Making America great again.

[callmefence]

If I am wrong for teaching my kids to work along the way and hope they do better than I have so be it... I will not strive to have my kids to be a laborer as a life goal not that there's anything wrong with it.. If they end up being one id be just as proud but I know they are smart and have the capability to do more. A parent knows what their kids capable of doing for the most part. Raise your your way I'll raise mine my way.. No matter how you raise a kid in the best of home environment they can go south and do something you'd never imagined.

Sky I have no doubt that you are doing a fine job with your kids. I just wanted to see what happened when the naysayers looked in the mirror. All good post.

M5 I'm sure has great kids , knowing his savy and character. I do disagree 5
I've seen many a good hand come from trash. And vice versa. Often finding the right mentor can decide a youngersts direction. One should look at their child's earlist employers with the same scrutiny as they look at their friend's.

Truegrit gave a very honest post. Along with a poorly baited hook..... ;-)

 

[Caustic Burno]

The country has taken a philosophy along with a moral shift of slovenly behavior in the last two generations as the preferred lifestyle.
The IQ of the country has actually declined in the last century this is a down hill race.

http://uhaweb.hartford.edu/BRBAKER/

 

[CCCowman]

-
I tell you what Margo. I probably fall into the fool category. But you can search the archives of this forum and find hundreds of pics of my crews. Look close and I guarantee you won't find a single mescun. I built miles of fence by myself this summer due to lack of help. And I kinda enjoyed it.
We get along here and there. But to anyone who's given up. Or is scared to do their own work so they hire illegals. If want to say make American great again is a cute phrase. But there's no hope, then you are the pussifiction of America.
The greatest generation as we say . Came from the poorest of situations with the greatest of pride and kicked the shyt out a the rest of the world. Anybody who wants to cry we ain't got a chance, can go be nice themselves.
Ain't shyt to me

I hire anyone who says they can do the work I cant speak for every business owner and their employees but the ones I got working for me that were born here white black can't touch the work ethics of the Mexican or south American workers that are legal working for me. I am speaking on my experiences. I have one that may take pride in his work white or black but they think they should be making the same thing im making and don't stick around long. I work with my crew when I can and need too but here is never a shortage of people wanted to get paid the problem is finding folks that want to do a good job and get paid accordingly. Look at people working at McDonalds wanting to start out at 15.00 an hour for unskilled labor that a teenager can do. I assure you that move was not started by an immigrant illegal or legal. Lets face it Americans have the greed but and feel as though if they lift a finger they should get top dollar is how majority of the working age folks feel today. If I can afford you and think you will do a good job white black green yellow Mexican or whatever I will give you a chance if your legal. I have my crew working on a job they get hour lunch unpaid americans go somewhere to eat come back rarely on time the south American and Mexicans that work start lunch right on time and end it right on time they sit under a tree with their packed lunch and are back on time the americans by birth always have to look for them or hound them. Do I like that no I don't but that's the reality in my world.

Amen Sky!!

I worked for a large company that does industrial soft craft (scaffolding, insulation, painting, etc) work. Plenty of good paying jobs to go around but who do you hire. White/Black Americans... to lazy and wanted more pay than the president of the company. If you wanted to get a job done the only people you could count on were Mexicans. Dern good workers. Like sky said... they'd stop working at 12:00 exactly and be back to work at 12:30 exactly. The others, they'd
pre-stop" about 11:45. about 12:30 they go the the bathroom for 10 minutes, then smoke and finally get back to work about 1:00.

I could tell you dozens of stories:
- One would be how they'd work exactly x-number of days because anything over that would mess their unemployment up and they had their house payment set to where they could make it on unemployment. Sure enough, when X+1 days came along they would be no where around.
- Brought in a group (18-20) scaffold builders from Oklahoma for a 9 month job ($25/hr working 60-70 hours a week and $80/day per diem). 3 days on the job they refused to come back unless we gave each of them 4 weeks vacation.

We had great paying jobs ($18-$22/hr, 60 hours a week and $60/day per diem) and we couldn't hire an American to do the work. I hated it but we'd bring in truck loads of Mexicans.

Nothing is going to make America great again until we find a work ethic.

 

[hurleyjd]

I think the main problem is.. "if i go to college, i'll make it"

its so ingrained into every kid.. its sickening.

I open up the morning paper.. nothing but jobs jobs jobs for physical type work. 20-32+ /hr starting out.. they can't even get anyone to work! 15+/hr WALK IN HIRING ON THE SPOT!!!! can't get anyone to come in!~ This is easy work.

Welders -- 30-40/hr starting out..




all these office jobs.. MAYBE 12 bucks an hour..


