Greg Judy and Profit per Acre

[chaded]

Will have a say, I felt out weights were low last year at weaning. Cows were in tip top shape. Calves were in good condition. But appeared smaller. I dont have scales though.

I will have to say, from what im observing with our small herd, the larger/longer legged animals do lose condition quicker.

I much prefer my 1100 to 1300 lb cows. We brought in a moderate bull this time. Sold the 5 year old in November, it weighed 2200. Hoping this guy tops out around 18 or 1900.

We calve around January to February. Just keep good hay out and they do well. Debating pulling the bull til June/July though. Gotta get a spot to out him though.

Greg doesn't pull bulls does he? Ive left bull in since 2016, went from Feb March calves to early January calves. Thr mild winter has been nice though. And moving cattle around and made limited amounts of mud thankfully. Calves coming into a world without mud is making me so happy.

From what Ive seen he does pull bulls. They run a herd of bulls with the sheep.

 

[ClinchValley86]

From what Ive seen he does pull bulls. They run a herd of bulls with the sheep.

Thanks for clarifying.

 

[ClinchValley86]

Any of you calve with the coming on of grass in spring?

 

[BFE]

Any of you calve with the coming on of grass in spring?

I try to shoot for late March- late May so yes. This puts weaning around Thanksgiving, so cows don't have to feed a calf through the worst weather.

 

[FungusProudKY31]

Pharo Cattle Company continues to add cooperator herds and sell more bulls each year. They are trying to leverage the grass fed and direct marketing trends.

The yearling bulls they sell are small, partially because they develop on forage only. If you look at their AI offerings - - most of the popular bulls are 3.5 to 4 frame. I am planning to use 20 units from an extra thick 4 frame PCC bull this summer.

Be honest - soyhulls are forage? Check it out.

1000 lb cows can have a positive RFI. Larger cows can have a negative RFI. Just sayin'

Here's a thinking man. That's why they have the EPDs and the bull tests with weighed feed.

 

[chaded]

Any of you calve with the coming on of grass in spring?

Fall calving here.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Get a set of scales. People think tall means heavy, short means light weight. Muscle and volume indicates weight more than height. Legs don't weigh much, especially when they have a gutless wonder on the top of them.
Your formula about 100 cows vs 140 cows, also doesn't take into consideration the salvage value. A lot of a farms income is cull income.
I believe @Silver mentioned: He only has so much labor for so many cows. Each COW requires a certain amount of labor and expense. You have to work a small cow just exactly as often as a large cow. You have to vaccinate just as much - and most vaccinations are not based on weight. Antibiotics and deworming does. Time is money.

 

[Muletrack]

I have watched several of Greg's videos but, in my dry & cold climate if it weren't for irrigation, which comes at a cost, I wouldn't have any hay to feed the cows during the winter months. Last year(2020) I had to bring the cows home off BLM pasture 30 days early in hopes I'd have feed for this year when we turn out because it's been so dry. I wish I had the moisture like Greg does to make the grass grow without running irrigation 5 months of the year. So, like many have said, what works for 1 person will not always work for another.

Is Jim Gerrish in your part of Idaho? We don't have that kind of moisture here in N.D. either, but fortunately the 18 inches (give or take) that we do get falls during the growing season.

 

[Muletrack]

What part of N Dak. you from? I was born in Fargo. Have family at Raleigh, Lisbon, Mayville, Hope.....

Cows that want to live here rarely weigh 1300 +.

I'm at Carrington -- about an equal distance from Grand Forks, Fargo, Bismarck and Minot. We call this the Central City. About 1,500 lbs. is the norm -- watching cow sales this winter, it was rare to see a mature cow much under that, and many bred cows nearing 1,700 lbs. I am trying to expand my herd but really have trouble finding anything to buy!

 

[Muletrack]

Get a set of scales. People think tall means heavy, short means light weight. Muscle and volume indicates weight more than height. Legs don't weigh much, especially when they have a gutless wonder on the top of them.
Your formula about 100 cows vs 140 cows, also doesn't take into consideration the salvage value. A lot of a farms income is cull income.
I believe @Silver mentioned: He only has so much labor for so many cows. Each COW requires a certain amount of labor and expense. You have to work a small cow just exactly as often as a large cow. You have to vaccinate just as much - and most vaccinations are not based on weight. Antibiotics and deworming does. Time is money.

