Angus, a superior product or superior marketing?

[easy]

Black Angus. The are what they are. As I said before, with the multitude of problems that some on here say the breed has then the pitch that is coming your way must look like a beachball in slow motion, not the hard slider that Angus breeders think they have thrown. Question now is simply this. Can you hit it? or better yet Will you even make contact?

 

[novatech]

I for one have never said it was bad. I beleive that all anyone is saying is "it ain't all that" as most angus breeder's would like you to beleive and have been brain washed to beleive themselves. If you would just listen to yourself you would know that you are in fact the proof of that.

I am NOT on here pushing Angus. IF you are telling me that somebody very knowledgable about his breed can assemble a set of Herefords, Charolais, Simmentals, Limousins, Beefmasters, Gerts, Shorthorns, or any other mainstream breed of cattle that will perform in a given environment with specific production goals (whether it be weaning wt, ADG, carcass wt, YG, Feed efficiency, lbs of calves weaned per cow exposed, etc) BETTER than a generic set of Black Angus cows I TOTALLY AGREE!!!.....No argument!! I have no doubt of that at all. Of course the opposite is probably also true. The 2006 Angus herd is NOT the greatest set of cows we will ever see in our lifetimes. I think most of the Angus guys will admist that there are SOME weak sisters out there. There is a lot of room for improvement. All I am saying is that there are SOME posters on here who are constantly throwing stones at Angus (and I am NOT an Angus breeder) that rarely, if ever, say anything positive about the cattle they THINK offer us a better alternative.

Sorry Brandonm : I reread, and found I have directed my statements at the wrong person. I agree with you. Don't through stones at angus. I raise brahman and I don,t like it when people bash them.

Yesterday, just for fun, I went to the grocery store. I stoped 20 diferent women and asked about cab.steaks. Not one cared weather it was cab or not. I went to the local butcher shop. The butcher said thet ever once in a while someone would ask what kind of beef he was selling? He replied that he did not have any idea. He gauranteed everything he sold.
This makes me wonder how much is sold because it is cab and how much is sold because that is what has been put in the cooler in front of them.

 

[easy]

What item is most likely to be shoplifted from a grocery store?

 

[Brandonm2]

Sorry Brandonm : I reread, and found I have directed my statements at the wrong person. I agree with you. Don't through stones at angus. I raise brahman and I don,t like it when people bash them.

Yesterday, just for fun, I went to the grocery store. I stoped 20 diferent women and asked about cab.steaks. Not one cared weather it was cab or not. I went to the local butcher shop. The butcher said thet ever once in a while someone would ask what kind of beef he was selling? He replied that he did not have any idea. He gauranteed everything he sold.
This makes me wonder how much is sold because it is cab and how much is sold because that is what has been put in the cooler in front of them.

I don't buy Angus myself, unless they are reduced to the commodity price or are the best steaks available; BUT somebody IS buying them because they sit on that shelf priced $2-3 more per lb than the commodity steaks next to them and they do go somewhere. Do you think women are the ones to be asking? If I heard the stat on the tv right, only 35% of American women are married. That means most men are single/divorced/widowers and would be buying their own groceries.

 

[novatech]

Sorry Brandonm : I reread, and found I have directed my statements at the wrong person. I agree with you. Don't through stones at angus. I raise brahman and I don,t like it when people bash them.

Yesterday, just for fun, I went to the grocery store. I stoped 20 diferent women and asked about cab.steaks. Not one cared weather it was cab or not. I went to the local butcher shop. The butcher said thet ever once in a while someone would ask what kind of beef he was selling? He replied that he did not have any idea. He gauranteed everything he sold.
This makes me wonder how much is sold because it is cab and how much is sold because that is what has been put in the cooler in front of them.

I don't buy Angus myself, unless they are reduced to the commodity price or are the best steaks available; BUT somebody IS buying them because they sit on that shelf priced $2-3 more per lb than the commodity steaks next to them and they do go somewhere. Do you think women are the ones to be asking? If I heard the stat on the tv right, only 35% of American women are married. That means most men are single/divorced/widowers and would be buying their own groceries.

