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More pro Angus statements.

Ky hills

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Preface, I am neither trying to be pro or against the Angus breed. I have a few registered Angus females, and most of the bulls that I have used for 15 years or so have been Angus. And will probably always use them for heifer bulls. I was at a county meeting, called winter school, a speaker from a feedlot in WI. spoke by satellite or online or however, he was saying that they prefer Angus calves, but they wanted them with frame, he was speaking against frame 5 or below. They want them to finish at around 1475, if I remember correctly. Then this morning, a neighbor who is very pro Angus and anti every other breed, came by. I now have several Hereford cows as well as a Hereford bull, he started out by saying that before long he thinks even commercial cows will have to have pedigrees in order for their calves to be marketable. And was telling of what a spread there was between some ones Angus and Hereford calves, which I am well aware of the dock. Then he said they pulled the BWF calves from the black ones and the BWF sold several cents less. He said that was becoming standard practice. I disagreed because I sold some black and BWF steers in a recent CPH 45 sale and they sold together. The rest of the conversation went on that any Hereford influence would not be marketable because they won't marble or grade. I will freely admit that the Angus beef in our freezer is good, but I just don't buy that a good Hereford beef wouldn't be just as good
 

Margonme

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Ky hills":3sty5ixh said:
Preface, I am neither trying to be pro or against the Angus breed. I have a few registered Angus females, and most of the bulls that I have used for 15 years or so have been Angus. And will probably always use them for heifer bulls. I was at a county meeting, called winter school, a speaker from a feedlot in WI. spoke by satellite or online or however, he was saying that they prefer Angus calves, but they wanted them with frame, he was speaking against frame 5 or below. They want them to finish at around 1475, if I remember correctly. Then this morning, a neighbor who is very pro Angus and anti every other breed, came by. I now have several Hereford cows as well as a Hereford bull, he started out by saying that before long he thinks even commercial cows will have to have pedigrees in order for their calves to be marketable. And was telling of what a spread there was between some ones Angus and Hereford calves, which I am well aware of the dock. Then he said they pulled the BWF calves from the black ones and the BWF sold several cents less. He said that was becoming standard practice. I disagreed because I sold some black and BWF steers in a recent CPH 45 sale and they sold together. The rest of the conversation went on that any Hereford influence would not be marketable because they won't marble or grade. I will freely admit that the Angus beef in our freezer is good, but I just don't buy that a good Hereford beef wouldn't be just as good

I seem to think that Angus certified beef tastes better to my palate.

I am most interested in the frame issue. I hear the feeder buyers complain if there is what they call "not enough leg" under them. Meaning they want more frame on the calves going through the feeder market auctions. On the other hand, seedstock buyers complain if there is too much frame on a commercial cow or bull. Seems contrary to me.
 

ddd75

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any old farmer has always said.. ' herefords are the best meat'


i have no idea. i have a hereford steer who will be ready to butcher here in 2 months.. so we'll see.

I also have been buying herefords heifers. I am now about 50/50 split between hereford / angus brood cows.


you can't tell me a BWF calf won't fetch high dollar at any market. They are sought after for a reason. Best of both worlds.
 

City Guy

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Are there any other naturally black breeds not related to Aberdeen Angus?
 

wbvs58

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I breed Angus but I am an admirer of many breeds in particular Charolais, Simmental, Herefords and Shorthorns but having only a small herd of 25-30 females I can't diversify in fact even without ET I have to be carefull that I don't get too much of the one family in my herd. I produce registered bulls to sell predominantly in my area. My area is mainly cows with calves sold at weaning because the country won't take the calves on much from here unless they are on crops. We have a big weaner sale in early autumn with calves mostly straight off their mothers. A lot of big backgrounders from down south buy at the sale and yes their preference is for the larger framed calves over 300kg and they then take them through to feedlot entry weights so their chooses are dictated by the feedlots. I guess when doing the long feed for the Japanese market they invest a lot of time and feed into them so they want something that has the potential to grow a bit.

Ken
 

elkwc

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ddd75":3ikkmf6j said:
any old farmer has always said.. ' herefords are the best meat'


i have no idea. i have a hereford steer who will be ready to butcher here in 2 months.. so we'll see.

I also have been buying herefords heifers. I am now about 50/50 split between hereford / angus brood cows.


you can't tell me a BWF calf won't fetch high dollar at any market. They are sought after for a reason. Best of both worlds.

I agree. At least in this area. And if you go to buy bred heifers the Herefords are bringing at least 200 more than a good Angus and the BWF 2-3 hundred more. I purchased well bred registered Angus females last year for 6-900 less than bred commercial Herefords were bringing. Here they never cut off BWF unless it is replacement heifers and then they will sometimes as they will bring more than if they are mixed with straight Angus heifers. They have started leaving the good Herefords on a group at some sales now. The dock a straight hereford receives is less now than it has been in years. Simmi's and Limmi's get docked more at least in this area.

I have mentioned the frame issue several times. It is becoming more of an issue with many Angus and polled Hereford cattle. Also the Balancer bull I helped select doesn't have the needed frame. That is why I look for a bull that will mature from a frame 5.5 to a low 6. And want my cows no less than a frame 5. The feedlot managers and feeder buyers I know say those with a frame above a 5 will only increase in value in the future compared to those a frame 5 or less.
 

Bigfoot

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Personally, I'm not a fan of a straight angus cow at all. Now, on the same subject I hate to haul a calf off that's not black. That can be achieved without ever having to have a little small framed angus cow around though.
 

