Angus, a superior product or superior marketing?

[phillse]

I have been involved for nearly 20 yrs with cattle. Starting as a little fella. One of the things I find interesting is the power of marketing. I hear so many people say black angus meat is better, and that u need to use an Angus blull to solve calving problems.

I want your opinions on these two topics. because I think it is a load of crock. I am not taking away from the good Angus cattle out there, and I can not fault them for great advertising. I am just curious why no other breed has ramped up their advertising or really met head on the idea that Black is better. I personaly think that good cattle are good cattle no matter the color.

What makes Angus the marbling King? All british cattle marble well. And research at the Meat Animal Research Center indicates or proves that Angus doesn't have the highest % of choice meat of all breeds. As for calving ease, I have pulled to many Angus calves. There is no magic breed, yes some breeds tend to have easier calving, but the bloodline determines that. Why can't people get it through their heads that just becasue a bull is a certain breed, his calves will be born easily.

Also, don't give me this pompas junk that Angus has no outside blood because they don't have a % or Appendix program. Angus did not go from being little short cattle so quickly without the use of outside genetics. Registration papers are only as accurate and trust worthy as the people behind them.

 

[JonB]

I have never knowingly ate angus meat and thought it was better than any other, in fact there were times that I was not pleased at all. As for using angus to solve calving problems, sure they can do it with the right bloodlines and data being used, but so can almost any other bred. King of marbling? They may marble well, but they push it too hard and get them high YG carcasses too of a YG of 4+ on many of them and when they get that fat they can't quilify for CAB. I seen in a MARC study of angus vs. shorthorn sire calves. Of this group only 15% of the angus sire calves qulified for CAB but nearly 60% of the black hided shorthorn sired calves qulified for CAB. Why? The angus YG was too high because they were too fat.

 

[*Cowgirl*]

I am just curious why no other breed has ramped up their advertising or really met head on the idea that Black is better.

Cause no other assoc. has the cash of the AAA.

Angus can make all these claims, simply b/c people will believe them.

 

[Badlands]

Too funny.

Only someone with their head completely in their netherparts would think they were pure.

Of course now I expect a bunch of short term breeders (less than 20 years) cry about that.

And the other group would be the ones who own a bunch of the polluted bloodlines.



Badlands

 

[Badlands]

Angus hasn't done much to help select for tenderness.

The markers only explain a small percentage of the variation.

Simmental actually has tenderness EPD based on testing the tenderness of steaks.

You've been listening to too much of the Angus "education".

Badlands

 

[phillse]

:lol: Really, if Angus is the Tenderness cattle then why are 97% of ALL Shorthorns carrying two copies of the tenderness gene. Don't bring that bull crap in here about ANGUS being the tenderness King, and that they actually do research Shorthorn has research to back there claims up as does Simmental which shows that simmental have nearly as high of quality grades as Angus, the difference is they kick Angus's tail in YG. Angus is good , but face it they simply have done a better job marketing and as a result they have more money which means they can fund more marketing which in the end leads to more members and more marketing. And face it people are impresionable and will believe all the hype.

Polluted are not, the fact is that the AAA at least funds research programs (not "claims") to not only identify tenderness traits/characteristics but also act upon them through educating the public and yes - - - a whole lot of marketing. They have also gained more ground in getting closer that illusive thing called "consistency" than anyone else. For some reason, folks get stuck on "marbleing". Yes, there are other breeds that marble well but then can't compare in the shear testing with Angus.

Which would you rather buy, a "netherparts" steak or something where at least the idea of tenderness has been worked on?

 

[bward]

There seems to be more than one kind of Angus. First there is the Classic or common Angus that is shorter, has the high set Panda type ears, tight hide, slightly bulging eyes, lighter shorter leg bone, that weighs in that general 1100 to 1250 lbs.

Then there is a new strain that is quite different than the Classic Angus being in that 1350 to 1500 pound range that is larger framed, heavier boned, looser hided, lower set larger hairier ears, fleshier eyes, taller.

