Registered Angus Females

[High Cotton]

I'm looking for 1 or 2 registered females to start my own herd. I worked all summer baling hay and sold some other toys to free up some assets. My original plan was to lease some near by pasture and to purchase some heifers from the farm I've been working for. After asking about a near by pasture that is possibly up for rent I was presented with an opportunity. The family I have been helping the last 3 years is getting older. The parents that live on the farm is in their late 80's early 90's. The kids live in town about 20 miles away but are there on their days off. I've been over there alot more this winter feeding, tagging calves, keeping up the calving information, and other miscellaneous tasks. I haven't been getting paid for the winter work usually just for working in the hay field during the summer. They suggested I purchase some nice register females and run them with their cows. They said they had the room and it would help give me a return on the time I've been investing there. They had a registered herd for years but due to some health issues several years before I started helping them its a commercial herd now. They have some nice registered bulls that I have access to. A.I. is a another avenue I may possibly pursue in the future.

Here are the herd bulls they have now.
http://www.angus.org/Animal/EpdPedD...n03BITMJVv4yyJFT6SoCmuxpxSVllYzlS88mlPG+qDQ==

The only picture I have in my Photobucket of him. He was about 20-22 months on this picture.

This they just purchased in January. This spring will be his first breeding season.
http://www.angus.org/Animal/EpdPedD...QdBz007oEvNRIFolPackHDhXNgrbXrfOrluYEiIqAgA==

I want a cow that breeds back year after year, that throws fast growing calves that I don't have to pull, and has a frame score of 6.5-7. I've been reading and studying bloodlines as much as I can lately but, its overwhelming to say the least. I wanted to make the best educated decision I can. What would you purchase that would work well with the bulls I have access to and accomplish my goals. Your thoughts and criticism would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Randy

 

[bse]

the West Tn Angus sale is Feb23 in Martin im sure they will have something there that will fit the bill the Bopat sale is Mar 02 i think its in Bradford or something like that.
these would be a place to start see what things are worth both those bulls are low bw so you should have a broad range of heifers you can use not sure if you want total outcross or something but for cow makers i like the Right Time line which would include 338 which may be the best Right Time son JMO but the Reflection bull should work on these lines not sure about the Game On bull.

 

[jscunn]

Candy Meadow Farms also in TN, has a sale in March, plus he posts on here. PM him I am sure he will answer any questions.

 

[High Cotton]

the West Tn Angus sale is Feb23 in Martin im sure they will have something there that will fit the bill the Bopat sale is Mar 02 i think its in Bradford or something like that.
these would be a place to start see what things are worth both those bulls are low bw so you should have a broad range of heifers you can use not sure if you want total outcross or something but for cow makers i like the Right Time line which would include 338 which may be the best Right Time son JMO but the Reflection bull should work on these lines not sure about the Game On bull.

Thanks BSE. You gave me something's to look for. There 2 cows in the West Tn sale that are out defendants of Right Time and Right Time 338. They are from Jared Brown and Son out of Rickman.

Candy Meadow Farms also in TN, has a sale in March, plus he posts on here. PM him I am sure he will answer any questions.

Thanks I will get in touch with him. I had also thought about contacting Mr Mathis to see what he has available. He is the breeder the reflection bull came from.

 

[snake67]

I'm looking for 1 or 2 registered females to start my own herd. I worked all summer baling hay and sold some other toys to free up some assets. My original plan was to lease some near by pasture and to purchase some heifers from the farm I've been working for. After asking about a near by pasture that is possibly up for rent I was presented with an opportunity. The family I have been helping the last 3 years is getting older. The parents that live on the farm is in their late 80's early 90's. The kids live in town about 20 miles away but are there on their days off. I've been over there alot more this winter feeding, tagging calves, keeping up the calving information, and other miscellaneous tasks. I haven't been getting paid for the winter work usually just for working in the hay field during the summer. They suggested I purchase some nice register females and run them with their cows. They said they had the room and it would help give me a return on the time I've been investing there. They had a registered herd for years but due to some health issues several years before I started helping them its a commercial herd now. They have some nice registered bulls that I have access to. A.I. is a another avenue I may possibly pursue in the future.

Here are the herd bulls they have now.
http://www.angus.org/Animal/EpdPedD...n03BITMJVv4yyJFT6SoCmuxpxSVllYzlS88mlPG+qDQ==

The only picture I have in my Photobucket of him. He was about 20-22 months on this picture.