True Grit Farms

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I can't make heads or tails out of any of this. One group preaches Angus are getting to much frame on them, and the other group says Angus doesn't have enough frame. Then the next group says Angus don't marble and red cows sell better than blacks. My take is it's hard to beat an Angus consistently on price or taste, and the markets prove it. You can think CAB is BS, but the buyers are buying it and the consumers can't get enough CAB.
Take a seat in the back of the bus boys, because Angus is still leading the way. And I have a pasture full of red baldies but I'm not color blind when it comes to $money.
 

TexasBred

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ddd75":14ovm9f0 said:
any old farmer has always said.. ' herefords are the best meat'


i have no idea. i have a hereford steer who will be ready to butcher here in 2 months.. so we'll see.

I also have been buying herefords heifers. I am now about 50/50 split between hereford / angus brood cows.


you can't tell me a BWF calf won't fetch high dollar at any market. They are sought after for a reason. Best of both worlds.
A hereford cow or calf will get docked heavily in the market around here. Folks want black. Myself, I prefer brangus but a majority want angus.
 

Caustic Burno

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TexasBred":13wj9no6 said:
ddd75":13wj9no6 said:
any old farmer has always said.. ' herefords are the best meat'


i have no idea. i have a hereford steer who will be ready to butcher here in 2 months.. so we'll see.

I also have been buying herefords heifers. I am now about 50/50 split between hereford / angus brood cows.


you can't tell me a BWF calf won't fetch high dollar at any market. They are sought after for a reason. Best of both worlds.
A hereford cow or calf will get docked heavily in the market around here. Folks want black. Myself, I prefer brangus but a majority want angus.

If I was a young man starting out I would fill the pasture with Hereford girls and a Brangus bull and ring the bell.
 

TennesseeTuxedo

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Caustic Burno":w07c4mne said:
TexasBred":w07c4mne said:
ddd75":w07c4mne said:
any old farmer has always said.. ' herefords are the best meat'


i have no idea. i have a hereford steer who will be ready to butcher here in 2 months.. so we'll see.

I also have been buying herefords heifers. I am now about 50/50 split between hereford / angus brood cows.


you can't tell me a BWF calf won't fetch high dollar at any market. They are sought after for a reason. Best of both worlds.
A hereford cow or calf will get docked heavily in the market around here. Folks want black. Myself, I prefer brangus but a majority want angus.

If I was a young man starting out I would fill the pasture with Hereford girls and a Brangus bull and ring the bell.

Not if you were starting out in his neck of the woods.
 

Caustic Burno

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Super baldie will be top of the market here and will flip that Angus calf off the scales when he steps on.
Straight Angus will bring good money it will never beat the yellow or black baldie here. Buyers here want frame growth and grade they get all three with the yellow or super baldie.
 

cotton1

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As a Charolais producer I don't understand very much about CAB. I used to be under the impression that anything with black hyde and a decent grade would qualify.
At one time I had Angus, SimAngus, Hereford and Gelbvieh commercial cattle. We used Black Angus or Charolais bulls on them. At my local barn I could get better money for a dank with black Hyde than a better calf( in terms of beef) of any other combination. It never made sense to me.

Frame size- I don't buy the idea that more frame means more beef. It can mean more beef, but not as a rule. Seems like a high HCW frame 5 cow can cut out more edible beef than a very low scoring frame 7,8 whatever. That's the part where hair color don't matter much.

Sounds like the guest speaker didn't want anybody to support the Angus guys that got away from the AAA? Seems they may have smaller frame Angus by some pictures I've seen. What is a typical frame score on Angus these days?

Cotton1
 

Muddy

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Caustic Burno":1wsqp2sg said:
Super baldie will be top of the market here and will flip that Angus calf off the scales when he steps on.
Straight Angus will bring good money it will never beat the yellow or black baldie here. Buyers here want frame growth and grade they get all three with the yellow or super baldie.
It's tough to beat blacks and black baldies at most sale barns. The prices on the yellows are a bit unpredictable in most areas and if the buyers didn't want yellow baldies on that day, you're screwed.
 

Bigfoot

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The lay of our land, and poor soil drainage is extremely hard on angus feet. I have read that the breed is actively pursuing improving the feet.
 

sim.-ang.king

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The fact of the matter is, if you don't like CAB, or Angus promoting itself, or black hides, go complain to your breed association. It's their job to do exactly what Angus did...
 

Ky hills

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sim.-ang.king":3ocmqcuh said:
The fact of the matter is, if you don't like CAB, or Angus promoting itself, or black hides, go complain to your breed association. It's their job to do exactly what Angus did...

I do like CAB, and am a member of the AAA, you are correct they have done a great job of promoting, they have changed the landscape of the American cowherd and industry dramatically. I am not a member of any other breed association at this time, and haven't been for close to 20 years. My post was prompted from a frustrating encounter with a very pro Angus only neighbor, who is seemingly obsessed with running down anything not purebred or registered Angus. I will say without a doubt that the Angus breed as a whole is good and did not get to their level of popularity on accident. That being said I don't believe that they are exactly perfect either, as is no particular breed without faults. I have heard from that individual over the years, a long list of reasons why all other breeds are inferior, and yesterday morning's lecture from him was just down right insulting and unsolicited. I like the fellow and he is knowledgeable on a wide variety of topics, just very opinionated.
I couldn't believe the statement that my Herefords, and BWF ( which now make up most of my cowherd) were worthless. I'm used to hearing propaganda from him and expect it, but that just seemed a bit much.
 

Turkeybird

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You can't argue with a know it all,just nod your head and keep doing what works best for you. Drives me nuts every time!!!
 

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