Two newbies who bought two 6 mo Herford Heifers from

[dressageophobia]

an old guy who the vet said to buy from. Heifers were supposed to have all shots, wormed, etc.

Both seem to be doing well, but one has had a poopy butt since we have had her. They are not tame.

Questions:
1) I have been working on taming them with food. They will come within a few feet of me when eating. I could lock them in a small pen. What do I do to tame them. I am a horse person, these are our first cattle. Really they are curious and sweet, but do not trust me at all! Suggestions?

2) Is there something I can feed to clear up the poopy butt thing one of the heifers has? They are eating and do not look near death or anything. They are on 7 acres of grass all to themselves in Oregon where we have grass almost all year long. I give them a little grain in the night so they go in the pen with me and get used to me.

3) We have flys, is there a feed through I can get to stop the flys. Do you just put up with the flys on the cows? How do you deal with flys? Fly predators (horse people stuff)? What?

4) We do not have a sqeeze shoot or anything like that, just a
30 by 40 pen and a 7 acre pasture. What would you suggest if we have to vet them???

5) They are not registered Herford, should we breed them to an Angus next year or butcher them and start with something registered?????????

 

[Bez>]

an old guy who the vet said to buy from. Heifers were supposed to have all shots, wormed, etc.

Both seem to be doing well, but one has had a poopy butt since we have had her. They are not tame.

Questions:
1) I have been working on taming them with food. They will come within a few feet of me when eating. I could lock them in a small pen. What do I do to tame them. I am a horse person, these are our first cattle. Really they are curious and sweet, but do not trust me at all! Suggestions?

You do NOT pet cattle - they are not pets. If they come that close they are tame - be happy and leave them alone.

2) Is there something I can feed to clear up the poopy butt thing one of the heifers has? They are eating and do not look near death or anything. They are on 7 acres of grass all to themselves in Oregon where we have grass almost all year long. I give them a little grain in the night so they go in the pen with me and get used to me.

If the calf is schitting all over the place you might try to ask a veterinarian - if your horses were doing this would you call the veterinarian or ask a stranger? Someone who is local and knows large animals would be a good bet. Yes there are a ton of things you can do - but in truth would you like someone from a thousand miles away to diagnose your next illness?

If it seems to be getting along then do not worry - if it looks dehydrated worry and call a veterinarian. I suspect it is the grass - cut out the grain for a while. Throw them some hay or straw to chew on.

3) We have flys, is there a feed through I can get to stop the flys. Do you just put up with the flys on the cows? How do you deal with flys? Fly predators (horse people stuff)? What?

Yes, no, fly management, yes and see following:

If you deal with flies for your horses you deal with flies for cows. Ask at the feed store they will have everything you need. The list is long and it can be expensive. Trust me the cows will love you in the end.

4) We do not have a sqeeze shoot or anything like that, just a 30 by 40 pen and a 7 foot pasture. What would you suggest if we have to vet them???

Run the animal between two gates and squeeze the gates together. Or better - take the cows back until you have a squeeze and proper facilites - you can build them in a week or so with hard work. One should never have animals if they are unable to take care of them. They are NOT horses!

They will NOT love you - they will NOT work for you and they will truly NOT care if you do not talk to them.

5) They are not registered Herford, should we breed them to an Angus next year or butcher them and start with something registered?????????

Registered is a fools game for someone at your stage - you bought these animals knowing nothing. A little home work would have better prepared you. It also might save a wreck down the road. Feed them out and eat them.[/quote]

Regards

Bez>

 

[hillsdown]

Bez said it all.Maybe get feeder steers and go from there.Or stick with horses.Did you buy your horses without knowing anything about raising them?

 

[dressageophobia]

Bez, I appreciate the advice, I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

I am not trying to make pets of them. I do not think they are near death OR ELSE I would have called the vet, so you can have a shit______ attitude and I totally understand.

But in the end, only kindness matters, cause we are dead and gone and buried in the cold cold ground and we cannt eat cattle or grass or snow cones or nothing,,,no more,,,Bez,,,get me buster!

But hey, I like you anyway,,,and thanks for the advice. Gee,,,can't you just be nice for once in your sorry life??????????

Love Love,,,really mean it!