Yes, there are certain fixed costs. Greg Judy doesn't give many shots, and doesn't pour. I think maybe maybe having animals sized so you can run 30 percent more cows on the same forage base might be a good compromise.

 

[Muletrack]

Muletrack, I am interested in how you came up with your calving season dates. Since a cow needs almost double the DM intake, TDN and CP after calving as she does after weaning, and your cows would be in that condition in very late fall, early winter, how do you keep them in breeding condition in late November, December which would be a 60 day breeding season. Plus, how do you carry a lactating cow thru your winters?

My cows are in peak condition for calving and breeding. We don't have a lot of fall calving in North Dakota, but the spring months are absolutely the worst -- March is our worst month (and the month in which we get the most snow). We used to calve in January and February, and kept moving things later because of bad weather. September seems the best time for me, at least. Zero calf mortality due to weather, zero scours due to pasture calving. Breeding is done in the yard so we can place dry cows anywhere and not have to have a bull with them. Now, about lactating in the winter -- no problems at all so far (after 10 years of this). We figure that a 4-month-old calf can handle the weather a lot better than a 4-day-old calf. NDSU studied fall calving at their Grasslands Research Center near our farm in the 1990s, and the results were very favorable. Here's a link to one of their publications: https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/archive/streeter/98report/fall98.htm

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I am getting less & less impressed with this Greg Judy.

 

[Muletrack]

My cows are in peak condition for calving and breeding. We don't have a lot of fall calving in North Dakota, but the spring months are absolutely the worst -- March is our worst month (and the month in which we get the most snow). We used to calve in January and February, and kept moving things later because of bad weather. September seems the best time for me, at least. Zero calf mortality due to weather, zero scours due to pasture calving. Breeding is done in the yard so we can place dry cows anywhere and not have to have a bull with them. Now, about lactating in the winter -- no problems at all so far (after 10 years of this). We figure that a 4-month-old calf can handle the weather a lot better than a 4-day-old calf. NDSU studied fall calving at their Grasslands Research Center near our farm in the 1990s, and the results were very favorable. Here's a link to one of their publications: https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/archive/streeter/98report/fall98.htm

Here's more readable link: https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/archive/streeter/96data/fallcalf.pdf

 

[Muletrack]

I am getting less & less impressed with this Greg Judy.

Why is that?

 

[Muletrack]

My cows are in peak condition for calving and breeding. We don't have a lot of fall calving in North Dakota, but the spring months are absolutely the worst -- March is our worst month (and the month in which we get the most snow). We used to calve in January and February, and kept moving things later because of bad weather. September seems the best time for me, at least. Zero calf mortality due to weather, zero scours due to pasture calving. Breeding is done in the yard so we can place dry cows anywhere and not have to have a bull with them. Now, about lactating in the winter -- no problems at all so far (after 10 years of this). We figure that a 4-month-old calf can handle the weather a lot better than a 4-day-old calf. NDSU studied fall calving at their Grasslands Research Center near our farm in the 1990s, and the results were very favorable. Here's a link to one of their publications: https://www.ag.ndsu.edu/archive/streeter/98report/fall98.htm Also, just to note, that feed can be reduced once breeding season is over. NDSU has shown that the additional feed requirements, based on an entire year, need not be significantly greater than for spring or (shutter to think of it) "winter" calving cows. And you can run more dry cows per acre on summer pasture.

 

[Dave]

Is Jim Gerrish in your part of Idaho? We don't have that kind of moisture here in N.D. either, but fortunately the 18 inches (give or take) that we do get falls during the growing season.

C lists his location as SE Idaho. Jim is up around Salmon which I would call east central. Knowing that part of the world but not knowing the exact location of either of them my uneducated guess is they are about 3 hours apart.

 

[sstterry]

Greg Judy doesn't give many shots, and doesn't pour.

As I recall, he puts up Martin houses (or some bird) in the pastures to help control the fly population.

 

[Silver]

From what I've seen of Mr. Judy he seems to have a very good plan for the environment he's working in and the market he is supplying.

 

[Banjo]

I am getting less & less impressed with this Greg Judy.

Gregs got it figured out. He gets these interns as he calls them to come and stay at his place for a year or two...they may even pay him, not sure. Anyway they move his cattle for him daily while he travels around the country speaking at grazing conferences.

 

[Banjo]

As I recall, he puts up Martin houses (or some bird) in the pastures to help control the fly population.

That is actually a great idea.....I've been wanting to do that for a long time, just haven't.