I see a HUGE need for blue collar workers.. brick layers, welders, CNC machinists, etc...

Around here.. if you need ANYTHING labor done.. its insane how much it costs. and they are standing in line with money in the hand.

Send the paper to the unemployed coal miners in your state.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I think the main problem is.. "if i go to college, i'll make it"

its so ingrained into every kid.. its sickening.

I open up the morning paper.. nothing but jobs jobs jobs for physical type work. 20-32+ /hr starting out.. they can't even get anyone to work! 15+/hr WALK IN HIRING ON THE SPOT!!!! can't get anyone to come in!~ This is easy work.

Welders -- 30-40/hr starting out..




all these office jobs.. MAYBE 12 bucks an hour..


I see a HUGE need for blue collar workers.. brick layers, welders, CNC machinists, etc...

Around here.. if you need ANYTHING labor done.. its insane how much it costs. and they are standing in line with money in the hand.

Send the paper to the unemployed coal miners in your state.

School VICA programs are gone this is more of your Common Core socialist propaganda coming home to roost. It is not an I can philosophy taught at home it's they owe us.

 

[darkhorse]

-
I tell you what Margo. I probably fall into the fool category. But you can search the archives of this forum and find hundreds of pics of my crews. Look close and I guarantee you won't find a single mescun. I built miles of fence by myself this summer due to lack of help. And I kinda enjoyed it.
We get along here and there. But to anyone who's given up. Or is scared to do their own work so they hire illegals. If want to say make American great again is a cute phrase. But there's no hope, then you are the pussifiction of America.
The greatest generation as we say . Came from the poorest of situations with the greatest of pride and kicked the shyt out a the rest of the world. Anybody who wants to cry we ain't got a chance, can go be nice themselves.
Ain't shyt to me

I hire anyone who says they can do the work I cant speak for every business owner and their employees but the ones I got working for me that were born here white black can't touch the work ethics of the Mexican or south American workers that are legal working for me. I am speaking on my experiences. I have one that may take pride in his work white or black but they think they should be making the same thing im making and don't stick around long. I work with my crew when I can and need too but here is never a shortage of people wanted to get paid the problem is finding folks that want to do a good job and get paid accordingly. Look at people working at McDonalds wanting to start out at 15.00 an hour for unskilled labor that a teenager can do. I assure you that move was not started by an immigrant illegal or legal. Lets face it Americans have the greed but and feel as though if they lift a finger they should get top dollar is how majority of the working age folks feel today. If I can afford you and think you will do a good job white black green yellow Mexican or whatever I will give you a chance if your legal. I have my crew working on a job they get hour lunch unpaid americans go somewhere to eat come back rarely on time the south American and Mexicans that work start lunch right on time and end it right on time they sit under a tree with their packed lunch and are back on time the americans by birth always have to look for them or hound them. Do I like that no I don't but that's the reality in my world.

Amen Sky!!

I worked for a large company that does industrial soft craft (scaffolding, insulation, painting, etc) work. Plenty of good paying jobs to go around but who do you hire. White/Black Americans... to lazy and wanted more pay than the president of the company. If you wanted to get a job done the only people you could count on were Mexicans. Dern good workers. Like sky said... they'd stop working at 12:00 exactly and be back to work at 12:30 exactly. The others, they'd
pre-stop" about 11:45. about 12:30 they go the the bathroom for 10 minutes, then smoke and finally get back to work about 1:00.

I could tell you dozens of stories:
- One would be how they'd work exactly x-number of days because anything over that would mess their unemployment up and they had their house payment set to where they could make it on unemployment. Sure enough, when X+1 days came along they would be no where around.
- Brought in a group (18-20) scaffold builders from Oklahoma for a 9 month job ($25/hr working 60-70 hours a week and $80/day per diem). 3 days on the job they refused to come back unless we gave each of them 4 weeks vacation.

We had great paying jobs ($18-$22/hr, 60 hours a week and $60/day per diem) and we couldn't hire an American to do the work. I hated it but we'd bring in truck loads of Mexicans.

Nothing is going to make America great again until we find a work ethic.

Dang could you get me a potload. I don't really need that many but any extras should make great stocking stuffers.

 

[Jogeephus]

The issue should not be whether they should be white collar or blue collar. We need both.

It depends on the person - their aptitude, personal interest, goals, etc. That is a personal choice. As I constantly tell anyone who will listen (sarcasm), my son has a PhD from Vanderbilt (Harvard of the South, LOL) in Cancer Cell Biology. He is now employed by Eli Lilly doing clinical study reviews.

