Foundation Hereford Bulls

[Herefords.US]

I have a number of daughters who have done OK raising calves in some pretty sparse conditions.

Besides having that udder thing come up sure is a pesky thing. Are they tame enough to milk out in the pasture?

I've yet to milk one, user 1! And I won't -before I do that they'll get a trip to town. The one I culled lost her calf to dogs and her teat ballooned to the point that I didn't want to risk the prospect of having to milk her. Besides, I already wasn't too happy with her for not attempting to defend her calf.

George

 

[user1]

The one I culled lost her calf to dogs and her teat ballooned to the point that I didn't want to risk the prospect of having to milk her. Besides, I already wasn't too happy with her for not attempting to defend her calf.

So how many daughters do you have in your herd. I don't meen to be antagonistic but I have never seen much positive come from the showring. It just gives newcomers the wrong idea about the beef industry.

 

[Herefords.US]

The one I culled lost her calf to dogs and her teat ballooned to the point that I didn't want to risk the prospect of having to milk her. Besides, I already wasn't too happy with her for not attempting to defend her calf.

So how many daughters do you have in your herd. I don't meen to be antagonistic but I have never seen much positive come from the showring. It just gives newcomers the wrong idea about the beef industry.

I don't have my herd information with me, but it'd be somewhere around 15. And numerous granddaughters.

George

 

[Brandonm22]

The showring is the downfall of the beef industry....it has nothing to do with the beef industry.....just another Miss America contest for cattle. I apologize to Miss America for the slam.

I know the contest is silly but try as I might, I just can't make myself dislike Miss America. I can't figure out why.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newyork/3225171322/

 

[Herefords.US]

I don't meen to be antagonistic but I have never seen much positive come from the showring. It just gives newcomers the wrong idea about the beef industry.

user1, when I got back into the Hereford cattle business, I thought my focus would be on producing show cattle for juniors. I believed, and still do, that you can have functional cattle in the real world and still have some success in the showring.

Spending some time around the shows, and then a drought, made me take another look at what I wanted to do with cattle. For one thing, I discovered that I really didn't enjoy participating in the hoopla surrounding the shows. And I also saw some things that really bothered me! For instance, I am troubled at seeing a kid's parent spend $40,000 for half interest in a 6 month old show heifer, and know the only time that kid is going to see that heifer is a few hours before leading her into the showring at the Junior show, because they live several states away from the breeder and the breeder is going to do all the work and most of the preparation. I'm not sure what that kid gains from that.

Now, my primary focus has shifted to having cattle that can do well in the low-input environment that my cattle are in. That is what is most important! I still hope to be able to provide some juniors with some cattle that will do well in the showring, but my goal is to find some kids that want to put in the work themselves and learn from the experience - kids whose parents can't pay thousands of dollars for an almost guaranteed winner.

George

 

[Herefords.US]

The showring is the downfall of the beef industry....it has nothing to do with the beef industry.....just another Miss America contest for cattle. I apologize to Miss America for the slam.

I know the contest is silly but try as I might, I just can't make myself dislike Miss America. I can't figure out why.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/newyork/3225171322/

Yeah - but can she cook? :lol:

George

 

[Brandonm22]

Yeah - but can she cook? :lol:

George

Probably not, but she looks like she wouldn't be expensive too feed.

 

[redfornow]

Yeah - but can she cook? :lol:

George

Probably not, but she looks like she wouldn't be expensive too feed.

Looks to be a hard keeper...

 

[HerefordSire]

Yeah - but can she cook? :lol:

George

Probably not, but she looks like she wouldn't be expensive too feed.

She is young enough to be taught to cook.

 

[HerefordSire]

Of the ones you have listed, I would say use 512, the first year, on all cows with very low BW EPDs. For the 517 influenced cows, I would try to preserve or increase the percentage of 517 influence for later use. For the remaining, I would consider using Mohican Mint, MC Ranger, and or Remitall Online.

HS, are you going to donate some of your Online semen to him? :?:

If he doesn't already have the semen on hand, at the price of $1000 a straw and $250 a cert, I think you'd be hard pressed to justify using Online for a flush anymore, much less for a straight AI!

After looking at all the videos of the show heifer sales this fall, breeding for show cattle, I'd be inclined to buy a Nitro package at $2500 for 25 straws and getting the certs at cost.

I think he had the most impressive group of daughters of any sire represented.
Info on semen packages here:
http://hereford.com/hereford/nitro.html


George

I might trade some Online semen for a late model tractor. :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

 

[rocket2222]

I've been through the multiple sire in season breeding program, it seemed to work well for a while, you end up keeping a heifer or two here and there. And before you know it, you end up with a group of good cows that are so missed matched genetically and phenotypically that choosing bulls for them becomes more and more diverse. Then after a while you realize what you really need is more consistency, and believe me, that's when the fun really starts, especially if you have a couple of cow families that stamp their calves good, and that's not the exact direction you want to go. As for which sire/sires to use, that depends on the direction you want to take the herd, in the long run you will be better off with some sort of breeding plan, a direction to go in, instead of just using multiple bulls of the month.

 

[HerefordSire]

Of the ones you have listed, I would say use 512, the first year, on all cows with very low BW EPDs. For the 517 influenced cows, I would try to preserve or increase the percentage of 517 influence for later use. For the remaining, I would consider using Mohican Mint, MC Ranger, and or Remitall Online.

