Cow pic may register her

[JHH]

Thinking about registering this cow. She can be registered. I bought some cows and they all can be . But some are just going to be commercial for me not good enough to sell bulls out of I dont think.

 

[3waycross]

Thinking about registering this cow. She can be registered. I bought some cows and they all can be . But some are just going to be commercial for me not good enough to sell bulls out of I dont think.

Only time will tell. I have seen some real ugly cows be amazing bull makers!

 

[bigbull338]

i would not reg her,but not because she doesnt look good.but because to reg her will cost an arm an a leg.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

hows her udder and teat structure?

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

 

[tom4018]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

I would think if all calves were registered it would make the dam's and sire's epd more realistic and accurate. Some breeders may only register the best but that skews the results. We have sent many registered calves to the salebarn in the feeder pen. We feel me make our registered cow's epds more accurate by reporting every calf. Yes it costs a few bucks a calf but that is the way we want to do it.

 

[3waycross]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

I would think if all calves were registered it would make the dam's and sire's epd more realistic and accurate. Some breeders may only register the best but that skews the results. We have sent many registered calves to the salebarn in the feeder pen. We feel me make our registered cow's epds more accurate by reporting every calf. Yes it costs a few bucks a calf but that is the way we want to do it.

I register every calf I have. Even the ones I know are going to get culled for one reason or another! For just that reason. Of course I am not so cheap that carrying a cow on my herd assesment bothers me that much!

 

[ANAZAZI]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

Allright, but first and foremost we must decide what "improvement" means to us, it may or may not be a differing concept. A slide in the definition of improvement has hurt breed characteristics, allowed frame creep and hard doers.

From the picture, the cow looks like a decent cow.

 

[KNERSIE]

Type wise she is right on the money, you can argue the semantics all day long, but she has a better chance than most to make a positive contribution to the herd and the breed than most I've seen posted here.

 

[hillsdown]

Don't all/most breed associations allow you to compute animals ? That way each calf born and their performance, is taken into account and goes on the EPD's of the registered sires and dams regardless of whether you register an animal or not.

I am too cheap to spend 50 bucks a pop to register a calf that is going to the feeders . 50 calves being sold as feeders in the fall is $2500 ,that can almost pay my fuel bill for the year .


Nice cow JHH .

 

[3waycross]

Don't all/most breed associations allow you to compute animals ? That way each calf born and their performance, is taken into account and goes on the EPD's of the registered sires and dams regardless of whether you register an animal or not.

I am too cheap to spend 50 bucks a pop to register a calf that is going to the feeders . 50 calves being sold as feeders in the fall is $2500 ,that can almost pay my fuel bill for the year .


Nice cow JHH .

We don't get charged to register a calf. It is part of our herd assesment and dues. We only get charged for active females.

 

[JHH]

Well I think she is better than most but not as good as some. I am going to register I think. It will cost me 55 bucks. He!! I have spent that much on a half a night out on the town. So if she throws good calves and I am able to sell bulls out of her the first bull sale will more than pay for her registration.

I also will NOT register some of the other ones that I got. They are commercial cows and that is that.

 

[smnherf]

She certainly looks good enough to produce registered stock, but at this point in her life for me the deciding factor would be what has she produced? How much do you know about the history of these cattle? Is there a reason why she wasn't registered as a calf or young heifer. Is she super high on bw or low milk or some other reason she wasnt registered as most registered herds tend to register most of the calves at a younger age as it is more economical to do it then. You can register 5 calves before they are 4 months old for the same price you can 1 at a year of age.

 

[JHH]

She certainly looks good enough to produce registered stock, but at this point in her life for me the deciding factor would be what has she produced? How much do you know about the history of these cattle? Is there a reason why she wasn't registered as a calf or young heifer. Is she super high on bw or low milk or some other reason she wasnt registered as most registered herds tend to register most of the calves at a younger age as it is more economical to do it then. You can register 5 calves before they are 4 months old for the same price you can 1 at a year of age.

Have seen her heifer calf from last year and heifer from year before. Good cattle . Teats are good, temperment is good. B.W. is fine milk is fine. Older man is 72 and has cancer. He quit regitering them 5 yrs ago. Medical bills have forced him to slim down and cut costs on most things.This cow is 5. I also have her daughter that will calve in fall. I will most likely register her also. He was running 100 head He has been forced down to 20 head because of health and financial things. I got them at a good price. i promised him I would not take them to packer for a yr or two. Some of the ones I got have bigger teats but not terriable yet. This cow doesnt appear to have a problem. She should be bred to a ( DR Pepper Bull from Amy Phillips ) will find out May 5th if she is bred.

 

[MO_cows]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

I would think if all calves were registered it would make the dam's and sire's epd more realistic and accurate. Some breeders may only register the best but that skews the results. We have sent many registered calves to the salebarn in the feeder pen. We feel me make our registered cow's epds more accurate by reporting every calf. Yes it costs a few bucks a calf but that is the way we want to do it.