I have worked for myself most of my working life (everyone else fired me). I have found that most people relate price to quality. We charge more than our competetion. We get more work and make a better profit. Angus implemented this before anyone else. Now no-one can take it away no matter how much
better their beef is.

 

[Scotty]

So are you going to fund all the costs involved and I just show up and eat? Or are you eating what the cat drug in? Pure unadulturated nonsence.

 

[Scotty]

Funding??

No way! Fact: Angus is at the top of the quality ladder. YOU have the burden of knocking it down however many rungs you choose.

Now, if you will come down to Wharton with your wives or significant other (at your own cost), I'll bring the best certified Angus steak that I can find, supply the pit, supply the beer or whatever you drink, and you bring your best certified beef. The ladies (or significant other) get to judge. Results will be final.

guest25 funds, I eat and judge. I would even supply a calve to butcher. Can I bring some beer? I will even bring your favorite.

 

[VanC]

http://cattletoday.com/associations.shtml

No body likes Angus cattle.

By my count, that's 270,000 Angus and 531,200 not Angus. Yes, Angus is by far the most popular, but there are almost twice as many people registering other breeds. Anyway, I think this link may be out of date since I remember reading somewhere that Angus registrations were around 325,000 in 2005. Anybody have anything more recent? No doubt Angus would still be number 1, but it would be interesting to see if the gap is closing or widening.

Also, does anyone have any reliable numbers on commercial cattle in the U.S.? I can't come up with anything with a google search.

 

[WORANCH]

http://cattletoday.com/associations.shtml

No body likes Angus cattle.

By my count, that's 270,000 Angus and 531,200 not Angus. Yes, Angus is by far the most popular, but there are almost twice as many people registering other breeds. Anyway, I think this link may be out of date since I remember reading somewhere that Angus registrations were around 325,000 in 2005. Anybody have anything more recent? No doubt Angus would still be number 1, but it would be interesting to see if the gap is closing or widening.

Also, does anyone have any reliable numbers on commercial cattle in the U.S.? I can't come up with anything with a google search.

Released July 21, 2006, by the National Agricultural Statistics
Service (NASS), Agricultural Statistics Board, U.S. Department of
Agriculture. For information on "Cattle" call Mike Miller at
202-720-3040, office hours 7:30 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. ET.




July 1 Cattle Inventory Up 1 Percent


All cattle and calves in the United States as of July 1, 2006,
totaled 105.7 million head, 1 percent above the 104.5 million on
July 1, 2005 and 2 percent above the 103.4 million two years ago.

All cows and heifers that have calved, at 43.0 million, were up
slightly from the 42.8 million on July 1, 2005 and 1 percent above
the 42.4 million two years ago.

Beef cows, at 33.9 million, were up slightly from July 1,
2005 and up 1 percent from two years ago.

Milk cows, at 9.15 million, were up 1 percent from July 1,
2005 and up 2 percent from two years ago.

Other class estimates on July 1, 2006 and the changes from July 1,
2005, are as follows:

All heifers 500 pounds and over, 16.5 million, up 2 percent.

Beef replacement heifers, 5.0 million, unchanged.

Milk replacement heifers, 3.8 million, up 3 percent.

Other heifers, 7.7 million, up 3 percent.

Steers weighing 500 pounds and over, 14.9 million, up 3
percent.

Bulls weighing 500 pounds and over, 2.1 million, unchanged.

Calves under 500 pounds, 29.2 million, up 1 percent.

All cattle and calves on feed for slaughter, 12.5 million, up
4 percent.


Calf Crop Up Slightly

The 2006 calf crop is expected to be 37.9 million, up slightly from
2005 and up 1 percent from 2004. Calves born during the first half
of the year are estimated at 27.6 million, up 1 percent from 2005
and up 1 percent from 2004.

 

[VanC]

Number of commercial cattle in the U.S.? There's got to be an educated guess somewhere. I'LL look. What's the relevance?

