New Type of Cattlemen!!

[S.R.R.]

Last post before Im out of here.

Actually it is the same (exactly). The government puts certain money back for grants, libraries, schools. Whether you use them or not you pay the tax. Whether you use them or not the money is put there.

So it is the same.

Also There goes Caustic and SRR again.
Is this ** Get everyone to hate you day **?

Hey, I haven't taken any grants but if I come across one I'll grab it just for you guys :lol:

Have fun

Mike

So as far as you are concerned it is just fine that people pay the kind of high taxes that they do so that the gov. has the money to subsidize cypress and your hobbies. What a couple of real winners! :roll: :roll: That makes me angry and I admit it.

Mister S.R.R. your hiten the nail on the head but dont go leten any of these here welfar cowboys go given ya a heart attack they aint worth it ;-)

Advice well taken.

 

[cypressfarms]

Answer the question, Mr. Loss for Words, do you know anything about the Equip program, and why it was set up?

I'm reading through, and all I can find is you being critical of programs, but I'm not so sure that you understand them. It's not quite like going to the welfare office.

 

[Stepper]

S.R.R.

When i saw the show i thought it was probably to good to be true. Even with paying higher taxes providing free medical for every citizen in a country would just be out of the question. But that is usually the way the media protrays things. They show you what they want you to see on TV and usually in reality it is a different story.

Does the Canadian goverment pretty well step in when desaisters happen ? Earthquakes, Tornadoes, etc..., things like that ? Does Canada have a National Gaurd like here in the US ?

 

[VanC]

For those of you that have accepted grant money, I say more power to you. I would much rather see my taxes go to help a hard working person improve their lot in life than to some lazy bum who expects others to support them. You have nothing to be ashamed of as far as I'm concerned, and you're certainly not any less of a person than anyone else.

To those who say they've never benefited from taxpayer money I say that's a bunch of crap. Never gone to a public school? Never been in a public library or gone to a public park? Didn't accept the tax refund of a few years ago? Won't apply for social security benefits when you're old enough? Yeah, right. I could go on, but you get the idea.

It's all the same whether you think so or not. You pay in and if you get a chance to get something back, you take it
because you've earned it.

 

[Crowderfarms]

I'll tell Yall in short. As long as the Government is helping me financially with my Farming/Ranching improvements, I'm going to take every nickel, and sign up for every program available that comes my way.

You can call it Welfare Agriculture, or any other name you want to name it, but as being a Red Blooded American, I'd rather have it come my way than be given to some unknown Camel Jockey or other Foreigner.I'll call it "Revenue Recycling"

 

[cypressfarms]

I'll tell Yall in short. As long as the Government is helping me financially with my Farming/Ranching improvements, I'm going to take every nickel, and sign up for every program available that comes my way.

You can call it Welfare Agriculture, or any other name you want to name it, but as being a Red Blooded American, I'd rather have it come my way than be given to some unknown Camel Jockey or other Foreigner.I'll call it "Revenue Recycling"

I knew there was a reason you were president....er president elect.

 

[Anonymous]

I dont see why yall would take more money than yall needed...just because it's there...there's a lot of people out there a lot worse off than me...maybe I should just take all the government money I can get and hand it over to somebody that needs it more than me...or else it'll go to a bunch of greedy dang people...i'm lucky to even have a farm...as much as land costs these days most people cant even afford to buy a farm...and other people sit around and take money that they dont need...sounds like a dam theif to me...I aint got a problem if people take grants to buy stuff that they cant afford...fencing is expensive these days but you need a fence to run cattle...if they need money because they cant afford a fence then so be it...but if they need money to improve their land thats already fenced in then thats BS...hard work will fix the land...people can dig up and spray weeds...cut down trees...just a little work will make the land workable...oh well though

I guess money is all that matters to some folks...always looking to get something for free without having to work for it...hard work never hurt nobody

Have a good day

 

[Crowderfarms]

I dont see why yall would take more money than yall needed...just because it's there...there's a lot of people out there a lot worse off than me...maybe I should just take all the government money I can get and hand it over to somebody that needs it more than me...or else it'll go to a bunch of greedy dang people...i'm lucky to even have a farm...as much as land costs these days most people cant even afford to buy a farm...and other people sit around and take money that they dont need...sounds like a dam theif to me...I aint got a problem if people take grants to buy stuff that they cant afford...fencing is expensive these days but you need a fence to run cattle...if they need money because they cant afford a fence then so be it...but if they need money to improve their land thats already fenced in then thats BS...hard work will fix the land...people can dig up and spray weeds...cut down trees...just a little work will make the land workable...oh well though

I guess money is all that matters to some folks...always looking to get something for free without having to work for it...hard work never hurt nobody

Have a good day

No one said it was a "Cash Cow" with never ending funds. No one ever said all that matters is money.Why use you hard earned money, when their are government programs available to utilize funds to improve your operation?

No hard work never hurt anybody. I've done my share since I was a kid, and everyday God grants me the ability to put my feet down and work, I'm going to take it.It's not like these programs allow you as the Farmer/Rancher to sit back in a Lounge Chair and sip Margaritas, while someone else does all the work.

