I haven't seen Jaydill's calf or the girl's calf; but a Simbrah (substitute in Angus, Hereford, Longhorn, Shorthorn, Beefmaster, etc) is whatever the breed association says that it is. They qualified the heifer, unless Jaydill has the courage to take this claim and whatever evidence he has to the authorities who CAN unqualify it I don't believe that it is honorable to talk about the girl or her heifer to anonymous posters on the internet.
Simbrah Sires calves naturally at 19 years old
- Thread starter Bronco
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BC
Well-known member
Brandonm2":nvmfe58x said:
I will have to disagree with what you have stated. Things like breed character should be a part of the judging criteria. The heifer in question looks more like a Simmental than Simbrah. Little to no Brahman look. That may be all right with you, but it does not set well with Simbrah breeders. I do not raise Simbrahs, but have spent most of my adult life working with youth in the 4-H and FFA program. I want breeders to be honest with birthdates and breeding information. Reminds me of looking for a heifer one time and when I asked how old the heifer was, the mgr. asked me how old I wanted her to be. Left and went to another ranch. Never went back to that operation.
The ASA has issued registration papers on what was turned in for the heifer in question. They recorded it as it was turned in by the breeder. My guess is that the breed association does not have the funds to fight this even if they win. I seriously hope that the breeder gets black balled
ALACOWMAN
Well-known member
Ive raised several simbrahs i have had F1'S look more like simm. than brah, and their 50/50 . and breed them back to straight simm bull for a 3/4 1/4 blood calf looks almost like pure simmental but that was on american grey brahman cattle there ears are a little smaller than some of the reds. but their still simbrah just have more simmental featuresBC":42oll37h said:
BC
Well-known member
My guess ( and that is what it is) that this heifer is sired by a Simmental bull and is out of a Simbrah cow. She does not look 3/8 Brahman or even 1/4 Brahman.
What she looks like is not relevant. What JayDil can PROVE is what is relevant. IF he can prove it take it to the authorities, if he can't prove it....or is afraid of making it a formal issue he needs to drop it. I don't have a dog in this fight, but JayDil sounds like a poor loser who can't deal with the fact that several judges in a half dozen shows thought his calf was inferior.
You don't have a clue. Both heifers in question failed DNA test before formal complaint was filed. The ASA suspended the papers because they don't believe a sire that old could naturally sire calves. The breeders threatened a lawsuit and they caved. So, my heifer will be bred to an angus and be register as a full blood simbrah. The whole world now knows how to beat the system. I will level this playing field since the ASA has no integrity when it comes to the heard book.
IF the association has made it's ruling and returned the papers WHY are we still debating this??? The case is now closed. I didn't think the United States Simmental herdbook has EVER had any integrity (see the hoard of Simmies that look more like an ANgus than a European Simmie) so I really don't see how a Simbrah with too much Simmental is an issue.
jaydill
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I am female, first off.Brandonm2":m3ktu5x7 said:
How can I prove it? Have you not read my posts. I know this girl personally. She knew it wasn't purebred. She told people it wasn't purebred. That is not what matters. I think you ought to learn to think before you speak cause I haven't come on here once complaining about losing. In fact, if you did read a damned thing on these boards before letting your trap fly, you'd realize I don't even have a heifer and therefore haven't even competed against her! I show a Simbrah steer! My question for you is...why are you even commenting on these posts? You have no knowledge of what's really going on, except what you've heard from the people here. You don't live in the state, aren't familiar with the show circuit, obviously don't know the characteristics of a Simbrah, and from reading your posts, must not be able to read worth a damn either. I haven't let people push my buttons in a long time but your ignorance is truly getting to me. Qualifying the heifer only involves papers. Again, if you're reading you'll realized that the facts on the papers were purposely smudged! Therefore, the calf was registered as a breed it wasn't even supposed to be. Not sure about you but I always like to get my facts straight before I try to go off and tell somebody about somethin.
BC
Well-known member
Brandonm2":2oqbok7j said:
What she looks like is relevent because it has to do with breed character and the fact that a Simmental is being shown in Simbrah classes does not make it fair to the other Simbrah exhibitors.
I have spent over 30 years as an advisor to 4-H and FFA youth in this state. In that time period I have seen some people push, bend and even break the rules to get an advantage. The vast majority of exhibitors play by the rules and expect other to do the same. Those that don't need to be publicly shamed.
Since you are from Alabama I will use a phrase that Forrest Gump would say "That is all I have to say about this".
I have said too much on this too; but all the complainers STILL seem like whiners and poor sports to me. If you don't win.....make wild allegations on the...internet.....yes, that sounds REAL adult too me.
If you go to http://www.estudioresources.com/barkerphotography
Select job Pg 2 /2005 Fall Classic. Page 48. 2nd and 3rd photos 1st row.
Photos are copyrighted so they can't be copied, so, this is the only way to see the heifer. Don't know if anyone else has any personal pics of it.
Heifer doesn't show any characteristics of the Simbrah breed.
Breeder changed sire on this heifer in Jan. 2006 after the heifer was already 23 months old, because she was going to be shown in the junior shows at the spring majors. The AI sire that was the original sire according to paper's, there is dna on file for him. The girl that had the heifer before only showed her at open shows.