No real relevance. Just curious. The AAA says that 60% of the U.S. cowherd is Angus based. I don't doubt it. Was just wondering how other breeds stack up in numbers on the commercial side. Might be hard, if not impossible, to track. Especially since one animal could have multiple breeds in it.

 

[VanC]

http://cattletoday.com/associations.shtml

No body likes Angus cattle.

By my count, that's 270,000 Angus and 531,200 not Angus. Yes, Angus is by far the most popular, but there are almost twice as many people registering other breeds. Anyway, I think this link may be out of date since I remember reading somewhere that Angus registrations were around 325,000 in 2005. Anybody have anything more recent? No doubt Angus would still be number 1, but it would be interesting to see if the gap is closing or widening.

Also, does anyone have any reliable numbers on commercial cattle in the U.S.? I can't come up with anything with a google search.

Released July 21, 2006, by the National Agricultural Statistics
Service (NASS), Agricultural Statistics Board, U.S. Department of
Agriculture. For information on "Cattle" call Mike Miller at
202-720-3040, office hours 7:30 a.m. to 4:00 p.m. ET.




July 1 Cattle Inventory Up 1 Percent


All cattle and calves in the United States as of July 1, 2006,
totaled 105.7 million head, 1 percent above the 104.5 million on
July 1, 2005 and 2 percent above the 103.4 million two years ago.

All cows and heifers that have calved, at 43.0 million, were up
slightly from the 42.8 million on July 1, 2005 and 1 percent above
the 42.4 million two years ago.

Beef cows, at 33.9 million, were up slightly from July 1,
2005 and up 1 percent from two years ago.

Milk cows, at 9.15 million, were up 1 percent from July 1,
2005 and up 2 percent from two years ago.

Other class estimates on July 1, 2006 and the changes from July 1,
2005, are as follows:

All heifers 500 pounds and over, 16.5 million, up 2 percent.

Beef replacement heifers, 5.0 million, unchanged.

Milk replacement heifers, 3.8 million, up 3 percent.

Other heifers, 7.7 million, up 3 percent.

Steers weighing 500 pounds and over, 14.9 million, up 3
percent.

Bulls weighing 500 pounds and over, 2.1 million, unchanged.

Calves under 500 pounds, 29.2 million, up 1 percent.

All cattle and calves on feed for slaughter, 12.5 million, up
4 percent.


Calf Crop Up Slightly

The 2006 calf crop is expected to be 37.9 million, up slightly from
2005 and up 1 percent from 2004. Calves born during the first half
of the year are estimated at 27.6 million, up 1 percent from 2005
and up 1 percent from 2004.

Thanks, but I was looking for breed makeup more than anything. As I said above, might be impossible to get a true picture. I would imagine that the number of registrations would be a pretty good indicator of what's going through the packers and feedlots.

 

[Schnurrbart]

Polluted are not, the fact is that the AAA at least funds research programs (not "claims") to not only identify tenderness traits/characteristics but also act upon them through educating the public and yes - - - a whole lot of marketing. They have also gained more ground in getting closer that illusive thing called "consistency" than anyone else. For some reason, folks get stuck on "marbleing". Yes, there are other breeds that marble well but then can't compare in the shear testing with Angus.

Which would you rather buy, a "netherparts" steak or something where at least the idea of tenderness has been worked on?

Yes, I saw the results of one such test that compared Angus and Tarentaise on taste and tenderness several years ago at a midwestern university. Needless to say that since Angus paid for the test, it was not published.

 

[Schnurrbart]

Baloney

The argument that Angus only sells because of marketing, is pure garbage. Millions of consumers can't all be wrong. Sure, we might buy a bad steak at a restaurant once or twice but thats about it. Consumers buy and request Angus because they like the taste and tenderness. If Shorthorn and Simmental
were so superior to Angus then why is it not in the restaurants? No money for marketing you say? Why is that? There's plenty of people out there with deep pockets. Why aren't they investing in this "superior meat" called Shorthorn or SImmental- - because it isn't.