This they just purchased in January. This spring will be his first breeding season.
http://www.angus.org/Animal/EpdPedD...QdBz007oEvNRIFolPackHDhXNgrbXrfOrluYEiIqAgA==

I want a cow that breeds back year after year, that throws fast growing calves that I don't have to pull, and has a frame score of 6.5-7. I've been reading and studying bloodlines as much as I can lately but, its overwhelming to say the least. I wanted to make the best educated decision I can. What would you purchase that would work well with the bulls I have access to and accomplish my goals. Your thoughts and criticism would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Randy

Why registered? It is not indicative of quality - in fact now-a-days it more often means less quality in my opinion.

Bloodlines - schmudlines.

You REALLY think a registered angus is the way to go for a start up?

Suggest you widen your horizons.

From what I saw I would run some Herfords and sell baldies - you might do better than you think - and a good horned herf will do you just fine (as long as the word "horn" does not drive you off like a squealing girl as it does to many here LOL)

Cheap Horned Herfs on a decent black bull - does not have to be angus - there is Maine and a few others as well. In fact that will likely give you an easier handling animal than the animal raised as angus - which is starting to go down hill in the opinion of many - myself included. In fact there is a discussion on ranchers concerning this very issue.

Just a thought - because I always get a bit nervous when someone tells me they want to start and they want to buy registered - which means more money and probably not anything better standing on the ground once the cash is gone. You fall into that trap as a startup and you make someone some money and you delay your potential to make any yourself.

As for the easy fleshing, breeding back stuff - what in the heck do you think everyone else is looking for? So to me they are empty words - stop spouting them - it does not make you look smarter or better - you best be looking further afield my friend. And that means spending money - money you probably do not have.

Profit is slim - probably less than one percent of the people on these boards actually make money - the rest spend it - big hats, big trucks, big words and small cows.

Or buy the family stock - you know it - it is right there and it can probably be had at a discount. That might just be your best bet if they will not let you run some Herfs for baldies.

You start travelling to shows and sales and such you will spend lots of cash and still end up with a few animals in the yard. And those animals will be far more expensive than they should be.

Stay at home - put your cash in your pocket and forget the fancy stuff.

One final thing. That bull you took pics of. He carries his tail tucked in, his head low and his ears back - I am betting he might have some attitude - watch your azz around him - he is the sneaky type - all is good and when you least expect it he can give you grief. Personally I do not like him at all - but that is just me and we all have opinions.

Juat an old fat guys thoughts - but you might be wise to listen to it - I been in this game a long time and I am still in it - sometimes with lots of animals and sometimes with only a few. I make them work for me - not the other way around.

Whatever way you go I wish you all the best.

Best to all

Bez

 

[AllForage]

Bez,

Best post I have read for a while. A lot of people should read it and listen including the 719T posters.

 

[jedstivers]

Bez said what I was going to only much better. Get something that makes money, not takes money. Bred SS or broken mouth to calve and turn, someone's mistakes, or just plain ol working cattle at the best price. I do like registered bulls however.
Think of it this way. If you are going to buy a new registered bull are going to buy from someone who has two cattle or has hundreds or thousands and makes really good steers out of all but the best?
Sorry if I'm stepping on yours or anyone else's dreams but that is just my opinion and its what you paid for it.

 

[inyati13]

Bez, does have some style don't he? His posts rely on an economy of words. That takes style and/or a clever writer.

I just want to comment on the economics of cattle that Bez mentioned above. He stated, "Profit is slim - probably less than one percent of the people on these boards actually make money - the rest spend it - big hats, big trucks, big words and small cows."

That subject comes up in every conversation I have with anyone in the cattle business. The point (it is not highly intellectual, clever or anything of that sort, it is probably what we all know) I want to make is this, most people in the business or who live around it have to know how difficult it is to make a profit in the cattle business. In this cattle country where I reside, I am aware of established operations that make a profit because they have outstanding reputations, flush embryos, sell richly bred stock for breeding markets, and/or operate on a scale that allows a viable income on a small profit margin basis. The cattle business reminds me of Walmart. A commercial cow pays you such a small amount on an annualized basis, that you got to have 500 of them before the profit margins add up to a number that you can live on. What I see here is people deluding themselves into believing that if they can take their losses from their farm off their real job they are making money. My neighbor came over and was telling me the way I run my cattle operation that there is no way I will ever make money. I told him if I wanted to entertain a lifestyle that was about making money, I would still be 2000 miles away from here. He replied that every calf that hits the ground is paying for his farm. I said well David if you are paying for your farm you are doing very well indeed. He said, "well yeah, I can also take my farm losses off my taxes. That helps off-set my income from my gas company job". I said, "David, are you cheating on your taxes?" "Lord, no", he says. I said, "well you just told me your cattle operation was paying for your farm". He said, "Yeah, it is, every calf that hits the ground." I said,"You better go home and think on this. Because if you are reducing your income tax obligation because you are losing money with your cattle operation, then my friend, your cattle operation cannot be paying for your farm. In fact, what you are doing is paying for your farm and cattle operation with your utility job." He could honestly not see that. I said, David, you cannot be making money if you are showing a loss on your farming endeavor, it cannot get any simpler.

