Two newbies who bought two 6 mo Herford Heifers from

[GMN]

Guess you got to ask yourself why you bought the animals in the first place, just to have them, breed them, raise calves, butcher them at a later date, and go from there.

The poop on the butt, I think is normal, good grass makes loose stools, not a big issue. The flys, I use a sprayer with de lice soln, a few times during the summer, works great and is inexpensive, yu want to keep the flies away, especially with the white around their eyes, will be more susceptible to pink eye. Everything else is just common sense really, they are 6 months old, so they are beyond the calf issues, such as scours, etc.. They must be newly weaned from the Mom, so thats not an issue, I'd say just keep on what you are doing, and enjoy the new animals.

GMN

 

[dun]

Someone's culls are the next persons herd cows right?

Culls are culls for a reason. Get a clue please because if you don't, in the end, it could get you killed

I ahve somewhat of a problem with the second quote, but the first one is dead bang on. A cull from the kill pen at the sale barn is one thing. Just because one person is culling i.e. thinning down/disposing of some of his herd doesn;t automatically make the animal a reject. For some, those cows may be a real improvment. Folks cull animals for a lot of reasons not all of them negative. Too many heifers, dispose of all cows over a certain age, doesn;t fit the herd dynamics, etc.

 

[dressageophobia]

Thank you so much for your great comments. Very generous and I really appreciate it,

1) We really do have a great place. Better than most of the people on earth for two cows - seven acres all fenced with new five foot no climb on pounded posts. We have a working hotwire all around. (no barbed wire, no junk appliances, no wire laying around, no tires, no garbage (well maybe a little in the burn pile).

The land is debri and rock free and is growing nice grass. There are several good Oregon Ash shade trees.

We also have a 30 by 40 sand and gravel corral with a run in shed. Yeah it is for horses, but there are no horses on the property yet, so the cows think it is theirs.

What we do not have is a shoot or an alley. I really appreciate the alternatives you have presented in the area of controllling these animals if vetting is needed. With the set up we have there is probably a logical place that we could setup something that would work. We also have several 12 foot Behlen pipe round pen sections which we could set up into a temporary shoot. Anyone done something like that? If so what works?

2) I have done a bunch of research on cows. And I purposely did not get cows from the auction house (which is less than three miles from my home, so would have been the easiest), instead I called lots and lots of people and the cow vet and asked for a recommendation.

3) Got the heifers for a few reasons:
a-eat the grass (pasture mowers)
b-raise some beef
c-try new things

4) I really do not want to be killed or butted around by any animal, and yes horses can kill you too. I want to learn how to halter train a cow and break it...any suggestions on good reading there?

5) I purposefully bought these two girls from a reputable breeder. He was around 85 years of age and had been breeding for years. His family was on him to reduce his herd as a heifer almost killed him when he tried to herd her into a trailer. He just got himself boxed in with her and she panicked. He landed in the hospital with cracked ribs and hips. He has alot of heifers and these two I am sure were his culls as why would he sell me his best. At 85 he still loves his herd.

Sad because his bull (who he loved) suddently died (he thinks a neighbor poisoned it) so this last bunch of heifers are all he kept.

6) If we breed them there is a AI technician not too far away who comes out and does the deed. Just do not know if we really want to go there.

7) My husband is set on grass fed and I understand it can be a challenge for texture, etc. Appreciate any ideas you have on that.

Once again thank you very much!!

 

[mnmtranching]

A couple months ago I sold 2 heifers and a steer to a young couple.
The steer will be butchered in the Fall and the heifers for breeding. They had a good 10 acre fence with a cross fence. They have very little experience with cattle, but their friends so I agreed to sell.

Anyway, this is what I had them do before I brought the calves over. A 12X 20 3 sided shed for for shelter and confinement if necessary. A chute and place for a headgate. Water, mineral, salt. Give them a few pounds of grain a day. As the grass dries up later in the summer separate the Steer and increase the grain slowly. The calves are growing like crazy and doing real well.