My career was white collar but I have an admiration for welders, mechanics, equipment operators, etc. I had a D3G LGP dozer for 3 years. I put 2000 hours on it. I don't know if I ever did anything more rewarding.

I know a guy half a mile from here who has no education. He told me his parents never sent him to school. IDK. But I do know, he is amazing with metal.

I think we often blame the people when the opportunities are not there. Not everyone has the qualities of Callmefence as an example. And let's face it, there are many out there who are not too bright. I don't know if I myself could find the motivation to make a living if I had to "go three steps forward and two steps back" to make a living. I actually think I would make a good thief. According to True Grit, I am a thief since I made my living as a civil servant. Candidly, it doesn't bother me a bit. And 25 years from now, no one is going to know, care or remember.

:banana:

OK, at the unlikely risk of offending you Margonne I'm singling you out on this one. Maybe your answer can help someone raise their children because there is an old saying that if you want to know how to grow corn you ask the guy who has his bins filled so I'll single you out since your bin is definitely overflowing and ask; what do you contribute to your son's success? No doubt he is successful but to get to where he is he had to not only be a hard worker but a smart worker with dedication, a hunger for knowledge and some unyielding internal motivation. Where did this come from? I know he wasn't born with it.

So if you were going to give someone advice on raising children what tips could you give?

 

[Margonme]

The issue should not be whether they should be white collar or blue collar. We need both.

It depends on the person - their aptitude, personal interest, goals, etc. That is a personal choice. As I constantly tell anyone who will listen (sarcasm), my son has a PhD from Vanderbilt (Harvard of the South, LOL) in Cancer Cell Biology. He is now employed by Eli Lilly doing clinical study reviews.

My career was white collar but I have an admiration for welders, mechanics, equipment operators, etc. I had a D3G LGP dozer for 3 years. I put 2000 hours on it. I don't know if I ever did anything more rewarding.

I know a guy half a mile from here who has no education. He told me his parents never sent him to school. IDK. But I do know, he is amazing with metal.

I think we often blame the people when the opportunities are not there. Not everyone has the qualities of Callmefence as an example. And let's face it, there are many out there who are not too bright. I don't know if I myself could find the motivation to make a living if I had to "go three steps forward and two steps back" to make a living. I actually think I would make a good thief. According to True Grit, I am a thief since I made my living as a civil servant. Candidly, it doesn't bother me a bit. And 25 years from now, no one is going to know, care or remember.

:banana:

OK, at the unlikely risk of offending you Margonne I'm singling you out on this one. Maybe your answer can help someone raise their children because there is an old saying that if you want to know how to grow corn you ask the guy who has his bins filled so I'll single you out since your bin is definitely overflowing and ask; what do you contribute to your son's success? No doubt he is successful but to get to where he is he had to not only be a hard worker but a smart worker with dedication, a hunger for knowledge and some unyielding internal motivation. Where did this come from? I know he wasn't born with it.

So if you were going to give someone advice on raising children what tips could you give?

You have given me a platform. Thank you. I mean that sincerely. Not one day has pasted in the last 32 years that I have not marvelled at Clint's successes.

In short, contrary to your statement, he was born with it but that is too simple to explain it. The foundation and framework for his success is hidden there in his genes. Those genes go back millions of years. Passed from parent to offspring generation after generation. His native intelligence is packaged within his body gifted down through the ages. German, English, Anglo-Saxon heritage. Those genetics provide the essence of what his personality was to be. His disposition (docility), motivation, dexterity, determination, etc.

His mother and I provided a warm, safe, loving environment. He was treated with respect. He was treated as an equal. I molded his confidence. I made him strong. Guided him to think highly of himself. I told him to live boldly. In summary, I believe you are what you think you are.

He kept going at times when I might have quit. He is extremely intelligent. Gifted to him from his ancestors. I only watered the plant. He did the rest.

In summary, he was fortunate for the heritage he was born with and that he was born into a home that could nurture his gifts and talents.

 

[boondocks]

The issue should not be whether they should be white collar or blue collar. We need both.

It depends on the person - their aptitude, personal interest, goals, etc. That is a personal choice. As I constantly tell anyone who will listen (sarcasm), my son has a PhD from Vanderbilt (Harvard of the South, LOL) in Cancer Cell Biology. He is now employed by Eli Lilly doing clinical study reviews.

My career was white collar but I have an admiration for welders, mechanics, equipment operators, etc. I had a D3G LGP dozer for 3 years. I put 2000 hours on it. I don't know if I ever did anything more rewarding.

I know a guy half a mile from here who has no education. He told me his parents never sent him to school. IDK. But I do know, he is amazing with metal.

