is a washout, the daughters aren't good enough in my mind and Progress (legend 242 son) isn't good enough either, re: STRUCTURE PROBLEMS with 242 progeny. P606 isn't there either, too much bw and the growth only comes with a big, deep feed bucket. M326 has half a chance as long as he is used on some bigger cows, I like middle of the road cows, but his daughters may be on the small side. Haven't seen many world class progeny yet, but he has a chance IF he can put a rear end on them. young exciting bulls i would like to see more progeny out of include Kodiak 49j, allendale robin hood, traildust 61l, marshall m33, harland, top secret and churchill yankee.

Have you seen any of the P606 daughters yet, super cows. M326 daughters at Sandhill Farms are darn good ones and are just right for the commercial cowman. Kodiak 49J is a good bull, can't find semen on him, Traildust is a darn good bull, seen him last year at the NJW sale, M33 I think his daughters are outstanding, really like him, Harland looks to be producing some great herd bulls for Mill Creek Ranch, Top Secret, not enough muscle and meat, and Yankee calves will be interesting to see next, I think I am going out to look at them next year at Churchill Cattle Co in Montana. I like Dale and Nancy Venhuizen, breat people and down to earth people. They also raise potatoes for a living.

THG

 

[HerefordSire]

I don't know much about Polled Herefords yet and I study most everything I can get my hands on. I first have to go out of my way here and write about the recent positive contributions of MY and LFF have made in my thinking amongst others on this board. By the way, the "Basis on Line Breeding" book surely supports the idea that line breeding is the only way to go. I would like to also congratulate LFF in that LFF Shurable is now one of the top ranked unproven bulls in the entire country according to the AHA BMI$ statistics. The price has definitely gone up since LFF posted the photos of the bull.

The next male superstar in my view may come from Feltons 517, Feltons Endurance 745, and one other unknown animal, combined. This combination could be line bred over several generations to produce proven EPD numbers of SC 2.0, IMF .40, and REA .50 along with very high maternal values (CE, MCE) inherent of 517. The reason why strictly 517 won't become bigger is because the carcass values are very low although the fertility is close to the best in the industry which is the most important trait. In order for the carcass values to increase the 745 could be crossed with 517 to increase the IMF which is where the industry trend is moving. Therefore, the future superstar could contain REA power combined with 517 and 745. I am trying to figure the REA portion. The ideal bull could be a line bred 517, 745, and possibly Remitall Boomer, EF Fellis, etc.

 

[THG]

I don't know much about Polled Herefords yet and I study most everything I can get my hands on. I first have to go out of my way here and write about the recent positive contributions of MY and LFF have made in my thinking amongst others on this board. By the way, the "Basis on Line Breeding" book surely supports the idea that line breeding is the only way to go. I would like to also congratulate LFF in that LFF Shurable is now one of the top ranked unproven bulls in the entire country according to the AHA BMI$ statistics. The price has definitely gone up since LFF posted the photos of the bull.

The next male superstar in my view may come from Feltons 517, Feltons Endurance 745, and one other unknown animal, combined. This combination could be line bred over several generations to produce proven EPD numbers of SC 2.0, IMF .40, and REA .50 along with very high maternal values (CE, MCE) inherent of 517. The reason why strictly 517 won't become bigger is because the carcass values are very low although the fertility is close to the best in the industry which is the most important trait. In order for the carcass values to increase the 745 could be crossed with 517 to increase the IMF which is where the industry trend is moving. Therefore, the future superstar could contain REA power combined with 517 and 745. I am trying to figure the REA portion. The ideal bull could be a line bred 517, 745, and possibly Remitall Boomer, EF Fellis, etc.

Herefordsire, if your thinking like that, you need to get on a plane and fly to the Mohican West sale, they will be offering Mohican Mint 19M, a Feltons Endurance 745 out of a Remitall Boomer 46B donor cow. His dam, was a big cow and was awesome. That sale is on Sept. 27th, hope to see you there.

THG

 

[THG]

LFF Schurable looks like a bull you need Herefordsire.

THG

 

[DFF]

I haven't seen too many post lately (what I would consider too many ) about Polled Hereford A.I. bulls.

Any thoughts out there which bull is on the way to superstar status? Meaning bulls like 517, Online, 20x, Boomer bulls (46B & 29F), Vindicator.

The Moler bull may have been until he had a blow out. I like M326 but is he a superstar?

