Difference between breeds

[Lynn36331]

Hello,
I'm new to the board and new to cattle. Right now I am 1/2 owner of a brangus cow but we are seriously considering purchasing another for ourselves (my husband and myself). We have an apportunity to purchase a red angus bull or his mother. I would like to know the difference between a black angus and a red angus and also what would be the wisest to buy if either. We're not trying to make money, but would just like to have one for meat. Can y'all help me out ? Thanks, Lynn

 

[chili pepper]

If you want one for meat a good 1/2 brahma- 1/2english breed(hereford,shorthorn,angus) will get you a steer that will put on the pounds and taste good, too. I had some I just sent and they all went choice or better grade. :cboy:

 

[Tod Dague]

The only difference in Red Angus and black Angus is skin color they originate from the same foundation cattle. If you plan to eat it go with the bull and have him steered.

 

[Lynn36331]

Thank you both so much. We're going to go look at the bull and his mother today. If y'all don't mind I'll be sticking around this forum to learn. One thing though.......how come I have to log in so many times before I'm actually logged in? Lynn

 

[M Gravlee]

Be sure to check the box to log in automatically.

:?: Anybody else have this login problem?

 

[greenwillowherefords]

Be sure to check the box to log in automatically.

:?: Anybody else have this login problem?

I have to manually login every time. It never automatically logs me in.

 

[JJ]

Check your browser settings. I am not sure about this board but I would expect it you use cookies. Your browser Security or Privacy setting might well be to high which means it does not accept cookies and as a result you need to log in manually each time.
If thats the case you might want to change your settings slightly and install a firewall (if you don't have it) for security.

 

[fellersbarnoneranch]

Hope you get your red angus--he'll be great off the grill! If you have any red specific ?s or wanna swap pictures I'm crazy for Red Angus! (their disposition usually sells them along with the great meat!)

 

[Frankie]

Hello,
I'm new to the board and new to cattle. Right now I am 1/2 owner of a brangus cow but we are seriously considering purchasing another for ourselves (my husband and myself). We have an apportunity to purchase a red angus bull or his mother. I would like to know the difference between a black angus and a red angus and also what would be the wisest to buy if either. We're not trying to make money, but would just like to have one for meat. Can y'all help me out ? Thanks, Lynn

:stop: :stop: Well, as an Angus breeder (real Angus, the black kind), I have to disagree with most other posters that seem to think there's no difference in the two Angus breeds. True, they were derived from the same genetic stock, many generations ago. But Angus breeders have spent the years since they refused to register red Angus improving the Angus breed. At the same time, the Red Angus people were chasing color. There are over a million records in the American Angus database to help identify cattle that will do whatever a breeder wants them to do, milk (or not), marble (or not), lots of frame (or not), etc. The Red Angus Association is working hard to catch up, but, IMO, they're not there yet. There's MARC data that shows the more Brahman influence in an animal, the more likely the meat will be tough.

 

[mtnman]

Typical response from an Angus breeder, obviously misplacing a few facts about a number of little things like DWARFISM, and total herd reporting, along with a more solid genetic evaluation geared toward actually improving female traits, rather than just talking about them, in favor of the Red Angus breed vs the Black Angus.

Obviously, while the Red Angus were chasing color, performance, and female traits, the Black Angus must not have been chasing too much frame, too little muscle, loss of maternal traits, loss of fleshing ability, too much birthweight, now marbling, high retail product(may I remind you, TERMINAL traits?), along with designing EPD more geared toward marketing, rather than breed improvement.

mtnman

 

[fellersbarnoneranch]

Just remember as you read from the rich information on these boards, that most posts are purely OPINION!!! If you are truly interested in the Angus breed of cattle (red and black derived from exactly the same origin) then take a look toward the country of origin and take note that both red and black are registerd there still today. When in doubt--check it out! Any satisfaction/disappointment you may have with your bull or cow will not have so much to do with it's color as with it's inherited traits------unless it's great tempered and butchers perfectly--then that's cuz it's RED!!!! ;-) (In my Opinion!)

 

[Tod Dague]

Hello,
I'm new to the board and new to cattle. Right now I am 1/2 owner of a brangus cow but we are seriously considering purchasing another for ourselves (my husband and myself). We have an apportunity to purchase a red angus bull or his mother. I would like to know the difference between a black angus and a red angus and also what would be the wisest to buy if either. We're not trying to make money, but would just like to have one for meat. Can y'all help me out ? Thanks, Lynn

:stop: :stop: Well, as an Angus breeder (real Angus, the black kind), I have to disagree with most other posters that seem to think there's no difference in the two Angus breeds. True, they were derived from the same genetic stock, many generations ago. But Angus breeders have spent the years since they refused to register red Angus improving the Angus breed. At the same time, the Red Angus people were chasing color. There are over a million records in the American Angus database to help identify cattle that will do whatever a breeder wants them to do, milk (or not), marble (or not), lots of frame (or not), etc. The Red Angus Association is working hard to catch up, but, IMO, they're not there yet. There's MARC data that shows the more Brahman influence in an animal, the more likely the meat will be tough.

The Red Angus breed allows blacks. It is the black Angus that excludes Reds no matter how well they perform. Who is more focused on color?

 

[fellersbarnoneranch]

The Red Angus breed allows blacks. It is the black Angus that excludes Reds no matter how well they perform. Who is more focused on color?

Let's also let our new friend Lynn36331 know a bit about how black and red works...i.e. in purebred angus cattle, black cattle sometimes throw red babies randomly, even though they won't register them. Red angus cows only have black babies when bred to a black animal.

