Claire":2vg76syb said:Just four days ago, a 38,000 acre property around here, went for 16 million.
cmjust0":3a86fmcb said:For a little perspective, you need about 2-1/2 acres to the pair in this area.. Averaging at $3250/acre, it would cost about $8125 to put grass under a pair. Given that it seems like most folks figure on netting about $100/pair/year, it would seem to take about 81 years to pay for the land with cattle alone.
Not exactly a great ROI..
PeaceCountryCowboy":1wkonjq7 said:It is becoming impossible for younger people to start up. Between being able to get a job doing just about anything else and making more money, to the cost of everything needed. Million dollars doesn't even begin to scratch the surface anymore and really if you had that kinda money, cattle's the last place any sain person would put it. The only young people I know doing it have side jobs in the oilfield that support their cattle habit.
GMN":1m4me0sf said:I know you can start up for far less than a million dollars, we sure did, but it takes time to do it, years and years, of building the herd up, establishing yourself, etc... If you jump into it and buy new everything, plus your cows, no way will that work, but over time it is still possible.
GMN
circlet":soiemmuv said:some of you are saying that the younger ones don't have the interest, well personally i'd probably sell a kidney if i thought it could get me into farming or ranching! it's been all i've ever wanted to do but evidently it hasn't been God's plan for me (to this point at least). my farmer grandpa died when i was too young to take over so his life of hard work went by the wayside, and my father-in-law rancher has 4 sons who are in line way before i am in the inheritance pecking order
having a case of sour grapes leads me to pay alot of attention to what goes on around me in the ag world though (plus i still work in the cattle industry) and in my small portion of the world it seems to me that alot of guys who inherited well and who got a few breaks along the way - from people who valued them as a person and valued the agricultural professions - most of these same guys have forgotten where they came from and aren't really very willing to give back to us in the next generation. don't get me wrong, i'm not looking for handouts, but a perfect example is my brother, he worked for a guy for many years, the story told was always "if it weren't for the kindness and generosity of a few people, i wouldn't be a farmer, so i want to help a young guy out" well, last year, when it was time for my brother's boss to hang it up and rent out his land, do you think he gave my brother a shot? nope...it went to one of the big guys who get's hundreds of thousands in subsidies and who could buck up and pay a ridiculous cash rent. my brother's boss was then confused as to why my brother quit him and went to work in town? that is a pretty common story around my area. in complete honesty, i could give you 3 more examples just off the top of my head.
the farming culture in illinios and iowa in particular has really went this direction. i read that in 2004 the average farmer in illinois made $65k, i know it's rare to find a farmer around here without a brand new chevy 2500 every other year and a house in the ozarks or in minnesota. the "freedom to farm" act that our wonderful politicians gave us has basically squeezed out any family farmers and young farmers trying to start out on their own because you have farmers getting literally millions of dollars in subsidies (not making that up, look at this website http://farm.ewg.org/farm )
I know I probably sound like a crybaby, I'm really not. I fully realize that this is a tough old world and no one gets just exactly what they want. I also know the temptation for many to cash in big on their property is probably very strong. But the normal human tendency towards greed, coupled with the lending environment finishes the deal on someone trying to break into ag or expand their small operation. How in the world does anyone come up with 25% down on a large farm or ranch? that boggles my mind actually! I've really wondered what the next generation of farmer/rancher will look like, I think they will simply be hired hands at best, with not much real chance to work for themselves and build something for their families. I know I haven't figured out how to crack into the biz like I've wanted to, so if any of you have a ranch somewhere west of the missouri river that you wanna sell to someone who'll use it to grow cows, hay and kids and will keep the young yuppies and old hippies away let me know!! :cboy:
GMN":30ezk3er said:circlet":30ezk3er said:some of you are saying that the younger ones don't have the interest, well personally i'd probably sell a kidney if i thought it could get me into farming or ranching! it's been all i've ever wanted to do but evidently it hasn't been God's plan for me (to this point at least). my farmer grandpa died when i was too young to take over so his life of hard work went by the wayside, and my father-in-law rancher has 4 sons who are in line way before i am in the inheritance pecking order
having a case of sour grapes leads me to pay alot of attention to what goes on around me in the ag world though (plus i still work in the cattle industry) and in my small portion of the world it seems to me that alot of guys who inherited well and who got a few breaks along the way - from people who valued them as a person and valued the agricultural professions - most of these same guys have forgotten where they came from and aren't really very willing to give back to us in the next generation. don't get me wrong, i'm not looking for handouts, but a perfect example is my brother, he worked for a guy for many years, the story told was always "if it weren't for the kindness and generosity of a few people, i wouldn't be a farmer, so i want to help a young guy out" well, last year, when it was time for my brother's boss to hang it up and rent out his land, do you think he gave my brother a shot? nope...it went to one of the big guys who get's hundreds of thousands in subsidies and who could buck up and pay a ridiculous cash rent. my brother's boss was then confused as to why my brother quit him and went to work in town? that is a pretty common story around my area. in complete honesty, i could give you 3 more examples just off the top of my head.
the farming culture in illinios and iowa in particular has really went this direction. i read that in 2004 the average farmer in illinois made $65k, i know it's rare to find a farmer around here without a brand new chevy 2500 every other year and a house in the ozarks or in minnesota. the "freedom to farm" act that our wonderful politicians gave us has basically squeezed out any family farmers and young farmers trying to start out on their own because you have farmers getting literally millions of dollars in subsidies (not making that up, look at this website http://farm.ewg.org/farm )
I know I probably sound like a crybaby, I'm really not. I fully realize that this is a tough old world and no one gets just exactly what they want. I also know the temptation for many to cash in big on their property is probably very strong. But the normal human tendency towards greed, coupled with the lending environment finishes the deal on someone trying to break into ag or expand their small operation. How in the world does anyone come up with 25% down on a large farm or ranch? that boggles my mind actually! I've really wondered what the next generation of farmer/rancher will look like, I think they will simply be hired hands at best, with not much real chance to work for themselves and build something for their families. I know I haven't figured out how to crack into the biz like I've wanted to, so if any of you have a ranch somewhere west of the missouri river that you wanna sell to someone who'll use it to grow cows, hay and kids and will keep the young yuppies and old hippies away let me know!! :cboy:
In answer to how can I get into farming? My suggestion to you is find someone, a retired dairy person, or someone who owns a chunk around you that lives n another state, and wants to sell, get in with a land contract with them for say 10 years, then find yourself a great Bank, and lending officer, who will lend you money for this and that, and start from scratch and go from there. Build up your herd as you go, buy young calves, renovate a existing structure for a barn, do most all your own work, get it Grade A, go to farm auctions, buy used equipment, buy young heifer calves, raise them up, keep your costs down, and after about 10 years or so you will be on your way. Mind you, it will take time, and dedication, and scrimping, things will not always go right, so don't be too hard on yourself, and have fun.
Gail
Earl Thigpen":221pk2p1 said:If you do run across young folks who want to farm and ranch they can't afford it. It's lose-lose. But that's OK, we can buy food from China and wonder if what we're eating isn't poisoning us.
ETF":47odqspr said:Gail said "find yourself a great Bank, and lending officer". What is everyone using for financing? Down here, I was unable to find a conventional bank that would finance more than 20 acres and they required 40% down for that. I'm going through Farm Credit. They only required 20% down :roll: but the interest rate is 8.25%. It's killing me. The only way I could buy my property was to sell my house plus invest everything I had saved from 20+ years of working. I'll make it through but cannot imagine how the younger folks could get into farming unless they inherit the land.
bigbull338":h4haqx9m said:so the truth is if you want it .you work for it.