 

[fourstates]

You have to have a squeeze chute and a way to sweep them into the chute. A good sqeeze chute will run about $1200-1500 but you will never be able to doctor them or even get them into a trailer with out one. You can use panels in a pinch but you still gotta coerce them in between the panels.

Everyone has to start somewhere, but you have to get a sturdy corral, extra fence panels, and a squeeze.

The most gentle cattle will kill you. They might do it accidently, but you are still dead. You want them to stay out of your space. The minute you think your cows are gonna be different, you will get hurt.

 

[3MR]

Ditto what Bez said

I wouldnt get a squeeze chute for two cows though. The cost wouldnt equal the justification. I would do what he suggested with the gates. Its called a medina hinge, gate, chute, etc. The operative word being medina. I have one with a narrow lane I use for calfs. I just run them into the corner, close and press the gate and do what I need to do.

Again, like Bez stated, you need to get your facilites in order now. You cant wait until you might need them as then it will be to late. A set up for two cows shouldnt be all that difficult to do over a weekend. Get some of your equine riding buddies together, throw some burgers on the grill and make a party out of it.

You can buy fly blocks that can be used on horses and cattle. They run about $9 each. They need to be used to being supplemented with blocks though or they will go through them to quick. You can put the cows in the chute and spray them every couple of days. There are lots of things you can do. Like Bez stated, what do you do for your horses? Whatever you do, you need to do something.

Registered, commercial, for what you are doing who cares. Your either going to eat them or sell them. either way you wont get anymore for registered than commercial. Just get what you like and are happy with. Sounds like you have two nice tempermented animals now from a respected area producer. I would stick with them.

PS: One more like Bez said. Cows arent horses and they arent pets. Trying to make them into pets is dangerous and can easily get you hurt or even killed.

 

[hillsdown]

If you know Bez so well and all his experience then you must be reading through the board and posts.SOO.......why are you asking if you know it all?

 

[Bez>]

Bez, I appreciate the advice, I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

I am not trying to make pets of them. I do not think they are near death OR ELSE I would have called the vet, so you can have a shit______ attitude and I totally understand.

But in the end, only kindness matters, cause we are dead and gone and buried in the cold cold ground and we cannt eat cattle or grass or snow cones or nothing,,,no more,,,Bez,,,get me buster!

But hey, I like you anyway,,,and thanks for the advice. Gee,,,can't you just be nice for once in your sorry life??????????

Love Love,,,really mean it!

Advice was asked for and given. Rock solid advice.

I think you will find I am a very nice person.

Now go do a search on these boards for information.

You need to get smart fast.

Bez>

edit - Hey! The censor allowed you to swear! How about that?

B

 

[dressageophobia]

We plan on getting a sqeeze shoot, no problem. The one heifer came with a poopy butt and I thought maybe she would get over it. I do not think they are suffering as they have grown and seem overall pretty happy (hey what do I know, I do not mean they are drinking martinis or reading Cosmo in the pasture, just look somewhat content for two 6 mo old heifers.)

And I am not trying to make dressage cows out of them, no piourettes or piaffes for them, just though taming them would make them easier to handle.

I would much rather spend my time on my deck looking at them in the pasture, thinking of the future steak that I may injest at a later date!!!! ;-)

But I thought I might find some helpfulness on this board, although I am game for some rights of initiation as well, so bring it on!!! :lol:

 

[hillsdown]

Bez, I appreciate the advice, I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

I am not trying to make pets of them. I do not think they are near death OR ELSE I would have called the vet, so you can have a shit______ attitude and I totally understand.

But in the end, only kindness matters, cause we are dead and gone and buried in the cold cold ground and we cannt eat cattle or grass or snow cones or nothing,,,no more,,,Bez,,,get me buster!

But hey, I like you anyway,,,and thanks for the advice. Gee,,,can't you just be nice for once in your sorry life??????????

Love Love,,,really mean it!

Bez ,do you know this poster?It sounds like"it? " has had previous experience with you.

 

[msscamp]

I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

Newbies aren't "fair game", and the only newbies that are "annoying" are the ones such as yourself, who jump in with both feet, don't have a clue what they are doing, expect someone they've never met to save their butts when something goes wrong, and then develop an attitude when their question(s) are answered truthfully. Have a wonderful evening!