 

[bse]

i have purebred angus purebred simmental and commercial i retain my purebred heifers and sell the commercial because one day i want all purebred why because i can always sell those as commercial but i cant sell commercial as purebreds.
a few of you seem to hate purebreds but thats the bulls you want to buy? if a young man or woman wants to raise registered cattle they should be encoraged no matter the breed or whatever theres not enough young people raising any kind of cattle and to discourage saying you cant do any good with purebreds is BS. right now is a pretty good time to buy purebreds theres not a big difference between them and commercial you just have to be patient ive bought purebreds cheaper than commercial and like i say i have 2 options at selling time.

 

[inyati13]

i have purebred angus purebred simmental and commercial i retain my purebred heifers and sell the commercial because one day i want all purebred why because i can always sell those as commercial but i cant sell commercial as purebreds.
a few of you seem to hate purebreds but thats the bulls you want to buy? if a young man or woman wants to raise registered cattle they should be encoraged no matter the breed or whatever theres not enough young people raising any kind of cattle and to discourage saying you cant do any good with purebreds is BS. right now is a pretty good time to buy purebreds theres not a big difference between them and commercial you just have to be patient ive bought purebreds cheaper than commercial and like i say i have 2 options at selling time.

I agree. I just bought 2 open heifers in December that are purebred simangus from Rocking P Livestock. They go about 900 pounds each. I paid $2000 for the pair. That is slaughter weight prices at the stockyards. They were not the pick of the herd and I know Keith was giving me a break. But you are correct. If you work at it, there is no reason you cannot build your herd with good stock. I also will say that I have a couple nice cows that I got from my brother that are just cows and they are as good as you would want for commercial cows. Not everyone has the same objective or philosophy. I take pride in my cows. I have an image of what I want my herd to be. To put down purebred stock is silly. Just as silly as saying that non-purebred cows are no good. You also make a good point on being in a position to work both ends of the market, commercial and breeding.

 

[3waycross]

i have purebred angus purebred simmental and commercial i retain my purebred heifers and sell the commercial because one day i want all purebred why because i can always sell those as commercial but i cant sell commercial as purebreds.
a few of you seem to hate purebreds but thats the bulls you want to buy? if a young man or woman wants to raise registered cattle they should be encoraged no matter the breed or whatever theres not enough young people raising any kind of cattle and to discourage saying you cant do any good with purebreds is BS. right now is a pretty good time to buy purebreds theres not a big difference between them and commercial you just have to be patient ive bought purebreds cheaper than commercial and like i say i have 2 options at selling time.

I agree. I just bought 2 open heifers in December that are purebred simangus from Rocking P Livestock. They go about 900 pounds each. I paid $2000 for the pair. That is slaughter weight prices at the stockyards. They were not the pick of the herd and I know Keith was giving me a break. But you are correct. If you work at it, there is no reason you cannot build your herd with good stock. I also will say that I have a couple nice cows that I got from my brother that are just cows and they are as good as you would want for commercial cows. Not everyone has the same objective or philosophy. I take pride in my cows. I have an image of what I want my herd to be. To put down purebred stock is silly. Just as silly as saying that non-purebred cows are no good. You also make a good point on being in a position to work both ends of the market, commercial and breeding.

You bought 2 crossbred heifers. They are no different than the Balancer heifers i raise. They are recognized by one assn and not the other but one thing is for sure, they sure as he[[ ain't purebred anything!

 

[jedstivers]

I would just like to see him have a successful operation before he goes into registered business. Better to go into it with deep pockets.

 

[bse]

why do you have to have deep pockets i dont but i have some purebred animals if he buys 2 now next yr its 4 then on up the line all of them will not be keepers but as a young guy he can do that easily i dont have even close to deep pockets but ive been patient and try to breed up i think whatever anybody wants to do should be encoraged if they want purebred commercial or whatever. Not throw it out there that purebreds aint Sh$$.

