Where's the Money?

[Hasbeen]

I'm going to give two examples and I would like some comments on each. We all understand there are many variables to each situation, but let's try just use general equations for our discussion.

Example 1: A farmer has roughly 25 acres of pasture capable of supporting 12 cow/calf pairs and a bull. Must buy hay @ around $25.00 per roll. Feeds hay from Mid October thru mid March. Has all fences in place and in good repair.

Example 2: Same farmer, same land. Roughly 20 acres is tillable. He decides to get rid of cattle and rotate planting corn and soybeans. Most soil is very sandy so will probably need heavy fertilization.

Which example (or neither or combination) would bring in the most money? Is crop farming in sandy soil even an option.

 

[alabama]

I think the cost of equipment will make the diff. Have you priced a combine?

 

[Caustic Burno]

I'm going to give two examples and I would like some comments on each. We all understand there are many variables to each situation, but let's try just use general equations for our discussion.

Example 1: A farmer has roughly 25 acres of pasture capable of supporting 12 cow/calf pairs and a bull. Must buy hay @ around $25.00 per roll. Feeds hay from Mid October thru mid March. Has all fences in place and in good repair.

Example 2: Same farmer, same land. Roughly 20 acres is tillable. He decides to get rid of cattle and rotate planting corn and soybeans. Most soil is very sandy so will probably need heavy fertilization.

Which example (or neither or combination) would bring in the most money? Is crop farming in sandy soil even an option.

The best you could do is make about twelve hundred bucks off the cattle and that's with a 100% survival rate on the calfs.
You would really have to watch your pennies.

 

[Hasbeen]

I think the cost of equipment will make the diff. Have you priced a combine?

Wouldn't really think a combine would make much sense for 20 acres. With the number of hours I'm putting in taking care of the cows and the related farm items I believe I could pick each ear by hand and come out ahead. :lol: I was thinking more of the old one row corn pickers pulled behind the tractor.

 

[Hasbeen]

The best you could do is make about twelve hundred bucks off the cattle and that's with a 100% survival rate on the calfs.
You would really have to watch your pennies.[/quote]

Since I joined the site I've been reading what you've preached about profit margin and you're absolutely right. I had a little bad luck and only got five calves (out of eight heifers) for my first crop. That's probably only going to be about $3000 income and once I subtract expenses (which I track carefully) I should just about break even if I don't count my labor. If I paid myself even minimum wage, I would be badly in the hole.

Don't misunderstand. I knew going in there wouldn't be much money in it. I love the work and if I actually lived on the place I would probably be content with just a token profit. But working there from the time I get off my regular job until dark every night is starting to take a toll on my family. For some reason they want me around a little more often. I'd like to be able to cut back to maybe every other day but with live animals they need my attention 7/365. Now I know there are some who only see their animals once a month or so but that just isn't right to me.

 

[alabama]

I think the cost of equipment will make the diff. Have you priced a combine?

Wouldn't really think a combine would make much sense for 20 acres. With the number of hours I'm putting in taking care of the cows and the related farm items I believe I could pick each ear by hand and come out ahead. :lol: I was thinking more of the old one row corn pickers pulled behind the tractor.

I have a one row picker that I use to pick 10 acres for feed corn. It works for me but then I have cattle to fee it to. I don't know how well ear corn will sell.
I posted some pics of me picking corn a while back you might be able to find it.


Found it\

if you wait too long after drydown it gets full of weeds.

After a long day snapping corn

I need to get y'all some pics of the grinder I run it through.

 

[Caustic Burno]

The best you could do is make about twelve hundred bucks off the cattle and that's with a 100% survival rate on the calfs.
You would really have to watch your pennies.

Since I joined the site I've been reading what you've preached about profit margin and you're absolutely right. I had a little bad luck and only got five calves (out of eight heifers) for my first crop. That's probably only going to be about $3000 income and once I subtract expenses (which I track carefully) I should just about break even if I don't count my labor. If I paid myself even minimum wage, I would be badly in the hole.

Don't misunderstand. I knew going in there wouldn't be much money in it. I love the work and if I actually lived on the place I would probably be content with just a token profit. But working there from the time I get off my regular job until dark every night is starting to take a toll on my family. For some reason they want me around a little more often. I'd like to be able to cut back to maybe every other day but with live animals they need my attention 7/365. Now I know there are some who only see their animals once a month or so but that just isn't right to me.[/quote]

What are you doing every evening when you get off?
Once your infrastructure is up and you have grass there is not a lot to maintain.
You are a grass farmer now place grass in front of cow, bull behind cow. Quit making this hard I haven't put a tractor in a pasture since March. Check fences once a week. Those cows don't need or care for your help.

 

[Auburn_Ag]

quote]
I have a one row picker that I use to pick 10 acres for feed corn. It works for me but then I have cattle to fee it to. I don't know how well ear corn will sell. [/quote]

One maket you could have, is to sell the ears to these stores that sale corn for Squirrel feeders.

Here is a suggestion for the 25 acres you have. Plant it in Pine trees and leave it a lone. If you check around you might get the government to pay for part of the planting.

 

[backhoeboogie]

If you check around you might get the government to pay for part of the planting.