As far as the programs go, I'm only going to sign on the dotted line for ones that will benefit myself, and hopefully my Kids, should they decide to take over someday.If it's a program thats beneficial to me, I'll take advantage of it.If it's not to my benefit, let those funds go to someone else that it will help.

 

[Anonymous]

I dont see why yall would take more money than yall needed...just because it's there...there's a lot of people out there a lot worse off than me...maybe I should just take all the government money I can get and hand it over to somebody that needs it more than me...or else it'll go to a bunch of greedy dang people...i'm lucky to even have a farm...as much as land costs these days most people cant even afford to buy a farm...and other people sit around and take money that they dont need...sounds like a dam theif to me...I aint got a problem if people take grants to buy stuff that they cant afford...fencing is expensive these days but you need a fence to run cattle...if they need money because they cant afford a fence then so be it...but if they need money to improve their land thats already fenced in then thats BS...hard work will fix the land...people can dig up and spray weeds...cut down trees...just a little work will make the land workable...oh well though

I guess money is all that matters to some folks...always looking to get something for free without having to work for it...hard work never hurt nobody

Have a good day

No one said it was a "Cash Cow" with never ending funds. No one ever said all that matters is money.Why use you hard earned money, when their are government programs available to utilize funds to improve your operation?

No hard work never hurt anybody. I've done my share since I was a kid, and everyday God grants me the ability to put my feet down and work, I'm going to take it.It's not like these programs allow you as the Farmer/Rancher to sit back in a Lounge Chair and sip Margaritas, while someone else does all the work.

As far as the programs go, I'm only going to sign on the dotted line for ones that will benefit myself, and hopefully my Kids, should they decide to take over someday.If it's a program thats beneficial to me, I'll take advantage of it.If it's not to my benefit, let those funds go to someone else that it will help.

"why use hard earned money?"...well sir...I dont know about everybody else but i'd rather give a hard days work out in the field than take a handout that I can get by without...I got enough money to get by now...back when I was a kid in the coal mine...the government said "hey...want some money so you aint got to work as hard down in that mine?"...nope...and times then was a lot harder on me than they are now...so maybe they should keep that dang money and give it to the fellars thats still down there working in the coal mines because its a whole lot worse than farming...the money could go to a lot better use than in our pockets...and I know it dont let the farmer "sit back in a lounge chair and sip margaritas" but I still believe the money should go to somebody else than actually NEEDS it...well I guess if it dont go to farmer then it'll go to some homeless crackhead in the big city thats too lazy to get a job and needs dope money...so it could be worse I reckon...as least it'll keep beef in the grocery stores and keep some farmers up and running

 

[dj]

So as far as you are concerned it is just fine that people pay the kind of high taxes that they do so that the gov. has the money to subsidize your hobbies. That makes me angry and I admit it.

Ok, say the "hobby" farmer doesn't get any money. Would you still tax the income from his hobby?

 

[cypressfarms]

So as far as you are concerned it is just fine that people pay the kind of high taxes that they do so that the gov. has the money to subsidize your hobbies. That makes me angry and I admit it.

Ok, say the "hobby" farmer doesn't get any money. Would you still tax the income from his hobby?

Yes, all calves sold were taxed. In addition, I paid taxes on the cost sharing money received from the government, since it is considered as income.

For those that don't know, Equip is a USDA set up Conservation program. The Federal govt., if you qualify, make a conservation plan, and are "selected", will re-emburse you for portions of certain costs. I was "selected" last year. As an example, after I completed construction of cross fences, the NRCS office sent a person out to inspect the cross fences. After they were inspected, and deemed up to specs, I received a check for 90% of the cost of the fence that I had paid for. (Not to exceed $1.30 per foot)

So after I had paid ~ $9000 for the fencing (including taxes on all materials), the govt. re-embursed me for roughly $7000 of it. I still have to keep the fence up for 20 years, and they do inspect once per year. Last year, they even called me at work and had a surprise inspection. No problem, they did it while I was at work.

If you check into the Equip program you will find that it is set up to protect the land for the long term. This is not a subsidy like row croppers get for just not farming a certain crop.

IMO, this is in no way "welfare".

 

[aplusmnt]

I wish the government would not give money like this out, there is lots of things the government gives money to that I wish they wouldn't! I wish they did not give millions to Palestine but they do.

The reality is they decide how much money they want to take from our checks, they decide the amount of sales tax, property taxes we pay.

And then they decide how much of it they will give back to us! We get it back in way of schooling for our kids, Public Libraries etc.....And we get it back in Agriculture programs such as the equipment program.

They decide all this, if they would quit taking so much of my money in taxes then I would not want any of it back in the form of equipment program. But as long as they are taking my tax dollars for such programs then I sure in the heck would like to get some of it back.

To me for a rancher to turn down money from an equipment program would be like turning down a tax refund from your federal taxes. They taketh away and they giveth.

Its our responsibility to see how much of our over taxed money we can get back.