That is it right there. This skew in the numbers when the breeders cherry pick who they will spend the money to register - only the top animals - and the middle end and the low end goes totally unrecorded, well that isn't doing their breed's database any favors. If you don't have a complete contemporary group to evaluate, you don't have the best data. The breeds that stuck their neck out and did Whole Herd, Complete Herd, Total Herd fee structures where you pay a fee for every registered cow and are expected to report every calf have brought those breeds light years ahead on their data collection and the strength of their EPD. Even though about every breed has a "compute" or "record" option, most breeders just won't spend that extra money and do the extra work to report their whole calf crop. The "whole herd" concept was recommended in the 1990's by BIF but not every breed association had the guts to adopt it.

 

[DOC HARRIS]

Just because she ". . .can be registered" is not a verifiable reason to do so. There are many factors which should be considered in registering an animal other than the fact that she is already a "pedigreed" candidate! Phenotype, Genetic EPD's, Functional traits, DNA markers, - her own personal characteristics - ALL should be considered prior to going to the expense and effort of registering any animal. Registering poor quality individuals of any breed is one thing that has contributed to the depletion of desirable characteristics and traits in all of the cattle breeds. The primary goal(s) of any conscientous producer is to focus on the improvement of the progeny over the parents for future Profits! In my opinion, if this cow is of adequate beef quality to be able to be bred to a bull of more desirable qualities, and the resulting progeny should be an improvement over the parents, THEN give serious thought and consideration to registering the cow.

Profit and Improvement (not necessarily in that order) should be the goal of registering seedstock - breed Improvement and your own Profit!

DOC HARRIS

I would think if all calves were registered it would make the dam's and sire's epd more realistic and accurate. Some breeders may only register the best but that skews the results. We have sent many registered calves to the salebarn in the feeder pen. We feel me make our registered cow's epds more accurate by reporting every calf. Yes it costs a few bucks a calf but that is the way we want to do it.

That is it right there. This skew in the numbers when the breeders cherry pick who they will spend the money to register - only the top animals - and the middle end and the low end goes totally unrecorded, well that isn't doing their breed's database any favors. If you don't have a complete contemporary group to evaluate, you don't have the best data. The breeds that stuck their neck out and did Whole Herd, Complete Herd, Total Herd fee structures where you pay a fee for every registered cow and are expected to report every calf have brought those breeds light years ahead on their data collection and the strength of their EPD. Even though about every breed has a "compute" or "record" option, most breeders just won't spend that extra money and do the extra work to report their whole calf crop. The "whole herd" concept was recommended in the 1990's by BIF but not every breed association had the guts to adopt it.

I have read all of the posts on this thread since I wrote mine earlier today, and I have to admit that I was wrong in my assertion regarding not registering all of the progeny in one's herd. I have held that thought for years, and after reading these posts, and giving it a LOT of thought TODAY, I have to admit that I was wrong.

The "Whole Herd" concept is tough to accept on the face of it, but when looking deeper - and over a longer period of time - it parallels the "Multiple Trait Selection" protocol of choice of seedstock as opposed to a "Single Trait Selection" agenda. It is exactly the same principle when you look at the entire picture!

Thank you for helping me to see this in a new light! I am embarrassed that I missed the correct concept in the first place. I guess one is never too old to learn!

DOC HARRIS

 

[mrvictordomino]

Jay, cow looks good to me and the fact you have progeny from her to confirm she can produce quality
would make it a no brain-er. It is good to have all females in the herd on active status. Cost isn't that much
and you don't have to register all the calves, just the one's you see fit. It is good to turn in all information
on all calves for accuracy sake. :2cents:
DM

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Nice cow.

 

[hillsdown]

That is it right there. This skew in the numbers when the breeders cherry pick who they will spend the money to register - only the top animals - and the middle end and the low end goes totally unrecorded, well that isn't doing their breed's database any favors. If you don't have a complete contemporary group to evaluate, you don't have the best data. The breeds that stuck their neck out and did Whole Herd, Complete Herd, Total Herd fee structures where you pay a fee for every registered cow and are expected to report every calf have brought those breeds light years ahead on their data collection and the strength of their EPD. Even though about every breed has a "compute" or "record" option, most breeders just won't spend that extra money and do the extra work to report their whole calf crop. The "whole herd" concept was recommended in the 1990's by BIF but not every breed association had the guts to adopt it.

Totally agree with you MO. I compute all information for every single calf born here and submit to the association . Then only the best of the calf crop each year get chosen to be registered . All cows in the herd are assessed each year so if I do not submit information on their calf they do not get credit for it .

As far as the cow not being of good quality because she was chosen not to be registered, well that is a misnomer. There are a lot of purebred commercial cattle out there that look and do a lot better than some of the purebred registered stock out there.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do JHH.

 

[ffamom]

In my opinion, breed associations shouldn't charge to report. Why waste my money. If it was a data basis to enter info was free, I would take the time to do it. Otherwise, animals going to the sale barn are not recorded. We only have 20 head of registered cows, and only register 1 or 2 out of that group some years none. Not worth it for us. Making money is our top priority. Some years making a profit is determined by saving your pennies.