We get disconnected right here.

 

[KenB]

The one row corn picker will work.
;-) What about the soybeans?

 

[mdmdogs3]

around here they are talking about people putting in secondary crops when they have chicken houses -
they are suggesting vegetables like sweet potatoes, green beans or sweet corn, etc

this does make sense if you don't want to or can't have cows but yet you have land plus the free 8) fertilizer from the chickens

I've even heard them suggest cut flowers - don't remember what types...

 

[msscamp]

Is crop farming in sandy soil even an option.

Yes, but it presents a few challenges. I have a question for you - is it possible to raise non-irrigated corn? All of the corn I've ever seen raised has been irrigated, so I don't honestly know if it can be grown dry-land or not. Thank you in advance.

Alabama, your dog sure looks like he's enjoying that beer! :lol: :lol:

 

[john250]

I think the cost of equipment will make the diff. Have you priced a combine?

Wouldn't really think a combine would make much sense for 20 acres. With the number of hours I'm putting in taking care of the cows and the related farm items I believe I could pick each ear by hand and come out ahead. :lol: I was thinking more of the old one row corn pickers pulled behind the tractor.

I have a one row picker that I use to pick 10 acres for feed corn. It works for me but then I have cattle to fee it to. I don't know how well ear corn will sell.
I posted some pics of me picking corn a while back you might be able to find it.


Found it\

if you wait too long after drydown it gets full of weeds.

After a long day snapping corn

I need to get y'all some pics of the grinder I run it through.

I'd suggest, delicately, that your costs are low--but your cost of production is high. Even at todays prices, you can buy corn for less/bu than you are spending. That is a 20 bu/acre corn field if I ever saw one. You cannot make a profit on that. Corn belt folk, back me up here.

Graze those acres. I betcha thats a better answer.

 

[MoGal]

My brother in laws get 120 to 175 bushels to the acre but one has GPS his acreage and has fertilized it accordingly while the lower amount is using less fertilizer.

Corn doesn't have to have irrigation here (however I read an article last year in the MidAmerica Farmer/Grower that a farm in Benton, MO did (about 40 miles south) and they got 228 bushels to the acre. So yes there's a definite advantage to irrigation (if its available or cost effective).

On sand wouldn't you have to irrigate in order to grow anything??

 

[alabama]

I'd suggest, delicately, that your costs are low--but your cost of production is high. Even at todays prices, you can buy corn for less/bu than you are spending. That is a 20 bu/acre corn field if I ever saw one. You cannot make a profit on that. Corn belt folk, back me up here.

Graze those acres. I betcha thats a better answer.[/quote]

YOu are right but then we had a bad drought that year. I can make 150 bu/acre with rain.

 

[Hasbeen]

quote]


Here is a suggestion for the 25 acres you have. Plant it in Pine trees and leave it a lone. If you check around you might get the government to pay for part of the planting.

My total acreage is around 175. I already have about 150 acres in timber being harvested now. Nice, but that's a once every 20-25 year thing.

 

[Hasbeen]

Thanks for the reply and pics, Alabama. Your dog looks a little tipsy.

 

[alabama]

Thanks for the reply and pics, Alabama. Your dog looks a little tipsy.

He was cooling it after a long day in the hay field.

 

[Hasbeen]

What are you doing every evening when you get off?
Once your infrastructure is up and you have grass there is not a lot to maintain.
You are a grass farmer now place grass in front of cow, bull behind cow. Quit making this hard I haven't put a tractor in a pasture since March. Check fences once a week. Those cows don't need or care for your help.

The cows themselves actually take up very little time. I just count 'em and watch a few minutes to see if there are any problems. Trying to maintain and improve the place is what is taking up so much time this time of year. It's a half hour drive each way to get there or back home. At least half of my pastures are hillsides too steep to use a tractor on anyway.
I control the weeds with a riding mower and then use a weedeater in the places too steep for the mower. I use a lawn type spreader to reseed those areas. There's an acre in the back that I'm clearing to grow more grass. Cutting trees, moving hundreds of basketball sized rocks. Pastures are bordered by woods on 3 sides, so there is often a tree fell across a fence. This past weekend when I did my count I was one cow short. When I went looking back in the very back of my property I heard a cow bell on the other side of the fence and in the woods. Turns out some guy had turned loose 20 head or so into the hollow back there. No pastures, just mountains, woods, and creek bottoms. It's several hundred acres and the only fence is mine. I only had a four wire fence back there, there was nothing on the other side that my girls would be interested in up till now. Anyway, found where my heifer had went thru, rounded her up and put her back then spent the weekend adding another wire and fixing any weak spots I could find. As you all know, it's always something expected or not.

This sounds like I'm complaining. I'm not, I actually love doing this stuff. It's just the time involved. Once I get the place restored it will be much easier. If I could justify the expense of all the machinery that would help. I've even considered building a small house up there for summer/weekends but in such an isolated place the theives would clean it out the first day.

Anyway, I'm not as discouraged as it sounds. I'm just exploring options and getting opinions from people with way more experience than me. Thanks to everyone who has replied.

 

[Hasbeen]

The one row corn picker will work.
;-) What about the soybeans?

Good point.