The Critics

[MountainFarmChar]

I'm not against honest productive criticism but it seems to me that when people put pictures of good looking cattle (not perfect) they get too much criticism.

Why don't some of these experts who are so quick to point out every little fault post more pictures of their PERFECT cattle.

If the truth was known, some (not most) most likely don't even have a cow and are quoting some text book.

I appreciate the cattle pictures, they are much more enjoyable than most quotes from the experts!

 

[Matt S]

I'm really not sure what you're saying. To sum it up, it seems you are saying that you don't mind criticism but you hate having too much.

Well, duh.

I take most of what I read here and ignore it. There are a few posters who know what cattle should look like. If you stay around a while, you'll quickly figure out who they are. There are some posters who simply like to get a rise out of others. Ignore them.

 

[MountainFarmChar]

They do post their pics. I have seen dun, caustic, crowder, and lots of other people show pics of their cattle. So to say they were quoting from a textbook is highly unlikely. Get your facts straight before you post. Secondly, we want people to succeed in this cattle business. If they cannot handle constructive criticism i dont know how they even can function in every day life or even hold down a regular job for that matter. Just my two cents worth.

You need to read my post again. I believe in productive constructive criticism but you can take an ear of corn and feed a mule or take an ear of corn and beat a mule. Which do you think would be most productive? Truth can be used to help people or hurt people it depends on who's hand it's in. Just because it's the truth doesn't mean it's going to help, the help depends on how the truth is used.

 

[Brandonm2]

I'm not against honest productive criticism but it seems to me that when people put pictures of good looking cattle (not perfect) they get too much criticism.

Why don't some of these experts who are so quick to point out every little fault post more pictures of their PERFECT cattle.

If the truth was known, some (not most) most likely don't even have a cow and are quoting some text book.

I appreciate the cattle pictures, they are much more enjoyable than most quotes from the experts!

I will confess that over the years I have owned cattle that were not big enough, were not thick enough, did not have the most desireable feet and leg set, were too big, were not deep ribbed enough, did not have level toplines, were ugly headed, were muddy, were dirty, were too thin, were sick, had dehorning jobs that I botched, and/or that simply did not produce very well. Now if I posted the pic of one that WAS flawed, you would not be doing me any favors if you told me to take her to Denver. I think everybody has that cow who didn't look THAT bad when we were selecting which heifers to keep; that is either about to ride a cull truck or which makes us money despite of her phenotypical shortcomings. 99% of us do not have the best set of cows in our breed; but if we see an animal that IS flawed, I think we kind of have a duty to point it out.

 

[cfpinz]

I enjoy all the pictures, good or bad. I know my cattle are not picture perfect textbook animals, but they make money. The ugliest cows in my field are some of the most profitable, if not why would they still be there? I don't particularly like a bunch of scrub-looking cows in the field when someone looks through them, but those ugly cows are there for a reason, and I've got the numbers to back them up.

My pictures are not salebook worthy cattle and I know it, and I welcome constructive criticism, it's the only way we will learn anything. But there's no sense being hateful. My phylosophy is if you can't say it in front of your mother you ought to keep your flapper shut.

cfpinz

 

[warpaint]

I enjoy all the pictures, good or bad. I know my cattle are not picture perfect textbook animals, but they make money. The ugliest cows in my field are some of the most profitable, if not why would they still be there? I don't particularly like a bunch of scrub-looking cows in the field when someone looks through them, but those ugly cows are there for a reason, and I've got the numbers to back them up.

My pictures are not salebook worthy cattle and I know it, and I welcome constructive criticism, it's the only way we will learn anything. But there's no sense being hateful. My phylosophy is if you can't say it in front of your mother you ought to keep your flapper shut.

cfpinz

Well said, CF.

 

[Joy in Texas]

I enjoy all the pictures, good or bad. I know my cattle are not picture perfect textbook animals, but they make money. The ugliest cows in my field are some of the most profitable, if not why would they still be there? I don't particularly like a bunch of scrub-looking cows in the field when someone looks through them, but those ugly cows are there for a reason, and I've got the numbers to back them up.