Thanks,
Alan

Explain your quote "had a blowout" Thanks

 

[Brandonm2]

Linebreeding "is the way to go" only if the animal you are linebreeding really is worth basing whole cow familys around. IF the foundation sire is mediocre or worse has a fatal hidden flaw you would be much much better off outcrossing. AI makes linebreeding easier that it has ever been (since you can store semen for a human lifetime); but the business of selling semen.....ie the constant need for fresh faces to stimulate semen sells means that new genetics gain and lose favor much faster than previous generations of cattlemen were used to. Having the best cows in the breed is meaningless afterall if you can't market them.

 

[HerefordSire]

Herefordsire, if your thinking like that, you need to get on a plane and fly to the Mohican West sale, they will be offering Mohican Mint 19M, a Feltons Endurance 745 out of a Remitall Boomer 46B donor cow. His dam, was a big cow and was awesome. That sale is on Sept. 27th, hope to see you there.

THG



Good thought THG and welcome back! I always knew you had potential. Potential could be looked at as...not having done anything noteworthy yet... Now is the time to act while we are under 50 year old. If we do act wisely, we could get rid of the word potential to a degree. I have my eye on Mint. I am not so sure about the Boomer side. The 745 and 517 come from the same core proven genes. Mint is for sale? If so, how much do you think a very very sexy lady with a southern draw would have to pay for him for 1/2 interest?

 

[dun]

We've used legend a bit in the last couple ofyears, won;t do that again. We cross most everything so the cert issue with 774 doesn;t affect us, but I like his calves much better then 242, or the real looser Limited Edition. We used a lot of KCF Bennett H119 and really liked the calves, one did very well at the fair for one of the kids. We also used KCF Bennett E153 but he's dead and his semen is gone. So far he was the Hereford bull I like the best of the ones we've used, even ahead of 774. Calves fattened on droughty pasture and the one heifer we got has turned into a power cow according to the breeders that keep trying to buy her for a recip. She also had a bull calf that did well at the fair.

dun, are you refering to VIP Limited Edition? I'd like to know more about his calves and in which way they ere disappointing. he himself looked good on the semen catalogue photo if I remember correctly

Good length with no muscle. QG middle choice YG 5. We used him on a half dozen cows last year and the calves weren;t representitive of the calves they've had before or since when bred to other bulls. 2 years ago we did have one good calf out of him that was a winner at the fair, but the cow could be bred to a chihuahua and throw and raise a big calf.

 

[KNERSIE]

We've used legend a bit in the last couple ofyears, won;t do that again. We cross most everything so the cert issue with 774 doesn;t affect us, but I like his calves much better then 242, or the real looser Limited Edition. We used a lot of KCF Bennett H119 and really liked the calves, one did very well at the fair for one of the kids. We also used KCF Bennett E153 but he's dead and his semen is gone. So far he was the Hereford bull I like the best of the ones we've used, even ahead of 774. Calves fattened on droughty pasture and the one heifer we got has turned into a power cow according to the breeders that keep trying to buy her for a recip. She also had a bull calf that did well at the fair.

dun, are you refering to VIP Limited Edition? I'd like to know more about his calves and in which way they ere disappointing. he himself looked good on the semen catalogue photo if I remember correctly

Good length with no muscle. QG middle choice YG 5. We used him on a half dozen cows last year and the calves weren;t representitive of the calves they've had before or since when bred to other bulls. 2 years ago we did have one good calf out of him that was a winner at the fair, but the cow could be bred to a chihuahua and throw and raise a big calf.

thanks, it just shows how deceiving a profile photo alone can be

 

[Alan]

I haven't seen too many post lately (what I would consider too many ) about Polled Hereford A.I. bulls.

Any thoughts out there which bull is on the way to superstar status? Meaning bulls like 517, Online, 20x, Boomer bulls (46B & 29F), Vindicator.

The Moler bull may have been until he had a blow out. I like M326 but is he a superstar?

Thanks,
Alan

Explain your quote "had a blowout" Thanks

Last year I noticed Molers semen price went from $50 per straw to $500 per straw. I emailed Molers owner to ask if this was correct, he said the Moler bull had developed problems freezing his semen so stock was now limited.

Alan

 

[THG]

Herefordsire, if your thinking like that, you need to get on a plane and fly to the Mohican West sale, they will be offering Mohican Mint 19M, a Feltons Endurance 745 out of a Remitall Boomer 46B donor cow. His dam, was a big cow and was awesome. That sale is on Sept. 27th, hope to see you there.