By the way, 512 could be one of the longest bulls in the world (Keynote 20X?). If he is shorter in length, he ain't much shorter. I believe bulls should be intimidating and long. I have a bull I won't get within 10 yards of and I make sure I have something to dodge around, but he has always appearred to be gentle as a puppy dog. But, he looks intimidating.

 

[CosgrayHerefords]

Thank you for those of you who are actually giving advice instead of voicing what sounds to be a disgruntled opinion from a bad experience. Also user1 I'm not a newcomer to the cattle business nor the Hereford breed. My family has been raising Hereford cattle for 60 years this year and I have been around it and involved my entire life. To clear the air on everything, I'm not planning on using that many bulls THIS year. I just wanted to hear first hand experience fellow Hereford breeders had with these bulls and I was only going to go with a couple of them. I sometimes have trouble with the transitition from my head to my hands!

 

[Hereford76]

My dad has 65 head and I just bought 20 head recently. The Feltons bloodlines are mostly 517 and we have around 9 Gerber Grasslander cows. I really like what the cows produce from just our bulls, we haven't AI'd in about 10 years. My goal is to breed the cows to these sires this year and hopefully get enough quality females and down the road breed the to more show sires to produce better show stock. Right now we mostly just get breed champions at county fairs around our area but I would like our customers to have more success at the state and local levels and seeing a majority of national winners have these sires in their bloodlines I figured we would start out by sampling a little probably with 25 or 30 cows in the herd.

I can't believe i still am stupid enough to register calves anymore... this is the thought that it goes to support. the aha uses more of its budget on the youth end of it and this is how its spent. they have to realize they are going to screw the breed all over again don't they. how can they think that by turning their backs on the industry that is supposed to be based on in sustainable?

????????????????????????

 

[Hereford76]

Thank you for those of you who are actually giving advice instead of voicing what sounds to be a disgruntled opinion from a bad experience.

sounded like pretty good advice to me

 

[HerefordSire]

My dad has 65 head and I just bought 20 head recently. The Feltons bloodlines are mostly 517 and we have around 9 Gerber Grasslander cows. I really like what the cows produce from just our bulls, we haven't AI'd in about 10 years. My goal is to breed the cows to these sires this year and hopefully get enough quality females and down the road breed the to more show sires to produce better show stock. Right now we mostly just get breed champions at county fairs around our area but I would like our customers to have more success at the state and local levels and seeing a majority of national winners have these sires in their bloodlines I figured we would start out by sampling a little probably with 25 or 30 cows in the herd.

I can't believe i still am stupid enough to register calves anymore... this is the thought that it goes to support. the aha uses more of its budget on the youth end of it and this is how its spent. they have to realize they are going to screw the breed all over again don't they. how can they think that by turning their backs on the industry that is supposed to be based on in sustainable?

????????????????????????

What do you suggest?

 

[Brandonm22]

Pure Gold sounds just what the Hereford breed needs more of-a big BW- pencil gutted piece of crap that throws bad uddered cattle that you cull around seven or eight but you can win a show with them. Why do we ask how come we lost market share to Angus-I wouldn't breed my mother in laws cows to a bull like that. Unbelievable!!! Can anybody tell me one positive thing the show ring has done for any breed of cattle-besides provide an avenue for a bunch of wanna-be cattlemen to spend money and get drunk.

Don't hold back. Tell us how you REALLY feel! :lol2:

 

[Elder Statesman]

I would really have to echo Knersie and NR -

You say yourself that Pure Gold did not make good cows or something to that effect. Why in heavens name would you then recommend using him for show cattle??? Is the show ring so far removed from day to day production???

As I am new to cattle I was under the impression that the FFA, County Fairs and other competitions had the goal of helping kids to learn to identify superior animals and help develop the breeds.

I recently had a beer next to a fellow who raises show calves for sale. I found it hard to believe what he was telling me about the steps used in raising show cattle... Looks like that is a whole different world and one which has little or nothing to do with the production cattle business.

Seems like there ought to be a warning label on show cattle sires and dams... "CAUTION - FOR SHOW RING USE ONLY - USE IN REAL WORLD APPLICATIONS MAY CAUSE FINANCIAL DIFFICULTY"

fwiw. Jim

For somebody new to cattle, you are a fast learner. I like your warning label idea!!

 

[HerefordSire]

Pure Gold sounds just what the Hereford breed needs more of-a big BW- pencil gutted piece of crap that throws bad uddered cattle that you cull around seven or eight but you can win a show with them. Why do we ask how come we lost market share to Angus-I wouldn't breed my mother in laws cows to a bull like that. Unbelievable!!! Can anybody tell me one positive thing the show ring has done for any breed of cattle-besides provide an avenue for a bunch of wanna-be cattlemen to spend money and get drunk.

Don't hold back. Tell us how you REALLY feel! :lol2:

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

The last five words might make me want to show cattle.

 

[Brandonm22]

-besides provide an avenue for a bunch of wanna-be cattlemen to spend money and get drunk.

Don't hold back. Tell us how you REALLY feel! :lol2:

:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

The last five words might make me want to show cattle.

That is what I was thinking. Why beg some tight wad, church going commercial cattleman to spend $2000 for an 18 month old reg. bull instead of buying another pew for his church; if you can get $5000 from some drunk with a family by his trophy wife/former secretary for a halter broke 5 month old steer with his head in a feed bucket??? They don't even have to be registered or purebred!

http://bullbarn.com/clubepd.asp?ID=400

Don't ask me where those EPDs come from!