I think we often blame the people when the opportunities are not there. Not everyone has the qualities of Callmefence as an example. And let's face it, there are many out there who are not too bright. I don't know if I myself could find the motivation to make a living if I had to "go three steps forward and two steps back" to make a living. I actually think I would make a good thief. According to True Grit, I am a thief since I made my living as a civil servant. Candidly, it doesn't bother me a bit. And 25 years from now, no one is going to know, care or remember.

:banana:

OK, at the unlikely risk of offending you Margonne I'm singling you out on this one. Maybe your answer can help someone raise their children because there is an old saying that if you want to know how to grow corn you ask the guy who has his bins filled so I'll single you out since your bin is definitely overflowing and ask; what do you contribute to your son's success? No doubt he is successful but to get to where he is he had to not only be a hard worker but a smart worker with dedication, a hunger for knowledge and some unyielding internal motivation. Where did this come from? I know he wasn't born with it.

So if you were going to give someone advice on raising children what tips could you give?

You have given me a platform. Thank you. I mean that sincerely. Not one day has pasted in the last 32 years that I have not marvelled at Clint's successes.

In short, contrary to your statement, he was born with it but that is too simple to explain it. The foundation and framework for his success is hidden there in his genes. Those genes go back millions of years. Passed from parent to offspring generation after generation. His native intelligence is packaged within his body gifted down through the ages. German, English, Anglo-Saxon heritage. Those genetics provide the essence of what his personality was to be. His disposition (docility), motivation, dexterity, determination, etc.

His mother and I provided a warm, safe, loving environment. He was treated with respect. He was treated as an equal. I molded his confidence. I made him strong. Guided him to think highly of himself. I told him to live boldly. In summary, I believe you are what you think you are.

He kept going at times when I might have quit. He is extremely intelligent. Gifted to him from his ancestors. I only watered the plant. He did the rest.

In summary, he was fortunate for the heritage he was born with and that he was born into a home that could nurture his gifts and talents.

Well done! And you should also credit a bit of luck? Many a smart young person who was "raised right" has nonetheless struggled to be successful (or has gotten seriously off-track, e.g., drugs etc).

 

[Anonymous]

What is success? I had a Great Grandfather that lived to be 94. He was an independent commercial fisherman his entire life and thoroughly enjoyed it . He never worked for anyone except his self. His kids made him stop fishing when he was in his mid 80s so he dug in his garden the rest of his life. He never accumulated much wealth but never was indebted to anyone and made his own way his entire life. From what I hear, he had many debts owed to him over the years. He was married to the same woman, my Great Grandmother, and they died a few months apart. They raised a large family and all were good decent people. Most of his sons became fisherman and found the same enjoyment and satisfaction in the work. He died the year I was born so I never knew him. To me, he had very a successful life because he was self reliant and self sufficient. I think many people push their kids into careers for financial or prestigious reasons only. I pity people with Monday to Friday jobs that hate what they are doing and live looking forward to the weekend. I understand that sometimes people have to do jobs they don't like, but find some enjoyment in it. The "satisfaction" of doing a good job and making your own way seems to be lost in todays society. That is what I want to teach my kids no matter where their interests and life takes them.

 

[ddd75]

.[/quote]

Send the paper to the unemployed coal miners in your state.[/quote]

\
my neighbor is a coal miner he makes about 80/hr, has a new 4k sq ft house and 300 acres.

 

[Margonme]

.

Send the paper to the unemployed coal miners in your state.[/quote]

\
my neighbor is a coal miner he makes about 80/hr, has a new 4k sq ft house and 300 acres.[/quote]

Reference: Lexington Herald Leader

Kentucky's coal industry continued to hemorrhage jobs in the first three months of 2016, hitting the lowest total in 118 years, according to a report released Monday.

 

[dun]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

 

[Margonme]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

Right on. The way I live. I perform my passions to perfection.

Anxiety: caring too much about your vocation.

Depression: not caring about anything.

I fall in the Anxiety category.

Money is a tool. Having said that. I like to have enough tools to keep the job going. Lol

 

[callmefence]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

Where's that like button...

 

[Workinonit Farm]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

:nod: :nod: :nod:

 

[Jogeephus]

You have given me a platform. Thank you. I mean that sincerely. Not one day has pasted in the last 32 years that I have not marvelled at Clint's successes.

In short, contrary to your statement, he was born with it but that is too simple to explain it. The foundation and framework for his success is hidden there in his genes. Those genes go back millions of years. Passed from parent to offspring generation after generation. His native intelligence is packaged within his body gifted down through the ages. German, English, Anglo-Saxon heritage. Those genetics provide the essence of what his personality was to be. His disposition (docility), motivation, dexterity, determination, etc.