 

[dressageophobia]

Sorry Bez, I realized your advice was rock solid, but assumptions were made on your part,,,and your know how assumptions can be????? Hey horse people are not all that Candy___ (well most of them are) LOL, so I understand where you are coming from.

So turn about is fair game and it is all good.

No foul here, I appreciate your advice ,,,,kiss and make up and go on with it. Seriously I was just pushing back and sorry about the french (OK, I have a bad mouth sometime )

We are just trying to learn and I am concerned about the animals.

I really do not care about registered or not, but eating good meat is nice, so my questions on breeding was sincere.

I am sure the old guy (OK,,,he was 85 if not a day!!!) sold me his culls, but who does not. Someone's culls are the next persons herd cows right?

Really appreciate any help and Bez,,,,sincerely,,,you are the best!!!!

 

[Bez>]

I know Newbies are fair game and can be sooooooooooooooo annoying.

Newbies aren't "fair game", and the only newbies that are "annoying" are the ones such as yourself, who jump in with both feet, don't have a clue what they are doing, expect someone a thousand miles away to save their butts when something goes wrong, and then develop an attitude when their question(s) are answered truthfully. Have a wonderful evening!

Now msscamp - you will get a rep if you are not careful - wondered how you were going today as we hayed our butt off in 100 plus heat. Your folks missing those multi-stomached manure spreaders yet. Bet you have more in the yard by years end.

Out of this hijack - on to new territory.

hillsdown - while it opens me to a few shots - I have no clue and care not.

Regards to both

Bez>

 

[Beefy]

an old guy who the vet said to buy from. Heifers were supposed to have all shots, wormed, etc.

Both seem to be doing well, but one has had a poopy butt since we have had her. They are not tame.

Questions:
1) I have been working on taming them with food. They will come within a few feet of me when eating. I could lock them in a small pen. What do I do to tame them. I am a horse person, these are our first cattle. Really they are curious and sweet, but do not trust me at all! Suggestions?

it sounds like they are tame. better for them to be a little leary of you than butting you away from THEIR feed. if you want to put a halter on them and lead around them will you have to break them, just like a horse...

2) Is there something I can feed to clear up the poopy butt thing one of the heifers has? They are eating and do not look near death or anything. They are on 7 acres of grass all to themselves in Oregon where we have grass almost all year long. I give them a little grain in the night so they go in the pen with me and get used to me.

probably just a feed change. the grain may have shocked them a little bit or the grass may be of different quality than they are used to. doesnt sound like anything to worry about to me as long as you arent giving them too much grain.

3) We have flys, is there a feed through I can get to stop the flys. Do you just put up with the flys on the cows? How do you deal with flys? Fly predators (horse people stuff)? What?

the easiest way would be to get some ivomec pour-on dewormer. it will get rid of the flies for a pretty good while. also there are ear tags with fly meds in them.

4) We do not have a sqeeze shoot or anything like that, just a
30 by 40 pen and a 7 foot pasture. What would you suggest if we have to vet them???

you can build an easy alley way with wooden boards. if you need to have the vet check them you can load them on a trailer and take them to him/her or you can devise a catch with some gates in this alleyway. you need more than a 7 foot pasture, though. Edit: i see now that it is 7 acres.

5) They are not registered Herford, should we breed them to an Angus next year or butcher them and start with something registered?????????

depends on the quality of the heifers. registered/nonregistered doesnt matter.

 

[dressageophobia]

"Newbies aren't "fair game", and the only newbies that are "annoying" are the ones such as yourself, who jump in with both feet, don't have a clue what they are doing, expect someone they've never met to save their butts when something goes wrong, and then develop an attitude when their question(s) are answered truthfully. Have a wonderful evening! Smile"


This is a cattle forum, jumping in with both feet is my style, in the end only kindness matters, cause we are dead for a long long time, no beef, no snow cones, no Willie Nelson, no nothing.

Kindness,,,so please help me. BUT, if you still want to go through the rights of initiation,,,,then bring it on!

Everyone starts someplace,,,even if it is with two 6 mo. old herford heifers on the internet with strangers.