THG



Good thought THG and welcome back! I always knew you had potential. Potential could be looked at as...not having done anything noteworthy yet... Now is the time to act while we are under 50 year old. If we do act wisely, we could get rid of the word potential to a degree. I have my eye on Mint. I am not so sure about the Boomer side. The 745 and 517 come from the same core proven genes. Mint is for sale? If so, how much do you think a very very sexy lady with a southern draw would have to pay for him for 1/2 interest?

Sounds like you are wanting to purchase Mint? Good Luck! I am going to be at the sale on the 27th of September. Are you going out? Are you coming off saying I don't know nothing, like I am stupid? This comment you wrote, "Potential could be looked at as...not having done anything noteworthy yet... I don't know what you are exactly talking about.

THG

 

[oakcreekfarms]

M326 might be smaller framed himself but look at what he is producing, 6-6.5 frame animals. You don't keep a YW EPD like that if you are producing lower framed animals. Rib eye didn't sell for $34000. Only 1/2 semen interest sold for 34000. Rib eye calves are really nice so far, deep and thick. And they come just a little easier then the M326's. The progress bull is a good bull, lowers BW, smaller frame, I think he is going to produce some tremendous females that will open up your choices for bull selection in regards to frame size.

I think SHF Marshal should have been used more. I own 10 or so and they are nice, but he won't be a superstar because he wasn't used enough.

Personally I liked the channing stuff more then the Moler. A lot of people will use the kudzo bull, I don't know how he will perform. World class seems to be throwing some good cattle, but I think he lacks the marketability in the show ring to be marketed to the masses.

 

[THG]

M326 might be smaller framed himself but look at what he is producing, 6-6.5 frame animals. You don't keep a YW EPD like that if you are producing lower framed animals. Rib eye didn't sell for $34000. Only 1/2 semen interest sold for 34000. Rib eye calves are really nice so far, deep and thick. And they come just a little easier then the M326's. The progress bull is a good bull, lowers BW, smaller frame, I think he is going to produce some tremendous females that will open up your choices for bull selection in regards to frame size.


Personally I liked the channing stuff more then the Moler. A lot of people will use the kudzo bull, I don't know how he will perform. World class seems to be throwing some good cattle, but I think he lacks the marketability in the show ring to be marketed to the masses.

I think SHF Marshal should have been used more. I own 10 or so and they are nice, but he won't be a superstar because he wasn't used enough. Oak Creek, I think that Marshal should be used more. I think that he is a super producing bull, has great performance and his daughters are out producing thereselves as first calf heifers. Also, I think that his son that sold in a past Denver sale, SHF Phoenix M33 P68, is a nice bull, kind of a funny picture of him, but I think that his progeny are going to be great. I think that Remitall Governor 236G should have been used more than what he was, darn good bull. 236G daughters I think are better than any Remitall sired cow in the breed.

THG

 

[redfornow]

Many of the "name" bulls are coming out of the kevin shultz program, easily a herd to watch.
And with that said in 2005 they bred 45 or so cows to p606 says alot about that bull even with the high BW (and he was already in the iffy range in 2005) that a guy like kevin used him so heavy.

 

[oakcreekfarms]

You should probably call Kevin and see what he thought about the P606's.

From my stand point he is only a cow producer. I wouldn't keep a bull out of him, personally.

Kevins herd is truely a work of art for people that love herefords. I haven't seen such a consistant set of cattle ever, and his groups of bulls keep getting better. If you haven't had a chance to see his herd, you should. This is why I am trying to mimic my herd after his. And am using only SHF bulls for AI and SHF sired bulls for clean up.

 

[redfornow]

Oak he kept alot of em.
With as marketable as p606 heifers are an the high standard that herd has, them still being around says alot to me.
Also with looking thru looks like you have a 606 duaghter or two in your herd.

I dont know about using him as a herd bull, his calves for me are always great. It does seem that if the mother has BW or CE issues he will bring that out. I agree I would be very selective in using a son across the board on a herd. Could be very good or be very bad.

I can tell you this almost always if you breed a good cow to p606 you will get a GREAT heifer. He is an improver.
The BW issue aside and thats a big aside.
He does have problems, but hte more calves I have out of him the more he grows on me...
MD