I could understand the oops I reported the wrong sire on one heifer, after it was tested for dna, not before, ??How did the breeder all of a sudden decide that they had reported the wrong sire???? Kinda suspicious don't ya think? Beside that I had heard that the 18 year old bull had supposedly died not very long after he bred the cow, but now, they report that he was the sire on a second heifer that was born a year later. Now that bull would have to be good to get up and breed a cow after he was dead.
Select job Pg 2 /2005 Fall Classic. Page 48. 2nd and 3rd photos 1st row.
Photos are copyrighted so they can't be copied, so, this is the only way to see the heifer. Don't know if anyone else has any personal pics of it.
Heifer doesn't show any characteristics of the Simbrah breed.
Breeder changed sire on this heifer in Jan. 2006 after the heifer was already 23 months old, because she was going to be shown in the junior shows at the spring majors. The AI sire that was the original sire according to paper's, there is dna on file for him. The girl that had the heifer before only showed her at open shows.
I could understand the oops I reported the wrong sire on one heifer, after it was tested for dna, not before, ??How did the breeder all of a sudden decide that they had reported the wrong sire???? Kinda suspicious don't ya think? Beside that I had heard that the 18 year old bull had supposedly died not very long after he bred the cow, but now, they report that he was the sire on a second heifer that was born a year later. Now that bull would have to be good to get up and breed a cow after he was dead.
JDI":1grjw5j9 said:
It should add up in your books, because it would be a purebred Simbrah. It's that 1/16th other breed mixed in that is allowed to make a purebred simbrah. That 1/16th is what is going to allow, with the right matings and enough generations, a Simmental that will be classified as a purebred Simbrah, but, it is going to take more that just one generation like on these heifer's.
Brandom2:
You are not a member of the breed, just shut up!!
At least with the ASA, we can all know where the "bad ones in the woodpile" come from. With Angus, you just assume they are pure since they have a paper.
mtnman
You are not a member of the breed, just shut up!!
At least with the ASA, we can all know where the "bad ones in the woodpile" come from. With Angus, you just assume they are pure since they have a paper.
mtnman
JDI
Well-known member
It should add up in your books, because it would be a purebred Simbrah. It's that 1/16th other breed mixed in that is allowed to make a purebred simbrah. That 1/16th is what is going to allow, with the right matings and enough generations, a Simmental that will be classified as a purebred Simbrah, but, it is going to take more that just one generation like on these heifer's.
CUL8R
If you breed a purebred X purebred you will get a purebred. I mated 5 hd of purebred Simbrah's randomly picked out of the sale coming up on the 8th of April from the MAS sale. All of the matings came up 1/2 SM X 1/4 MX X 1/4BR...yes we are allowed a floating 1/8 of another breed but where is the 1/8 here. It shows (by the ASA data site)1/4 MX not 1/8.... it was the same on all of my pure bred cows too. If you go put the original sire & the orignal damns into the ASA site it also comes up 1/4 MX...NOT purebred!!!!!
CUL8R
If you breed a purebred X purebred you will get a purebred. I mated 5 hd of purebred Simbrah's randomly picked out of the sale coming up on the 8th of April from the MAS sale. All of the matings came up 1/2 SM X 1/4 MX X 1/4BR...yes we are allowed a floating 1/8 of another breed but where is the 1/8 here. It shows (by the ASA data site)1/4 MX not 1/8.... it was the same on all of my pure bred cows too. If you go put the original sire & the orignal damns into the ASA site it also comes up 1/4 MX...NOT purebred!!!!!
Two categories of Simbrah are admitted to the herd book, purebred and percentage. Purebreds contain 5/8 Simmental and 3/8 Brahman while percentage animals must carry a minimum of 3/8 Simmental and 1/4 Brahman. Another variable that has been added to the purebred formula is the "floating 1/16th other breed" which allows producers to add 1/16 of any other breed to tailor the Simbrah to fit their program and geographical region
I don't care how many matings that you do, the offspring from those matings would be registered as a Purebred Simbrah.
Because if you notice that bull is registered as a purebred Simbrah just like K Bar Southern Comfort is and if they are bred to a PB Simbrah cow they will produce a PB Simbrah.
I don't care how many matings that you do, the offspring from those matings would be registered as a Purebred Simbrah.
Because if you notice that bull is registered as a purebred Simbrah just like K Bar Southern Comfort is and if they are bred to a PB Simbrah cow they will produce a PB Simbrah.
JDI
Well-known member
I seen the same thing happen in 2002 at the Simbrah Sensation in Brenham, Texas. A young man had showed a heifer all yr. n the TCCA, recieving over 1000 pts. that yr. Tommy Schwertner was then pres. of the TSSA & the Sensation. He questioned the papers on the heifer & after further review the heifer was not allowed to show. She had 1/16 to much Angus in her...was a big scene but the Sensation rules are just like Houston..SA...Ft.W. All anamils must be 5/8X3/8. Only difference here is the breeder had enough B*LL'S to addmitt there was a problem & his reputation is still intact!!!
Jeanne - Simme Valley
Well-known member
Yup, she sure looks like a nice Simmental heifer.
The planned mating at ASA site must have a glich in it because I tried it and it came out the same as you did.
The planned mating at ASA site must have a glich in it because I tried it and it came out the same as you did.
JDI
Well-known member
Thank you Jeanne. I was wondering if maybe I been to close to some of the rockets & mortars!!!!! Might have been here to long. PB X PB ain't 1/2x1/4x1/4.......