Sometimes I wonder if the Angus people are trying to get their animals to look more like a Black Simmental. ;-) .... It seems to be the latter type that win all the shows now.

 

[MikeC]

Where's Frankie? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[MikeC]

If Shorthorn and Simmental
were so superior to Angus then why is it not in the restaurants?

It is. Under the CAB label. Yet angus gets the credit. ;-)

 

[JonB]

You hit the nail on the head there MikeC.

 

[6M Ranch]

Why does someone start an Angus bashing thread every two weeks or so? Is anyone else getting tired of this? We raise Angus, for several different reasons. But I'm not going to claim they're the best cattle on the market. I think all breeds have an advantage in different areas. Raised properly, with proper genetics, I think that any breed will be tender, and marble. Everybody always whines about the current number 1. IF you don't like it, spend the money promoting your breed. I have yet to see a single Shorthorn, Simmental, Maine, Hereford or anyone else ad on the TV. Back in the '60s, my family raised Herefords, they were the king. Same complaints back then. Maybe 10 years from now, Simmentals will be on top, then we can whine about them!

 

[MikeC]

Why does someone start an Angus bashing thread every two weeks or so? Is anyone else getting tired of this? We raise Angus, for several different reasons. But I'm not going to claim they're the best cattle on the market. I think all breeds have an advantage in different areas. Raised properly, with proper genetics, I think that any breed will be tender, and marble. Everybody always whines about the current number 1. IF you don't like it, spend the money promoting your breed. I have yet to see a single Shorthorn, Simmental, Maine, Hereford or anyone else ad on the TV. Back in the '60s, my family raised Herefords, they were the king. Same complaints back then. Maybe 10 years from now, Simmentals will be on top, then we can whine about them!

Maybe because some people think the Angus breed is taking money out of their pocket by spending vast sums on advertising that some might say is inaccurate? Just a guess. ;-)

 

[skcatlman]

CAB what ever? To Qualify for CAB in the Plant, a black nose and black tongue was required when the border was open prior to bse. The feedlot i worked at shipped 6000 head to nebraska under the CAB program. So we checked and sent white cattle with black noses and tongues, we sent reds that had black in the right spots, so after seeing what CAB is doing as long as they grade the program doen't care what breed they are. As far as angus being pure ? yeah i custom calved a bunch of cattle and the heifers were bred angus and had baldie calves with horns, they were dna tested and matched to the angus sire. I thought angus were homo polled, i guess not. So what else is in them i really don't care if the bull does what you need him to i'm good to go, but don't claim the purity and no exotic blood . I was recently looking thru an AI stud book and saw a angus bull with a 66 lb actual BW. and 1500 lb YW then a otherwith a 76 lb actual BW and a 1600 YW. come on i was born on a day but it wasn't yesterday. Performance and birth wt. have a dirct relationship the lower the BW the lower the YW and vise versa. There is no way to get that kind of perf. in a pure angus or it would at least be a freak, but for one ranch to get these results on angus consistantly ???????????????

 

[6M Ranch]

A lot of people complain about Angus cattle, but they also take advantage of it. How many black Maines, Simmentals and now Herefords were there before CAB? Very hypocritical to BITCH constantly, then go cash that premium check. Instead of sitting in the coffee shop and complaining how unfair life is, go out and promote your breed.

 

[phillse]

I am not saying that Angus cattle are not good. I am not saying that Any particular breed is the best. I just get tired of jerks telling me that my cattle suck because they are not Angus. And I agree that with the right genetics, and when raised properly most breeds will marble.

I did not mean to start this as A Bash Angus topic. I wanted to bring to the foreground, that no breed is the end all and be all breed. In fact, their are several Angus Bulls which I feel are good, but I also feel that their are several bulls in the Simmental, Charolais, Shorthorn, Red Angus, Gelbvieh, Hereford, South Devon bulls that are good.