 

[sillco]

Hello,
I'm new to the board and new to cattle. Right now I am 1/2 owner of a brangus cow but we are seriously considering purchasing another for ourselves (my husband and myself). We have an apportunity to purchase a red angus bull or his mother. I would like to know the difference between a black angus and a red angus and also what would be the wisest to buy if either. We're not trying to make money, but would just like to have one for meat. Can y'all help me out ? Thanks, Lynn

Lynn:
If your 1/2 interest cow is alone I would advise you to get another cow in addition to the one you want to eat. Cows need company otherwise they live a very stressed life.
Good luck

 

[Frankie]

Typical response from an Angus breeder, obviously misplacing a few facts about a number of little things like DWARFISM, and total herd reporting, along with a more solid genetic evaluation geared toward actually improving female traits, rather than just talking about them, in favor of the Red Angus breed vs the Black Angus.

Obviously, while the Red Angus were chasing color, performance, and female traits, the Black Angus must not have been chasing too much frame, too little muscle, loss of maternal traits, loss of fleshing ability, too much birthweight, now marbling, high retail product(may I remind you, TERMINAL traits?), along with designing EPD more geared toward marketing, rather than breed improvement.
mtnman

Oh? Where did I say there weren't problems in Angus cattle? And let's not forget that Red Angus came from the same stock. You can't have it both ways: either Red Angus are the same as Angus (including the flaws) or they're not. Which is it. When dwarfism shows up in Angus, the animals are publically identified and their offspring no longer registerable. How do Red Angus breeders handle it when a bad trait shows up in a bloodline?

You can find an Angus bull today that will work as a terminal cross, if that's what you want. If not, select a bull with more moderate, balanced EPDs. MARC cross-breed EPDs tell us you can get Angus yearing weights comparable to today's Continental breeds, without the birthweight problems. You can get whatever frame score you're looking for in Angus. Angus EPDs are the most reliable in the industry.

Don't try to tell me there aren't huge Red Angus cattle; I've seen them. As for maternal traits, there's a reason the nation's cowherd has turned black. It's because a good Angus momma cow is hard to beat.

 

[txag]

As for maternal traits, there's a reason the nation's cowherd has turned black. It's because a good Angus momma cow is hard to beat.

Frankie, i usually agree w/almost everything you say but this time i have to question you. i won't disagree that Angus momma cows may be hard to beat, but i don't think that's the reason the cowherd has turned black.

the reason can probably still be attributed to the Angus but more to their marketing program than anything else. the cowherd has turned black to "appear" angus & ride on the coat-tails of that excellent marketing program.

 

[Frankie]

Hello,
I'm new to the board and new to cattle. Right now I am 1/2 owner of a brangus cow but we are seriously considering purchasing another for ourselves (my husband and myself). We have an apportunity to purchase a red angus bull or his mother. I would like to know the difference between a black angus and a red angus and also what would be the wisest to buy if either. We're not trying to make money, but would just like to have one for meat. Can y'all help me out ? Thanks, Lynn

:stop: :stop: Well, as an Angus breeder (real Angus, the black kind), I have to disagree with most other posters that seem to think there's no difference in the two Angus breeds. True, they were derived from the same genetic stock, many generations ago. But Angus breeders have spent the years since they refused to register red Angus improving the Angus breed. At the same time, the Red Angus people were chasing color. There are over a million records in the American Angus database to help identify cattle that will do whatever a breeder wants them to do, milk (or not), marble (or not), lots of frame (or not), etc. The Red Angus Association is working hard to catch up, but, IMO, they're not there yet. There's MARC data that shows the more Brahman influence in an animal, the more likely the meat will be tough.

The Red Angus breed allows blacks. It is the black Angus that excludes Reds no matter how well they perform. Who is more focused on color?

The fellow who established the Red Angus breed chose to collect Angus cattle that carried the red gene. Can you imagine how that limited the genetic choices to build the breed :?: The Angus Association chose to not allow registrations of red animals. That didn't exclude enough cattle to hurt the breed. Canada still keeps the two breeds in the same herdbook. That's their right. IMO, Red Angus cattle are years behind Angus in performance identification. Adding black genetics into the breed will help, I'm sure. It's helped several other breeds, Limis, Simmental, Salers.... Performance doesn't affect whether an animal is registerable either as an Angus or Red Angus.

 

[la4angus]

As for maternal traits, there's a reason the nation's cowherd has turned black. It's because a good Angus momma cow is hard to beat.

i won't disagree that Angus momma cows may be hard to beat, but i don't think that's the reason the cowherd has turned black.

the reason can probably still be attributed to the Angus but more to their marketing program than anything else. the cowherd has turned black to "appear" angus & ride on the coat-tails of that excellent marketing program.

txag
I have to agree with you. Again you have hit the nail on the head.

 

[txshowmom]

As for maternal traits, there's a reason the nation's cowherd has turned black. It's because a good Angus momma cow is hard to beat.

i won't disagree that Angus momma cows may be hard to beat, but i don't think that's the reason the cowherd has turned black.

the reason can probably still be attributed to the Angus but more to their marketing program than anything else. the cowherd has turned black to "appear" angus & ride on the coat-tails of that excellent marketing program.

txag
I have to agree with you. Again you have hit the nail on the head.

As much as I hate to agree with the 2 of you.... I agree.

 

[Frankie]

" Red angus cows only have black babies when bred to a black animal."

Are you sure? Why not a red cow carrying one black gene bred to a red bull carrying a black gene? Why couldn't they have a black calf? As I understand it, the only requirement for registering as Red Angus is one red gene. Please correct me if I'm wrong.