 

[cypressfarms]

Aplus,

I couldn't agree more! I would much rather uncle sam not take taxes away from my income. It always seemed odd to me that our system is set up (taxes) to "punish" those that make increasingly more. I would think a purchase tax would be better suited.

But since uncle sam does, and there is really nothing I can do about it, I might as well play by the rules. Kind of like a good accountant finding a loophole for you. If it's there, take it. Am I being dishonest.....no. I am doing nothing wrong; on the contrary, the govt. would like more people to join, as it would mean that the future of our land/environment would be more certain.

 

[backhoeboogie]

But since uncle sam does, and there is really nothing I can do about it, I might as well play by the rules. Kind of like a good accountant finding a loophole for you. If it's there, take it. Am I being dishonest.....no. I am doing nothing wrong; on the contrary, the govt. would like more people to join, as it would mean that the future of our land/environment would be more certain.

Cyrpess, I still say you are a good man with a good heart. I simply have to differ with you on this.

When I reclaim land, I go way beyond what the Government says I have to do. It is simply something I do.

 

[Crowderfarms]

And a little of Uncle Sam's money will help you re-claim that land all the better.I can see doing things above and beyond the guidelines,Just makes the project that much better.Now if I can get a grant to study why last week I only had a couple pairs of Canadian Geese at the Pond, and today there's a hundred.

 

[cypressfarms]

Yes Backhoe,

I go way beyond what the govt. specs are, and I have since built many other lengths of fence and corrals, etc. Last year I spent over $55,000 on getting this tract of land ready for use.

Adults can agree to disagree; the only problem I have is when it gets personal.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Adults can agree to disagree; the only problem I have is when it gets personal.

Don't mean anything at you personally. Like I said, you are a good man. It shows.

The programs are what I disagree with.

Those guys are coming on your place and you can bet that if they see anything else going that they PERCEIVE to be wrong, they'll be telling their buddies in other departments. Maybe you have honest inspectors.

 

[dj]

So as far as you are concerned it is just fine that people pay the kind of high taxes that they do so that the gov. has the money to subsidize your hobbies. That makes me angry and I admit it.

Ok, say the "hobby" farmer doesn't get any money. Would you still tax the income from his hobby?

Yes, all calves sold were taxed. In addition, I paid taxes on the cost sharing money received from the government, since it is considered as income.

For those that don't know, Equip is a USDA set up Conservation program. The Federal govt., if you qualify, make a conservation plan, and are "selected", will re-emburse you for portions of certain costs. I was "selected" last year. As an example, after I completed construction of cross fences, the NRCS office sent a person out to inspect the cross fences. After they were inspected, and deemed up to specs, I received a check for 90% of the cost of the fence that I had paid for. (Not to exceed $1.30 per foot)

So after I had paid ~ $9000 for the fencing (including taxes on all materials), the govt. re-embursed me for roughly $7000 of it. I still have to keep the fence up for 20 years, and they do inspect once per year. Last year, they even called me at work and had a surprise inspection. No problem, they did it while I was at work.

If you check into the Equip program you will find that it is set up to protect the land for the long term. This is not a subsidy like row croppers get for just not farming a certain crop.

IMO, this is in no way "welfare".

Easy cypress I know how things work now. I also know there is some animosity by larger producers that program money goes to someone they feel is only dabbling in the industry.
I was just asking what if. If we didn't have or weren't allowed to draw on program monies would we still have to pay taxes on "hobby income". Since I don't participate in government programs. And don't quailify for that money because I am a hobbiest. Should my income be considered taxable.

 

[S.R.R.]

I am a welfare and hobby farmer ;-) . I don't make a living off of cattle (I have a day job), and I've received cost share benefits from the govt. for cross fencing and other conservationary procedures. .

I have received benefits from the govt. twice: the first was for cross fencing/rotational grazing - which benefits the environment as a whole. The second was for clean up after I had 30 trees down during Katrina. Could I have survived without that money - yes. What did I do with the money? - Buy more cattle.

If you would educate yourself and really study where govt. expenditures go, I do not believe that you would be concerned with the $10,000 I received

I started this post a bit upset with what I felt was a disturbing trend in cattlemen ie. the "WELFARE COWBOY" (if I can steal your term only-beef) ;-) Never did I think a member of this board would come out and put into words just what I ment. Cypress you have said it far better then I could have so I guess in a way I should thank you for making it so clear. I think that your comment on how you took money ment for Katrina victims and spent it on more cattle for your hobby put the icing on the cake. I hope that most of us are teaching our children to take pride in themselves and to work hard for what they get in life!! This will be a sad world with the next crop of kids standing on the corners with their hands out if not. :roll:

P.S. My wife and I gladly sent money to help the victims of Katrina that could have been spent here at home on fence, cattle ect. Now having seen were it really went I would like it back!

 

[Alice]

The second was for clean up after I had 30 trees down during Katrina. Could I have survived without that money - yes. What did I do with the money? - Buy more cattle. [/quote]

I missed that one...and as much as I have disagreed with you about this, S.R.R., I'll admit...that statement makes me pretty uncomfortable, also...

Alice