My point, You don't need as much to have a few head of cattle as some think.

 

[Chris H]

1) We really do have a great place. Better than most of the people on earth for two cows - seven acres all fenced with new five foot no climb on pounded posts. We have a working hotwire all around. (no barbed wire, no junk appliances, no wire laying around, no tires, no garbage (well maybe a little in the burn pile).

The land is debri and rock free and is growing nice grass. There are several good Oregon Ash shade trees.

We also have a 30 by 40 sand and gravel corral with a run in shed. Yeah it is for horses, but there are no horses on the property yet, so the cows think it is theirs.

What we do not have is a shoot or an alley. I really appreciate the alternatives you have presented in the area of controllling these animals if vetting is needed. With the set up we have there is probably a logical place that we could setup something that would work. We also have several 12 foot Behlen pipe round pen sections which we could set up into a temporary shoot. Anyone done something like that? If so what works?
Sure, that can be done. Make sure they are secured in such a way that when the heifers stick their heads underneath that they won't lift them and knock them over. We've lost a few panels but never more than one damaged at a time because they are attached to posts.

4) I really do not want to be killed or butted around by any animal, and yes horses can kill you too. I want to learn how to halter train a cow and break it...any suggestions on good reading there?
Check out the show forum on this site for halter breaking hints.
A large number of our cattle are halter broken. It's nice when we need to get one out of a field, it's a nuisance when we're processing 50-60 pairs for vaccinations because they don't move through the chute as quickly.

5) I purposefully bought these two girls from a reputable breeder. He was around 85 years of age and had been breeding for years. His family was on him to reduce his herd as a heifer almost killed him when he tried to herd her into a trailer. He just got himself boxed in with her and she panicked. He landed in the hospital with cracked ribs and hips. He has alot of heifers and these two I am sure were his culls as why would he sell me his best. At 85 he still loves his herd.

That accident is what people on this board are trying to make you aware of. And that happened to an experienced guy who 'knew' his own cattle. Use your brain, don't rely on brawn, it may seem like more work to set up a few secure panels than to just push a tame heifer where you want her to go. That's how accidents happen.
On the plus side, there is an advantage to purchasing directly from a man who loves his herd. He would probably be your best source to ask about health concerns you have about the heifers, or how to feed them, or even halter break them.

7) My husband is set on grass fed and I understand it can be a challenge for texture, etc. Appreciate any ideas you have on that.
Any time an animal is gaining rapidly it will lay in extra fat which contributes to good taste & texture. Herefords can be grass fattened successfully and you are in a prime area to do that. If he is set on grass fed then he is probably aware of the health benefits associated with grass fed beef. Do not pull the animal off grass and put on grain during the last 3 months before butchering. Understand the flavor may be a bit different, but that is not bad. Legumes are supposed to impart a stronger flavor, but we've never had any complaints. Most of our pastures are a mix of grass & legumes.

 

[Ryder]

Someone's culls are the next persons herd cows right?

Culls are culls for a reason. Get a clue please because if you don't, in the end, it could get you killed

I ahve somewhat of a problem with the second quote, but the first one is dead bang on. A cull from the kill pen at the sale barn is one thing. Just because one person is culling i.e. thinning down/disposing of some of his herd doesn;t automatically make the animal a reject. For some, those cows may be a real improvment. Folks cull animals for a lot of reasons not all of them negative. Too many heifers, dispose of all cows over a certain age, doesn;t fit the herd dynamics, etc.

This is a good post from a common sense stand point. Seems lke a lot of people get hung up on theoretical perfection and forget practicality.

 

[Ryder]

I was driving along one day in unfailiar territory. I had a map but I must have taken a wrong turn somewhere and I was completely lost. Then I had a flat tire and, lo and behold, my spare was flat, and I was stranded in unfamliar territory.

A man comes by and asks what is the problem. I told him. Then he told me what road I should have taken, how foolish I was for not having checked the spare, and a few other things that I should have, ought to have done.
Then he drove on. He took advantage of my plight to put me down to bolster his ego. None of this helped me a bit.