I often tell people pick the breed you like and find the Genetics within that breed that are fundamentally sound and fits your environment. If my cattle are not fundamentally and do not perform then, yes they are not good, but I get tired of pompas, ignorant, misinformed people, telling me they are no good because they are not Angus without ever seeing them

I will be the first to tell you the problems as I view them of the breeds which I raise. I also tell buyers the pros and the cons of my cattle. The quality of the cattle is the important factor in any breed and that varies by bloodline.

Why does someone start an Angus bashing thread every two weeks or so? Is anyone else getting tired of this? We raise Angus, for several different reasons. But I'm not going to claim they're the best cattle on the market. I think all breeds have an advantage in different areas. Raised properly, with proper genetics, I think that any breed will be tender, and marble. Everybody always whines about the current number 1. IF you don't like it, spend the money promoting your breed. I have yet to see a single Shorthorn, Simmental, Maine, Hereford or anyone else ad on the TV. Back in the '60s, my family raised Herefords, they were the king. Same complaints back then. Maybe 10 years from now, Simmentals will be on top, then we can whine about them!

 

[backhoeboogie]

The angus you see today are nothing like the pure angus you saw thirty to forty years ago.

 

[john250]

I have been involved for nearly 20 yrs with cattle. Starting as a little fella. One of the things I find interesting is the power of marketing. I hear so many people say black angus meat is better, and that u need to use an Angus blull to solve calving problems.

I want your opinions on these two topics. because I think it is a load of crock. I am not taking away from the good Angus cattle out there, and I can not fault them for great advertising. I am just curious why no other breed has ramped up their advertising or really met head on the idea that Black is better. I personaly think that good cattle are good cattle no matter the color.

What makes Angus the marbling King? All british cattle marble well. And research at the Meat Animal Research Center indicates or proves that Angus doesn't have the highest % of choice meat of all breeds. As for calving ease, I have pulled to many Angus calves. There is no magic breed, yes some breeds tend to have easier calving, but the bloodline determines that. Why can't people get it through their heads that just becasue a bull is a certain breed, his calves will be born easily.

Also, don't give me this pompas junk that Angus has no outside blood because they don't have a % or Appendix program. Angus did not go from being little short cattle so quickly without the use of outside genetics. Registration papers are only as accurate and trust worthy as the people behind them.

I didn't do the poll. Neither answer is correct.
Angus out-marketed other breeds. Pure and simple.
It's more than smoke and mirrors. De=horning used to cost me one a year out of 70. No horns=no loss.
It isn't that it's Angus, the value is that it's 'Process Verified".
Traceable. Like you'd sell to a neighbor.

 

[*Cowgirl*]

CAB what ever? To Qualify for CAB in the Plant, a black nose and black tongue was required when the border was open prior to bse. The feedlot i worked at shipped 6000 head to nebraska under the CAB program. So we checked and sent white cattle with black noses and tongues, we sent reds that had black in the right spots, so after seeing what CAB is doing as long as they grade the program doen't care what breed they are. As far as angus being pure ? yeah i custom calved a bunch of cattle and the heifers were bred angus and had baldie calves with horns, they were dna tested and matched to the angus sire. I thought angus were homo polled, i guess not. So what else is in them i really don't care if the bull does what you need him to i'm good to go, but don't claim the purity and no exotic blood . I was recently looking thru an AI stud book and saw a angus bull with a 66 lb actual BW. and 1500 lb YW then a otherwith a 76 lb actual BW and a 1600 YW. come on i was born on a day but it wasn't yesterday. Performance and birth wt. have a dirct relationship the lower the BW the lower the YW and vise versa. There is no way to get that kind of perf. in a pure angus or it would at least be a freak, but for one ranch to get these results on angus consistantly ???????????????

I agree that these#s were probably fudged, but i disagree that low BW = low YW

 

[MikeC]

I agree that these#s were probably fudged, but i disagree that low BW = low YW

There is a high negative correlation between BW and YW.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

to tell the truth ive missed her shes got plenty of sand. and keeps you boy's occupied ;-)