My pictures are not salebook worthy cattle and I know it, and I welcome constructive criticism, it's the only way we will learn anything. But there's no sense being hateful. My phylosophy is if you can't say it in front of your mother you ought to keep your flapper shut.

cfpinz

This is a good post. Most people I think compare registered and commercial stock. Big difference in the two. I have some plain ol cows nothing special about them ,other than they are good mama cows and raise good calves every year. I also have a few register animals. Nothing special about them either.I know they are out of a good bloodline.
Also you are looking at the animal from a picture. I know I have some nice looking heifers that I raised from last year. After taking a picture of them they look different. Maybe it's the lighting or position they are standing.
I try not to criticize anyone's animal,unless they are just plain ol ugly.

 

[KNERSIE]

If a poster asked "take her apart" or "tear her up" I think he/she wants the board to point every fault out. I think as long as you also comment on the strengths of the animal there is no malicious intent.

I still own animals with faults, some of them with big faults, but to keep mum about a fault that will hamper future productivity when a poster asked for your opinion doesn't make sense to me.

Maybe the poster asking for opinions should make it clear what the specific animal's purpose would be in their herd and then ask if the rest of us thinks that the animal would meet the criteria.

Not every animal is seedstock material, not every animal has show potential, but most can serve a purpose in someones herd and should be measured against that set of criteria if the poster could let us know what that is.

 

[*Cowgirl*]

If a poster asked "take her apart" or "tear her up" I think he/she wants the board to point every fault out. I think as long as you also comment on the strengths of the animal there is no malicious intent.

I still own animals with faults, some of them with big faults, but to keep mum about a fault that will hamper future productivity when a poster asked for your opinion doesn't make sense to me.

Maybe the poster asking for opinions should make it clear what the specific animal's purpose would be in their herd and then ask if the rest of us thinks that the animal would meet the criteria.

Not every animal is seedstock material, not every animal has show potential, but most can serve a purpose in someones herd and should be measured against that set of criteria if the poster could let us know what that is.

Good post, I know my cows aren't perfect, but when I say "tear her up" I mean it.

 

[movin' on]

Notice, though, the way some people criticize and the way others do it. Doc Harris and Nortexsook would be two very prime examples. One uses facts, well worded sentences, good grammar and CONSTRUCTIVE criticism. The other rambles, says hateful things, uses poor grammar and uses DESTRUCTIVE criticism. Most people on here fall into one of those two categories. An animal can be torn apart and analyzed from limb to limb without being offensive to anyone. The person who posted the question can either be glad they asked and learn from our input or wish like heck they'd never asked and learn to be resentful of anyone trying to tell them anything. Everyone should remember that some people are more sensitive than others and respond as though they're talking to THE MOST sensitive person on here......then no one gets offended!

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Joy in Tx - I respectfully disagree with you on PB vs Comm cattle. A good cow is a good cow. I don't care if she has papers a mile long with pedigree or Joe Blow's backyard cow. There are structural/phenotype differences between good & bad. But, just because she doesn't LOOK good, doesn't make her a bad cow - as others noted.
There are some on here that are just plain nasty, & they hurt people on purpose. Hopefully, I am careful enough to be critical without hurting. I think if you have something negative, you should also point out the good points - if there are any. I have to admit there have been some pics posted that it was really tough to point out something good.
The hardest thing about owning animals is to be totally critical about your own "pride & joy". I always like a breeder to look over my herd & add their opinion. BUT, looking at live cattle is a lot easier than a pic.
Most people know about my Macho bull, and let me tell you, I have taken some pics that made him look like some sorry scrub. But, I am critial enough to KNOW he looked bad & throw them away. People that can't see the difference, post a bad pic of a good animal.

 

[Schnurrbart]

I will agree that some people do post criticism to be malicious. However, when I post i try and look at it from my perspective. If the animal is not good enough for me, its not good enough for my customers or anyone else to have it either. If I think it is unfit I will tell ya. Not because I have malicious intent but because I want to help.

