Old and set in their ways

[chaded]

I just basically "rebooted" my herd recently by selling everything and buying all new heifers from a reputable breeder. Out of 10 heifers that calved this spring so far there are 3 maybe 4 that I want to keep that thrive here. About the same amount that 'might' work and the rest need culled in my opinion but I tend to cull with a broad sword so to speak.

I am thinking about keeping the standouts and bringing in one more group that I will do my best to pick out from somewhere else and build off of whoever makes it out of all of those. After going and paying a good bit of money on cattle that was supposed to be adapted to similar conditions that I have here and having to cull several I will take my chances raising my own that were born here I think.

 

[Warren Allison]

As if every purchased cow did well, did not bring in disease or problems... It has nothing to do with pride. It can be economical if you develop properly, make culling decisions along the way to sell extra weight or bred heifers and have sound genetics. You'll never know your cattle if you never see multi-generations.

Every purchased cow can be disease and problem free, if you know what you are doing. It takes time and experience, and you learn as much about it by buying bad ones as you do good ones. Same with raising your own replacements: That takes time and experience as well. When people 1st start doing this, they gonna cull some good ones and keep some bad ones.

There is a big difference in going to a local sale barn and buying a cow that a trader brought in that day, with stickers from the sale he bought her at 2 days ago still on her, and buying them from a reputable replacement producer. They will maintain a health protacol that is probably stricter than the average farmer/rancher that raises his own. Staying in business mandates that they only sell top-quality cattle.

 

[Lucky]

For me the ideal thing to do would be keep the heifers you want at sale time and sell the cow she is replacing instead. This way you wouldn't miss any revenue and could keep a relatively young herd. After doing this for several years you would never miss a calf or the money from selling the heifer. However, this is easy to say but hard to do. It's also hard to beat buying a good 4-5 yr old bred cow $$ wise.

 

[Brute 23]

For me the ideal thing to do would be keep the heifers you want at sale time and sell the cow she is replacing instead. This way you wouldn't miss any revenue and could keep a relatively young herd. After doing this for several years you would never miss a calf or the money from selling the heifer. However, this is easy to say but hard to do. It's also hard to beat buying a good 4-5 yr old bred cow $$ wise.

That is literally how people do it. We retain X amount of heifers, or a range, every.. single.. year. That number is a combination of what is on hit list, age, qulaity of the new group, etc. No cows go out the back until their replacement is in the pasture ready to go. It may even be after.

There is no lapse in revenue. It just takes a little foresight.

 

[Katpau]

I know by the time I am weaning most of the cows I will be culling, although a few opens will be added after the preg check. I select the best heifers from the best cows at that time, and those are my replacements for the cows culled. I have occasionally bought heifers or pairs in the past, but in spite of those being carefully selected, most don't work out for one reason or another. It is pretty rare for my home grown replacements to not work, although it happens. My husband declared this year, after the disaster of our last cows brought in from a bred cow sale, we need to stick with raising our own. I simply have not been able to buy cattle that come close to the quality of my own replacements. I have raised their ancestors back for many generations, so I can pretty well predict how they will breed. In my opinion the female line is the most important and you won't know much about that when you buy your replacements.

 

[Logan52]

I am much in agreement with the importance of the female line in keeping heifers.
Most of my cows descend from an old "Boss" cow we called Whitebelly. She was a rangy sort of raw boned cow out of a Holstein-Hereford cow by a Red Poll bull. She was kind of ugly, red with a white belly, and always in the lead going to new pasture or coming to the barn. She calved regularly well into her teens. I bred her to a number of different bulls of varied colors and she always had a good one.
Her descendants, almost without fail, have good bags and breed on time. They are docile without being pets and I just love them.
They do have a tendency for big feet but never had one get bad enough I had to cull it for that reason.

 

[TCRanch]

And if you want to buy heifers, this may interest you:

Angus Beef Bulletin EXTRA

The commercial cattleman's Angus connection

www.angusbeefbulletin.com

 

[Big Creek]

i got burnt a bunch of times at the sale barn- probably my fault but, for the last 30 years every cow on this place was born here. It has worked well for us.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I have purchased a few cows - only from reputable breeders from my state. All have worked out. I purchased 3 embryos and got 2 heifers out of them. Great genetics and good looking heifers, but a little hotter than I like. They are working out, but not our favorite at workup time.
I put red tags on all my heifers and I put yellow on anything I purchase. I think out of 50 females, I have 3 yellow tags - one is 15 yrs old and 1 is 12 years old.