A little later another man drives up and asks if I need any help. I tell him my sad story. He takes me and my spare tire to a service station to get it aired up. Then he takes me back to my vehicle. Soon my tire is changed and I was thankfully on my way and certainly thankful for the help that man gave me.

The first man was only concerned with his ego. He will have to continue on looking for people to put down trying to get himself higher. But in the end he will have to live with himself and he will find a very small self.

The second man contributed. He helped me and I think he felt a lot "cleaner" than the first. That is what builds self esteem.

I have made a mistake or two along the way. Some I learned from and was able to do better from that point on. Maybe I have even been able to help a few others coming behind me. But I have never figured out how to "should have" or "ought to have."

 

[3MR]

Great Post, and words to live by

 

[rockridgecattle]

I ahve somewhat of a problem with the second quote, but the first one is dead bang on. A cull from the kill pen at the sale barn is one thing. Just because one person is culling i.e. thinning down/disposing of some of his herd doesn;t automatically make the animal a reject. For some, those cows may be a real improvment. Folks cull animals for a lot of reasons not all of them negative. Too many heifers, dispose of all cows over a certain age, doesn;t fit the herd dynamics, etc

When i think of "culls" i think of problem animals. Masitis, wild, sickness, too small for breeding etc. If the animal is sold for downsizing or may not have enough pasture not fit into that herd but maybe someone else, etc, i don't consider it a cull but a breed animal.

And

Quote:

Culls are culls for a reason. Get a clue please because if you don't, in the end, it could get you killed

The second sentence should have been put separately meaning this lady/gent should hae researched before going head first wih cows cause they can be dangerous challenging to a inexperienced person. Not that culls are necessarily dangerous. Just did not proof read well enough. Sorry

 

[hillsdown]

Cull means slaughter only.Everything else is replacements.That is how I refer to them and everyone else that I deal with also.Most of my heifers that are sold at 6 months are good replacements for a comercial herd especially the herford and angus crosses; however since I am building my PB herd I do not want to keep percentages.In dairy your young stock is always your future milking herd the same in beef the good heifers are your future herd or someone elses. There are to many scenarios to even justify saying that cows are culls the blanket gets thrown on way to often.

 

[dun]

Semantics.

 

[I luv herfrds]

Had fun reading all of the posts.
Sorry Bez, but you might not like this.
We spoiled our herefords with ground barley. All we have to do is go out in the pasture and start yelling "barley time" and we have over 50 head running at us. Alot of the cows you can not touch, but we have a few you can scratch.
Yours are at a young age still and you can calm them down to where they will be pleasant to be around. Better then some that chase you up a fence, around the pen, or through the barn. We spend as much time as possible around our replacements. During calving we walk amoung them, and yes I know I'm crazy, we talk to them.

If you are looking for just an eating animal a spayed heifer or a steer might be the best way to go. An unspayed heifer will go looking for a bull or you might have an unwelcomed visitor.

Getting into cattle for the first time is a learning experience. Just take your time read as much as you can about them and pick the brains of the cattle people near you.

You can see what I like from my "name".

 

[msscamp]

I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

Newbies aren't "fair game", and the only newbies that are "annoying" are the ones such as yourself, who jump in with both feet, don't have a clue what they are doing, expect someone they've never met to save their butts when something goes wrong, and then develop an attitude when their question(s) are answered truthfully. Have a wonderful evening!

What would really be awsome would be for the old heads to lead rather than set the example.

Their is no need for sarcassim by anyone. If someone posts with a or in a bad way the pm is the proper way to go.

Just my 2 cents.

You're right, and point taken.

 

[Mongoose]

I was a horse person before I got cattle, and I made sure I knew alot about them before I went and bought some of my own. Now I have cattle and Horses, and I know about both. I agree with Bez though, you shouldnt have bought them if you knew NOTHING about them. Should have turned them down. I know everyone has to start somewhere, but you could have learned about the bovine species before you bought some of your own. It only makes sense. I would wait until its just about time to start feeding hay and sell them. That way you dont have to pay to feed them all winter.