OK. I'm going to post a picture of a 3/4 Tarentaise 1/4 ChiAngus who will be 10 years old in April. She weighs around 1200# and has calved every year since she was 2. What is wrong and what is good. I'm no expert for sure and I don't show cattle. Her bag is lopsided because her calf just had dinner before I took the picture which was in early Dec of 06.

 

[Anonymous]

Nothing wrong with this cow. Looks to be a fairly functional commercial cow and as you stated she has passed the ultimate test by raising 9 acceptable calves. Three or four more and I am sure she will have more than paid her keep. And that is what it's all about. PROFIT!!!

Have a GREAT day!

 

[jcarkie]

The hardest thing about owning animals is to be totally critical about your own "pride & joy".


it is hard to be objective on your own animals. i have seen good cattlemen get so stuck on thier own they ruin what starts out good. i bought some good cows recently that had some mediocre calves because of keeping his own bulls. if you don't want criticism then don't post a pic...... i want to know or i keep it to myself.

 

[dun]

It's called "Barn Blind or Herd Blind". I think all of us at one time or another has fallen victim to it. Giving that cow just one more chance, making excuses because her momma was such a good cow, so she's brokwn down but she still produces a calf even though it's a poor one, etc.

dun

 

[backhoeboogie]

Why don't some of these experts who are so quick to point out every little fault post more pictures of their PERFECT cattle.

There are no perfect cattle. Some awfully nice ones tho.

What works for me in my climate and in my program is not what the next guy is going to want to raise. That is just how it is.

I say stick to what works for you and grow some thicker skin if you can't take the heat when a pic is posted. If someone doesn't want to know what the forum thinks, they wouldn't ask.

If the truth hurts, don't ask for the truth.

 

[backhoeboogie]

There are some cattle pics in the forum that the only thing i see wrong is that the cow is not in my pasture.

 

[mnmtranching]

There's nothing like posting a pic of cattle on here to get replies. And no matter how good you think the critter is your going to get a wide variety of opinions,. But that's what makes it interesting. Sometimes you need to be able to sort the bull from the be nice.

Cattle men and ladies as a whole are a fiercely indenpent bunch, wherever you get a group of these folks together your going to have a lot of " what I got is best, what I do is best, the breed, size, color, bloodlines, feeds, you name it. But all in all lots of good info.

As near as I can figure, any cow that makes you money is a good cow. If not there's something wrong, could be you or the cow. So I believe there is always something to learn.

 

[3MR]

Joy in Tx - I respectfully disagree with you on PB vs Comm cattle. A good cow is a good cow. I don't care if she has papers a mile long with pedigree or Joe Blow's backyard cow. There are structural/phenotype differences between good & bad. But, just because she doesn't LOOK good, doesn't make her a bad cow - as others noted.
There are some on here that are just plain nasty, & they hurt people on purpose. Hopefully, I am careful enough to be critical without hurting. I think if you have something negative, you should also point out the good points - if there are any. I have to admit there have been some pics posted that it was really tough to point out something good.
The hardest thing about owning animals is to be totally critical about your own "pride & joy". I always like a breeder to look over my herd & add their opinion. BUT, looking at live cattle is a lot easier than a pic.
Most people know about my Macho bull, and let me tell you, I have taken some pics that made him look like some sorry scrub. But, I am critial enough to KNOW he looked bad & throw them away. People that can't see the difference, post a bad pic of a good animal.

Yup!

 

[AngusLimoX]

When people post pics in here and say rip it up it reminds me of movie scenes where the guy say's" punch me, go ahead punch me". So the other guy labels him and the guy goes "why did you punch me so hard"! :lol:

When it comes to confirmation I rarely comment because I am not qualified to, and if I do I normally qualify the comments.

Gotta remember these are photo's too, sometimes in real life cattle can turn a certain way and you don't recognize them.
A lot of us got fooled by a bull pic in here a few weeks ago, wish I had saved that thread.