 

[jedstivers]

Exactly where did I say purebreds ain't sh$$? I did say I buy registered bulls. I also said it was my opinion. I'm just giving other points of view and other things to think about.

 

[bse]

really not directing my replies at anyone just a few of the replies seems like there saying purebreds aint sh$$ thats just my take on it. i think both have there place without commercial not as much need for purebred and most like yourself want purebred bulls for there commercial and not meaning to argue about anything most things on here just go right over, i wish i had bought just 2 purebreds as a young man and multiplied them from there instead of waiting so late to make the transition.

 

[3waycross]

High Cotton if you want to raise registered Angus then raise them. One of the ways a young fella can put together a high quality herd real quick is watch for the dispersals and go in and buy some upper tier 7 to 10 year old cows. There will be a few foundation quality cows that you can't afford but just below that are the bargains. They will be usually bred to good bulls and you won't fight having to calve out unproven heifers. If you get 3 to 5 calves out of them they will pay their way and you can always sell them for salvage.
If you are gonna do this and want to progress quickly you will need to AI cuz you ain't gonna be buying any seedstock quality bulls real cheap if at all. So use AI and most importantly get yerself a mentor or two to help you plan matings and maybe help you market your better calves. BTW the pictures you posted are not seedstock quality bulls. Maybe OK for cleanup but better bulls are out there!

Hope that helps...............ps; don't let anyone throw dirt on your dreams.

 

[jedstivers]

Here's a thread going on ranchers.

http://ranchers.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=63206

Got a sale catalog the other day from a couple who have been in the seedstock business about 10 years now. 24 Angus bulls sired 16 different ways. How do they expect customers to acceive uniformity when they aren't producing it?

I should mention she was a club calf type when younger.



_________________
Now I know a lot aren't like this but more than enough are.

 

[cow pollinater]

Fwiw, my registered angus cows are running with horned hereford bulls... As a small time producer with no real reputation backing me it just turned out to be more profitable to get great baldie steers and heifers than it did to chase registered calves. By the time you factor in loss of heterosis, registering as a member of AAA, and individual animal registration fees, plus your time in taking measurements and reporting them, you can make grade cattle look pretty good. Especially when you factor in that not every calf is worth registering so all the registration fees have to be carried by a few good ones and IF you do raise a great one it will likely not be recognized as such unless you have the reputation as a breeder of good ones in place ahead of time. Now factor in the cost of feed. An average bull at eighteen months could very easily be more profitable as a steer at six months that you never pay to develop.

If what I just said didn't make you doubt yourself at all then GO FOR IT! :clap: Everyone starts somewhere. Every seedstock herd worth having was started by someone who wanted to produce great ones.

 

[inyati13]

High Cotton if you want to raise registered Angus then raise them. One of the ways a young fella can put together a high quality herd real quick is watch for the dispersals and go in and buy some upper tier 7 to 10 year old cows. There will be a few foundation quality cows that you can't afford but just below that are the bargains. They will be usually bred to good bulls and you won't fight having to calve out unproven heifers. If you get 3 to 5 calves out of them they will pay their way and you can always sell them for salvage.
If you are gonna do this and want to progress quickly you will need to AI cuz you ain't gonna be buying any seedstock quality bulls real cheap if at all. So use AI and most importantly get yerself a mentor or two to help you plan matings and maybe help you market your better calves. BTW the pictures you posted are not seedstock quality bulls. Maybe OK for cleanup but better bulls are out there!

Hope that helps...............ps; don't let anyone throw dirt on your dreams.

I don't give anyone advice on how to run a cattle operation. I have not earned that privilege. But I will agree with 3waycross on his last line, "Hope that helps.........ps; don't let anyone throw dirt on your dreams." Those who comment above are all probably wanting to help you. Any business in the US these days is a risk. The US has priced itself out of most markets. The best thing we do is buy things from foreign countries and resell them to our citizens. So maybe the retail business is doing well. The point is this, do what you want to do if you can find a way to do it. You may fail at any business endeavor. You may also succeed and be careful how you measure success. A livelihood is not ONLY about how much you make in dollars. If you can do what you want to do; you can keep doing it; it is rewarding to you; and it provides for you and your family, you are doing as good as a creature on this planet can expect to do. Your LIFE is the most precious miracle in the universe. The fact that one of us got to be here is miracle enough. Use it for every second it is worth.