beefmaster angus cross bull

[ALACOWMAN]

the difference is the heterosis in the moma. thats the whole ball of wax . you' ll see the the results of it in your calf , decrease or increase the percentage of one of the breeds in the cross bred bull will make a big difference in the calf but the F1 bulls heterosis fizzles out past him. but in the cow it is well represented in the calf.

 

[MoGal]

Trin: I did a google on crossbreeding composites and there's a world of information out there. Unfortunately as I was cutting and pasting the links my great niece (3 yrs old) turned my computer off (I have a switch on the wall that controls the plug in and occasionally she turns it off for me bless her heart!!).

Anyway you do lose some heterosis by using a 6 way composite.

Perhaps you need to give some thought to .......
what does your herd of cows lack now, what are you dissatisfied with in the present calves?

You don't say if they are already crossbred or are they purebred cows. one of the detriments of using a 6 breed composite was color consistency as they said it takes a few more generations to get that.

 

[bbyou]

ALACOWMAN,
The question was "How is using unproven purebred bulls on F1 cows different from using an unproven F1 bull on purebred cows?" Point being, Unproven is Unproven.

I asked Robert L. (BOB) Weaber, Ph.D, PAS, Assistant Professor at the University of Missouri Columbia his thoughts on heterosis and crossbreeding. I have included a copy of his response below.

"Thanks for you question regarding heterosis and crossbreeding. A frequently cited example of crossbreeding is the use of purebred bulls of one breed on F1 crossbred cows of two other breeds, (e.g. Charolais bulls on Hereford X Angus cows); known as a terminal sire F1 program. This type of system maximizes both maternal heterosis and individual (calf) heterosis and most estimates indicate heterosis in this program is worth about $100 per cow per year. Maternal heterosis (maximized in F1 cows) accounts for about 2/3 of the economic advantage of crossbreeding and, therefore, is important for a successful crossbreeding system. Purebred bulls on purebred cows of a different breed only captures the heterosis expressed by calves produced in this system and only gets 1/3 of the economic advantage of maximal heterosis. The use of F1 bulls on straight bred cows can produce a fair amount of heterosis in calf, but misses out on maternal heterosis due to straight bred cows. F1 bulls are becoming popular for use on crossbred cows of the same breed composition (eg. ½ Simmental and ½ Angus) because this system captures 50% of the heterosis of terminal sire F1 program but is as easy as straight breeding to implement and manage.

Keep in mind that when crossbreeding increasing the percentage of one breed in an animal at the expense of others decreases heterosis. For example if you have a F1 Hereford X Angus cow (has 100% individual and maternal heterosis) and mate her to an Angus bull, the calf produced is ¾ Angus and ¼ Hereford . This animal has 50% of the heterosis of its dam."

 

[Diehard40]

here comes that dead horse that has been beat how many times in here
how much cross breeding is too much?
crossbred bulls use or not???
:roll:

 

[bbyou]

If is wasnt for "dead horses" to talk about, we all be working today instead of typing on the internet.

The better question is "How many people are reading this forum while on someone elses time?" ;-)

 

[MountainFarmChar]

• Your looking at a crap shoot calf crop

. Cutting corners on the bull is not the place to do it. If you want good black calfs go spend the money and get a good Angus bull.

thats for sure you got a four breeds wadded up in one package. come calving time the calve's will look like a paint chart at sears

calves will look like a paint chart :?:

I have a spring crop of calves, bull is a reg Beefmaster, cows are reg/purebred Charolais. All the calves are solid brown with the exception of one which has a little white on its face. That's a long long long way from looking like a paint chart :nod: .

 

[ALACOWMAN]

If is wasnt for "dead horses" to talk about, we all be working today instead of typing on the internet.

The better question is "

• How many people are reading this forum while on someone elses time?" ;-)

well im guilty of that one . but breeding crossbred to crossbred out the same breeding is sort of like breeding F2'S. the part about unproven bull is this. i know i can take a strait purebred good quality bull. and mate to a equal cow of another breed that complement each other in their best traits and produce a F1 moma that is superior to the parents. and the calf from her will be the top of the heterosis in the moma. with the F1 bull no matter how good is limited to the purebred cow, this bull we are talking about has a genetic root system that could go in any direction with the calves. each one would be like a grab bag at the carnival

 

[ALACOWMAN]

• Your looking at a crap shoot calf crop

. Cutting corners on the bull is not the place to do it. If you want good black calfs go spend the money and get a good Angus bull.

thats for sure you got a four breeds wadded up in one package. come calving time the calve's will look like a paint chart at sears

calves will look like a paint chart :?:

I have a spring crop of calves, bull is a reg Beefmaster, cows are reg/purebred Charolais. All the calves are solid brown with the exception of one which has a little white on its face. That's a long long long way from looking like a paint chart :nod: .

yea and theres a big difference in your bull too.. and along way from what this discussion pertains too

 

[alabama]

I don't think a cross bred bull is the best for cross bred cows most of the time.
A two or 3 way cross on claves is plenty.
If you have a bunch of mixed cows a good line bred bull should help your calf crop be more consistant.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

I don't think a cross bred bull is the best for cross bred cows most of the time.
A two or 3 way cross on claves is plenty.
If you have a bunch of mixed cows a good line bred bull should help your calf crop be more consistant.

especially one like this.. this is one of those deal's where you would have to line breed for several years to get the breed consistant enough to take on the road. and by then the hybred vigor would be gone but for now its a gamble and a dam big one. one that really aint worth taking unless.. you want to move backward in you program