 

[Warren Allison]

I simply have not been able to buy cattle that come close to the quality of my own replacements. I have raised their ancestors back for many generations, so I can pretty well predict how they will breed. In my opinion the female line is the most important and you won't know much about that when you buy your replacements.

Not necessarily true, at all. I recently met a guy that raises commercial 1/2 reg black Simm and 1/2 reg Chi-Angus heifers that he sells for replacements. I have seen a lot of the pics on here of replacements that members have raised, and I haven't seen one yet come close to these in quality. When you get one you get a copy of the Dam's papers,, a record of her previous calves' BW, WW and if kept long enough YW., as well as for the heifer you are buying. You get a copy of her sire's papers and complete EPDs, and you get that heifers health records.. Vacc records and dates, worming records, etc. You will have the same info you would have if this was your operation and you were breeding and raising these yourself.

I have another associate that keeps 250 Brahma cows....150 registered and 100 purebred not registered. He will breed you 10, 20, 30 or more f1 heifers of any other breed you want, AI'ed by any bull you want. You can even chose which cows you want to breed. He makes it very affordable and easy to budget for. You pay 1/3 when you pick out the cow and the bull, 1/3 when the heifer is born, and the other 1/3 when you pick them up at 7 mos old. This year they were mostly $1500-2k. If you wanted a herd of say, 50 f1 Braford cows, I don't see how you could do anything but buy them . To raise your own, you'd have the expense of buying and maintaining a 50-cow Brahma herd, in addition to having room for your 50 f1's. If you had the room for 100 cows, you'd come out better to just buy 100 f1's from the start.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

There is a big difference in buying from a BREEDER (purebred or commercial) and buying sale barn cattle. But, there is a big difference also in LOCATION and your ENVIRONMENT.

 

[Travlr]

I know by the time I am weaning most of the cows I will be culling, although a few opens will be added after the preg check. I select the best heifers from the best cows at that time, and those are my replacements for the cows culled. I have occasionally bought heifers or pairs in the past, but in spite of those being carefully selected, most don't work out for one reason or another. It is pretty rare for my home grown replacements to not work, although it happens. My husband declared this year, after the disaster of our last cows brought in from a bred cow sale, we need to stick with raising our own. I simply have not been able to buy cattle that come close to the quality of my own replacements. I have raised their ancestors back for many generations, so I can pretty well predict how they will breed. In my opinion the female line is the most important and you won't know much about that when you buy your replacements.

To some extend that's true...

Which is why I had repeat customers when selling replacement heifers after my reputation was established. I'd buy late bred cows culled for age, sometimes sale barn sent in as kills, or privately before they went to the sale barn. I looked for a specific type and would try to buy them in large lots. Looking for consistency. They'd raise a calf and about half would go back to the sale barn for one reason or another. Then the ones that raised a decent calf, by my standards, would go into my "core herd". The core herd was short term cows due to age, but I'd try to get at least three calves out of them. Those were the ones that I raised replacement heifers from. The people I sold to were often the people I bought the older cows from. They would be buying a heifer bred AI to a calving ease bull, and out of a ten+ year old cow that had proven herself in the real world. The heifer would have to wean at 600# or more and fit my criteria for frame and type, and be docile enough to be approachable. The bulls I used to get the heifers were all out of moderately framed older cows with good udders and feet and that weaned large calves.

The cows I picked up were high quality but past their prime. A smooth/broken mouth ten year old+ cow that will wean a 600# calf and remain in good condition on decent pasture and nothing more, is the kind of cow to get heifers out of. My customers saw the results. It's why they were repeat customers.

 

[gman4691]

I've said it before, only thing I buy any more, is a new herd Bull ..all cows are home raised.

Pretty much the same here…kept 5 heifers from last spring from the previous bull…this spring, how the "new" bull has done…just noticed this thread is several months old…I'll never learn…lol

 

[Heronfish]

Tis an old thread.
But the point remains.
If you want to make money, you don't fall in love with any line or cow or whichever.
Many herds are created with vanity in mind, not economics