I have yet to see a Shorthorn label at the grocery store. Where is it? Not even at a small butcher shop!

As to an Angus bull solving calving problems? Why not just get a bull with a low BW EPD?

You go to a restaurant in a city especially in the east and ask the people there who are eating steaks what it is and most will say Angus. They wouldn't know an Angus if is sitting next to them. That is marketing my friend. Nothing more than marketing. That is just like CAB. We all know that CAB isn't all Angus. Many black hided cattle are sold in CAB. Marketing!!!

 

[VanC]

Lets talk about a true test where beef is supplied by any and all the breeds that want to participate. All beef must be verified as having the genetic makeup portrayed. No one but the unbiased judges will know what number goes along with each breeds steaks.

Real testing no one knowing in the least possible way what they are eating. All meat cooked in the same manner no marinating just natural beef.

For the record if you are raising angus Brahma cross the Brahma compliments the angus and helps make the angus desirable if it angus can be desirable.

Lets see how about conducting the test in cab-s own back yard the Wayne county fair couple hundred thousand people go through there every fall.

I'm quite sure some of them would be angus breeders or cross breeders.


Any serious takers from any breed only two things can happen from the angus side. There will be no doubt about what beef is best. It will just be a matter of will the angus breeders be able to strut their stuff or will they leave with being disgraced.

I have never put much stock in taste tests, whether it's for beef, beer, popcorn or anything else. Everyone has different tastes. It's simply a matter of preference, and one person's preference is no better than the next.

 

[Badlands]

Yes, I saw the results of one such test that compared Angus and Tarentaise on taste and tenderness several years ago at a midwestern university. Needless to say that since Angus paid for the test, it was not published.

Heck, Angus didn't pay for it. The Tarentaise guys paid for it. It just wasn't published because the folks were afraid they wouldn't get more "research" funds from Angus.

Great example of how much power CAB/AAA has. Somebody else pays for the research, but the University won't publish it out of fear they might not get funded in the future.

Schurrnbart, these guys don't have a clue how nasty this CAB/AAA collusion is.

Heck, I know guys that were fired from Wooster for being unwilling to play the CAB games.

Badlands

 

[Angus Guy]

Well I think it's about time to let this dog lie. We angus promoters are never and I mean never going to convince these anti-angus people that we are the best. I've been hereing this song and dance about angus just being a fad that will die for more than 40 years. It's now time for them to step up to the plate and start to show us just what their cattle are made of. We have been considerate enough not to bash their breeds or their branded programs if they have one. So come on guys show us exactly what you've got. I promise I won't bash you. And I won't compare you to CAB. Just let us see what you got. And when you do it please use your purebred cattle not the ones that have been bred to be angus look alikes.

 

[Angus Guy]

Those are just fine. Now lets see the data as to what they are doing to promote they're programs.

 

[Angus Guy]

Lets not limit it to just those breeds. I say this because I know the others still have cattle in their original hide pattern.

 

[phillse]

The intent of My original post was to cause people to think. I am not sure that much thinking is going on on this thread now. It seems as iff everyone is resorted to name calling. I know that I do not like pompas breeders of any breed. In fact all breeds have thier problems. Angus has its share as does the rest. I think ANgus cattle fit into a composite program very nicely and have certain traits that make them dedirable. The truth is ANgus cattle will always be arround. They have done too good of a job at promoting the breed to not be.

My main question is this, how do other breeds reclaim their position? Thier are several breeds that can offer just as good of cattle as ANgus. Why are these breeds not being more aggressive in claiming their market share?

 

[dun]

The intent of My original post was to cause people to think. I am not sure that much thinking is going on on this thread now. It seems as iff everyone is resorted to name calling.

This thread has actaully goneon much longer without it deteriorating like any CAB thread usually does.
Here's a way to determine from an unbiased standpoint which breed has the best taste. Send me a 1 inch thick top sirloin from the breed of your choice and send Macon a pm with what breed it is. I'll cook it and eat it then evaluate it. I don;t really have an axe to grind as to breed, I just like to eat steak.

dun