His mother and I provided a warm, safe, loving environment. He was treated with respect. He was treated as an equal. I molded his confidence. I made him strong. Guided him to think highly of himself. I told him to live boldly. In summary, I believe you are what you think you are.

He kept going at times when I might have quit. He is extremely intelligent. Gifted to him from his ancestors. I only watered the plant. He did the rest.

In summary, he was fortunate for the heritage he was born with and that he was born into a home that could nurture his gifts and talents.

Margonme, I think you would make a good fortune teller because your answers are so broad it could apply to how everyone thinks they raise their children. And I find your reference to his success being due to him being born white rather racist and disturbing so I don't buy into that. No, I believe it has to be something more than pure genetics. I think we are all born as equals and many of us might be surprised by what genes we do carry.

With that in mind, your broad statements could be very subjective and apply to anyone. So I'm asking more of the specifics because I think most everyone gives their children a warm safe environment but its what happened in this environment that seems to make a difference, I think. You say he was treated with respect and as an equal. With this I assume you held him at the same standards you hold yourself and not set a double standard by preaching hubris only to show him there is a double standard when it concerns yourself. In other words, you set an unwavering standard for him to emulate.

You also said you encouraged him to think highly of himself and live boldly. I take that as meaning you encouraged him to pursue his dreams and not yours. Pardon my memory if I'm wrong, but if I recall correctly, I think you mentioned you once gave him a chemistry set for him to dabble with as a child. If this is right then is this not the proverbial water you used to water this plant? You could have given him something more to your liking and I'm sure he would have pursued this if for nothing else but to make you happy but instead it sounds like you encouraged him to pursue HIS dreams and not yours. You gave him free reign of his life while still holding gently to the reigns.

As mentioned, success isn't always equated with money and money surely doesn't buy happiness but in your case I think had your son been interested in blacksmithing he may have found an anvil under the Christmas tree and with your encouragement he would have surely been one of the best blacksmiths in the country and this to HIM would have been success and in the grand scheme of things this is all that matters is it not?

 

[True Grit Farms]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

Right on. The way I live. I perform my passions to perfection.

Anxiety: caring too much about your vocation.

Depression: not caring about anything.

I fall in the Anxiety category.

Money is a tool. Having said that. I like to have enough tools to keep the job going. Lol

Money, the more you have the more you want. I'd rather live a simple life and do the job with what I have. I lost all my paper retirement in 2008 and it made me a better person. I guess I'm depressed now, because I don't care about anything. This has been a good run in the market, but if our new POTUS bombs out it could get ugly really quick. You have nothing till you have it in your hand.

 

[callmefence]

To me being a success is doing what you do well and leaving a positive mark on some others life. MOney don;t really mean diddly it's just a way some people keep score.

Right on. The way I live. I perform my passions to perfection.

Anxiety: caring too much about your vocation.

Depression: not caring about anything.

I fall in the Anxiety category.

Money is a tool. Having said that. I like to have enough tools to keep the job going. Lol

Money, the more you have the more you want. I'd rather live a simple life and do the job with what I have. I lost all my paper retirement in 2008 and it made me a better person. I guess I'm depressed now, because I don't care about anything. This has been a good run in the market, but if our new POTUS bombs out it could get ugly really quick. You have nothing till you have it in your hand.

Has anyone else noticed that the more you have. The more you worry about losing it

 

[TexasBred]

I think the main problem is.. "if i go to college, i'll make it"

its so ingrained into every kid.. its sickening.

I open up the morning paper.. nothing but jobs jobs jobs for physical type work. 20-32+ /hr starting out.. they can't even get anyone to work! 15+/hr WALK IN HIRING ON THE SPOT!!!! can't get anyone to come in!~ This is easy work.

Welders -- 30-40/hr starting out..




all these office jobs.. MAYBE 12 bucks an hour..


I see a HUGE need for blue collar workers.. brick layers, welders, CNC machinists, etc...

Around here.. if you need ANYTHING labor done.. its insane how much it costs. and they are standing in line with money in the hand.

I know what I can and cannot do and have good enough judgement to know that if I have electrical problems, call an electrician, plumbing problems, call a plumber and if I need fence build I'll probably call Fenceman. Try it myself and I'll tear up much more than I'll fix. I don't want to be the worlds best handy man. Those people have to eat too and the good ones are worth every dollar they charge and I pay it gladly. The different professions I've had over my lifetime I've always tried to be damm good at it and give a good day's work for a good day's pay. I do still wish I could weld. :nod: