That's not outside the legal burn parameters.
Just like burn bans do not apply to prescribed burns.
Forest service employee arrested after fire burns private property on two separate occasions
- Thread starter Rmc
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Just like burn bans do not apply to prescribed burns.
So your argument is "rules for thee aren't for me."
But you still have yet to answer the questions of what is the legal and moral obligation of local law enforcement in such situations?
Are the not supposed to "protect and serve "those in their community ?
Or are you supposed to bow down to federal authority? Even if that means threat to life and property of law abiding citizens?
These are not my rules/ laws. Your elected officials made them. We just follow them. Just like any law yall don't agree with... follow the propper channel and go change them.
Taking it out on me because I know the laws is not going to change them. You are wasting your time.
I tried to help by explaining how this could happen. Guys like that hurt me also when things go south but no one wants to talk about it like decent people to find middle ground.
I have fought rules and things with in the burn community that I don't agree with. That same burn class I got in to it with a forestry service guy about some comments he made regarding notifying people. A large portion of the class ganged up on him until he walked it back. That class was open to the public and had quite a few people from the community learning the legal side no matter if they wanted to burn or were concerned about burns in the area.
We had very good luck it and are planning to do more and emphasize the community involvement.
Good luck while I continue to light them up.
Taking it out on me because I know the laws is not going to change them. You are wasting your time.
I tried to help by explaining how this could happen. Guys like that hurt me also when things go south but no one wants to talk about it like decent people to find middle ground.
I have fought rules and things with in the burn community that I don't agree with. That same burn class I got in to it with a forestry service guy about some comments he made regarding notifying people. A large portion of the class ganged up on him until he walked it back. That class was open to the public and had quite a few people from the community learning the legal side no matter if they wanted to burn or were concerned about burns in the area.
We had very good luck it and are planning to do more and emphasize the community involvement.
Good luck while I continue to light them up.
If you now the law as good as you claim you would know that negligence can be criminal.
You are also arguing against local law enforcement actions. That they say follow the law. ?
So wich holds more weight in the court of law. Laws or forest service rules.
Kind of ironic that you argue against local law enforcement action and then claim it is be cause you know the law and get all huffy about it rather then explain your point of view.
callmefence
Keyboard cowboy
I
I wasn't trying to take anything out on ya.
Just saying gross negligence doesn't really have anything to do with procedure. Just sayin
Both the fed and state govt hand down exactly what you have to do be licensed to burn. Its just like applying pest or herb or a pilots license. It requires classes, hours, ceus, insurance, etc.
Then with each burn you have a required checklist... just like flight plan, but for the burn. That then gets approved on a case by case basis.
If you do it correctly and follow the approved plan there are legal protections for you, being that you are licensed, and the plan was approved. That is also where you can operate outside of a burn ban.
It's just like if a plane loses and engine and has to land in a highway. That is considered out of your control. The same applies to burns. There are factors that everyone realizes are out of your control.
There are so legal lighting hours and weather conditions that always apply.
As you followed the laws for a prescribed burn set out by the govt you didn't commit a criminal offense and are granted those protections.
If you didn't follow the approved plans in some form or fashion then yes you can be held responsible. There a fines, you can lose your license, etc.
I am curious to see how this does play out and if there is more to the story, on either side. This sheriff will have to prove this guy went grossly out of bounds to cause this damage for it to stick.
callmefence
Keyboard cowboy
I agree with everything you posted.
I carry insurance to do controlled burns
Albeit different than a prescribed burn .
A act of god
type situation is definitely protected. We don't know about the case mentioned. The fact that they lost the fire and relight it may be the key.Licensing and rules don't supersede law.
Licensing doesn't proctect,cops,dr,nurses, contractors or anyone else from negligence or gross negligence claims.
Once may be a accident twice is a pattern. The Forrest Service has a history of over a decade that show the current standards and protocols in place for "controlled burns"are not appropriate to prevent loss of life and prevent damage to private property.
This individual is showing a pattern by losing control of two fires in less then a week in the same exact area.
Licensing doesn't proctect,cops,dr,nurses, contractors or anyone else from negligence or gross negligence claims.
Once may be a accident twice is a pattern. The Forrest Service has a history of over a decade that show the current standards and protocols in place for "controlled burns"are not appropriate to prevent loss of life and prevent damage to private property.
This individual is showing a pattern by losing control of two fires in less then a week in the same exact area.
The forest service has publicly admitted that is fire models that are used in planning controlled burns don't accurately predict fire conditions.
So why after one fire burned private property would you go back and restart that fire . Knowing that your modeling wasn't accurate in this situation,and has historically not been able to accurately predict fire behavior in prescribed burns.
news.yahoo.com
www.koat.com
www.voanews.com
So why after one fire burned private property would you go back and restart that fire . Knowing that your modeling wasn't accurate in this situation,and has historically not been able to accurately predict fire behavior in prescribed burns.
U.S. Forest Service admits climate change miscalculation in New Mexico fire
U.S. Forest Service employees made several mistakes, including underestimating the impact of climate change on conditions in the Southwest, when planning a controlled burn to reduce the threat of wildfires in New Mexico earlier this year, according to a report from the agency released Tuesday.
Investigators say Colorado wildfire sparked by Forest Service, fueling more public fallout over controlled burns in the West
The Forest Service started the planned burning on May 16 on agency-managed land near Montrose. The resulting Simms wildfire spread rapidly through dry brush, grass and forested areas and burned about half a square mile of federal and private land.
www.cpr.org
Prescribed burns have caused some of the largest fires in New Mexico
Feds acknowledge there have been more wildfires they were responsible for
www.koat.com
Two US Forest Service Prescribed Burns Became Massive Fire
Findings could have impact on future use of the tactic to limit buildup of dry timber and vegetation
www.voanews.com
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Dave
Well-known member
Thsi article and a previous one I read were both written by people thousands of miles away. There are statements made about the Hammonds in this article which are absolutely not true. At the time of both of these burns the BLM had a total restriction on any burning. To the point that on BLM land you were not supposed to smoke a cigarette outside your vehicle. On October 13 the day of the first burn it was over 80 degrees and hadn't rained since May. The second burn it may have cooled a bit but was still popcorn dry. One of the problems with the forest circus is they burn based on the calendar. That and the weather forecast. Conditions may not be what they were predicted to be but they planned to burn so they burn anyway.