 

[3MR]

How about instead of telling them all the stuff they did wrong over and over, we start helping them do some things right. Just a thought!

Whats done is done, lets move on!

 

[I luv herfrds]

Alright. What they have done rigt is to ask questions. You never learn unless you ask.

On the subject of a working area for the cattle. If you are only going to have just two or three you do not need a large area. An 8'x8' pen would work really well for working them. If you want a working chute, look at the ones that curve around. For some reason cattle like to turn. If you are building your own make sure it is narrow enough for them to walk through, but not turn around. It also needs to be high enough so they cannot jump out.

Now for the flies. Everybody has a different system that they use and it works for them. We use a large fly rub that is hung between two posts and is treated with a fly repelent. It looks like a cloth sausage. Best way I could describe it. It is around 6'-8' in length.

The poopy butt on the heifer. If she has been out on grass that would cause that to happen.

Now onto the vaccines. Do you know what they have been given? Have you decided what you plan for them? Are you just going to eat them or breed them?

Mineral and salt are needed. Go to your local feed store and ask what is the most used mineral in your area. A salt block is a good purchase. If you can, get a weather proof mineral feeder. That way the wind and rain will not wash away the mineral and salt.
If they do not start eating it right away do not worry. They are getting the needed nutrition from the feed they are eating.

Have I forgotten anything?
I'm sure alot of the other people will cover any subject I forgot or give their knowledge on a certain subject.
Hope this helps you going in the direction you want to go. Don't give up. It's just one foot in front of the other, even when everything goes wrong.

 

[dressageophobia]

Gosh, from some of these posts you would have thought I invented war, pestilence, plague and herpes, instead of just buying two young herford heifers??????

Gee everyone, they are out in the field just eating, and pooping and butting heads and seem to be probably exactly normal.

Ryder and 3MR and I luv herfrds thanks for your kind and encouraging words and admirable sentiments. You stand out as positive role models.

I have been on lots of internet forums and the same sort of chiding behavoir happens when a new person enters a forum populated by lots of "experts." Some very civilized forums do not allow such chiding behavoir. Others, like this board seem to tolerate it, without consequence.

Glad to see there are kind folks on here who want to help.

In regard to selling the animals before I have to feed them. I have had horses for 40 years and you pretty much have to feed them all year round, so why wouldn't I keep the cattle as well and feed them. Gosh I am in Oregon and we have lots of grass almost all year!

The gentleman we bought the heifers from said they were all vaccinated and wormed until next June. So I think next June I will get the vet out. By then we will have made a shootl like many of you have described. Thank you!

As far as eating or breeding them, my husband is insistant that we breed them (AI technician is nearby). (This is married code word for - wife you find out all about it and worry all about it and then let me know what I need to know to make it happen.)

As for the use of my terminology "cull", did not know it would start such a debate on semantics. The two I have are pretty cute, not sure they would make pinup status in PlayBull mag or anything of that sort. ;-). Can we post pics on this forum? I took two pics of them yesterday and could post them and let you tell me if they are culls or pinup heifers!!!! How about it?

 

[3MR]

One persons culls are another persons replacments. I just got an Angus Pathfinder very cheap because she was late bred and the breeder had a very strict calving window he wanted. If I hadnt bought her she would have gone to the sale barn.

 

[dun]

The two I have are pretty cute, not sure they would make pinup status in PlayBull mag or anything of that sort. ;-). Can we post pics on this forum? I took two pics of them yesterday and could post them and let you tell me if they are culls or pinup heifers!!!! How about it?

Are you satisfied with them? That's all that really matters in the long term. You have to start somewhere, these 2 are probably as good a place as any to do it.

 

[FarmGirl10]

For the fly problem, since you are a horse person you may get the Springtime catalogue, in it they have a feed additive called garlic something-or-other that will give them a garlicy smell that will keep the flys off of them (Its in the horse section).