Beefy, you are a REAL Human Being. Thank you! :heart:

 

[hillsdown]

How do you know "Beefy" is giving you good advice?Remember he is the VP of the IHC's (I Hate Cows) organization. ;-)

 

[msscamp]

We plan on getting a sqeeze shoot, no problem.

A squeeze chute would not be cost effective for 2 heifers. I'm not making fun, or being negative in any way - just stating facts. The gate would be a better way to go in your situation.

The one heifer came with a poopy butt and I thought maybe she would get over it.

You might consider pulling her off the pasture, taking her off the grain, and feeding grass hay - that will usually straighten out diarrhea. Once you have the diarrhea under control, slowly reintroduce her to the pasture and the grain.

And I am not trying to make dressage cows out of them, no piourettes or piaffes for them, just though taming them would make them easier to handle.

Simply feeding them, and investing a little time walking among them will go a long ways towards getting them used to you, and help to calm them down. They are in unfamiliar surroundings, with unfamiliar people - they are going to be spooky until they settle in and adjust.

But I thought I might find some helpfulness on this board, although I am game for some rights of initiation as well, so bring it on!!! :lol:

There are plenty of helpfull people on these boards but, as the owner of these heifers, you have a responsibility to do some research and educate yourself, as well. Again, I'm not being nasty or mean - simply stating a fact.

 

[Ryder]

Ditto what Bez said

I wouldnt get a squeeze chute for two cows though. The cost wouldnt equal the justification. I would do what he suggested with the gates. Its called a medina hinge, gate, chute, etc. The operative word being medina. I have one with a narrow lane I use for calfs. I just run them into the corner, close and press the gate and do what I need to do.

3MR is right about cost of squeeze not being justified. He and others have given good advice on this.
I will add that depending on what needs to be done, you can do a lot with a couple of ropes. If you need to know how to put one down (I mean restrain, not kill) pm me and I will try to dig up the website showing how.

As to eating them or breeding them-what do you want to do?

 

[rockridgecattle]

dressageophobia, hello, interesting name.

As i started to read this thread my first thought was wow Bez, your tough this evening.

BUT, HE IS RIGHT.

And if you found some other post on this board you would see he knows his stuff and is kind, direct and to the point.

We have all seen our fair share of cow injuries some severe and some not so. And most accidents can be prevented with some infrastucture for cows.

Cow are not something one jumps in to head on. That gets a person hurt or worse...killed. You shoud have researched and asked questions before you bought. You should have put in place infrastructure before you bought a single cow.
Any major like altering decision in life is researched...cattle are no different.

I am sure the old guy (OK,,,he was 85 if not a day!!!) sold me his culls, but who does not. Someone's culls are the next persons herd cows right?

if you researched cows or looked on this site a bit before posting you would see it's all about genetics and buying someones culls gets you into a heap of a mess. Culls are culls for a reason. Get a clue please because if you don't, in the end, it could get you killed

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Is the manure "like water"? Is she scouring or just loose stool from the grass & grain? How much grain are you giving (pounds or measurement - 1# coffee can, etc)
Sounds like she is just loose from her feed. And as long as it's just slightly loose, it's no problem.
As suggested, you can pull her off grass & grain & just feed her good grass hay for a little bit, she'll tighten right up.
You are doing right, giving them a little grain as a treat to keep them coming into the pen & getting used to you.
If you do not plan on "expanding" your herd, you do not need a squeeze chute. A simple 3' alleyway with a solid gate in front & board slipped behind them can suffice. But, you do need a way to CONSTRAIN them. They need yearly vaccinations & deworming.
If you kept them for breeding - how would you get them bred? Choices are: Buy a bull (way too costly for 2 head)
Breed AI (gotta find an AI technition in your area & buy semen)
Bring back to breeder & have his bull breed them.
If you plan on eating them, are you going to grass feed them to "finish" or grain feed them. If you have never tried eating grass fed beef, you might try to find some & eat it before butchering a whole animal. Not saying there isn't some good grass fed beef out there, but it is a science & people are just now learning the best ways to get a more pleasureable eating experience out of grass fed beef.
If you plan on grain feeding (my choice), you start with 1% of their body weight daily & increase to 3% (slowly). Last 30-60 days they should be taken OFF green grass & just fed grass hay if you don't want "yellow" fat.