Coyotes

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the hubby does the same, medic...he takes the dead ones away (far, far away) and leaves them for the coyotes/wolves(which the game department says we do NOT have) to gnaw on and hopefully leave the healthy ones alone!!!

ps...still no sign of the elusive coyote/wolf from a few weeks back that killed one of our 3 year old cows...on the lookout, though...but, like you we cannot be out there 24/7!!
 
My point is that I think sometimes the calf dies overnight and the coyotes that scavenge it get the blame. I see buzzards eating a dead calf every now and then but I dont automatically assume they killed it. I am not taking up for coyotes I am merely suggesting that assumptions can be wrong.
Also ,I do not agree with the trotline,poison, or glass methods of eradacating coyotes. If you must kill a coyote it should, in my opinion, be killed humanely and without endangering other animals.
I am sure I will take a cussin from some of you for not agreeing but I had to say what I thought.
 
denoginnizer":32bnq3pi said:
My point is that I think sometimes the calf dies overnight and the coyotes that scavenge it get the blame. I see buzzards eating a dead calf every now and then but I dont automatically assume they killed it. I am not taking up for coyotes I am merely suggesting that assumptions can be wrong.
Also ,I do not agree with the trotline,poison, or glass methods of eradacating coyotes. If you must kill a coyote it should, in my opinion, be killed humanely and without endangering other animals.
I am sure I will take a cussin from some of you for not agreeing but I had to say what I thought.

Well said! I completly agree.

dun
 
denoginnizer":1warycff said:
My point is that I think sometimes the calf dies overnight and the coyotes that scavenge it get the blame. I see buzzards eating a dead calf every now and then but I dont automatically assume they killed it. I am not taking up for coyotes I am merely suggesting that assumptions can be wrong.

Coyotes kill calves. You can bet the farm on it.

denoginnizer":1warycff said:
Also ,I do not agree with the trotline,poison, or glass methods of eradacating coyotes. If you must kill a coyote it should, in my opinion, be killed humanely and without endangering other animals.
I am sure I will take a cussin from some of you for not agreeing but I had to say what I thought.

I agree. I personally don't like to use any method that causes excess suffering. Obviously "excess suffering" is a subjective term but I would draw the line before using limb lines or glass. Idealistically I would do it to them before I would loose a calf to them, but in the real world there are preferable methods that won't cause so much agony and take so long to work. That's why, if you're running a line of traps or snares, you should check them every day.

Craig-TX
 
I agree with the daily checks on the traps. In fact it is the law in most states. If you checked I think you would find that limb lines, poison, etc are illegal in most states. I have killed lots of coyotes and certainly will kill more but I try to be a humane as possible. The PETA's of the world don't need anymore ammunition.
Dave
 
Picture this,
I check on a cow that is due after getting off work. I find the cow in the middle of the pasture on her feet spinning around trying to fight off 3 coyotes. She is in the process of having the calf. 2 coyotes are getting her attention and the third is going for the calf. Shes kicking and stomping trying to get rid of the coyotes. I have no gun with me so I grab a stick and head her way. I get really close to all of the comotion but never actually get to hit one of the coyotes. They stand their ground for a seconds before leaving. The calf is covered in its own blood, already dead. The cow pretty much falls from being so tired trying to defend herself and the calf. The cow is to tired to push to help get the calf out. That was about 20 years ago, I haven't forgotten it yet. Also had a cow calving get chased into a pond by coyotes. We wound up pulling that dead calf with a tractor, yes a tractor. Yes, the method I use is hard on the coyotes but it works. No, it don't bother me knowing they are suffering.
 
Neighbor up the road said he had lost 8 calves. Said one would drag the calf down by the ear (he could tell by shredded or missing ears) as the rest killed it. Sounded like a domestic dog technique to me but he's killed 6 yotes so far and no dogs.
 
Believe me I have no sympathy for coyotes. Being an ex longline coyote trapper I got called to lots of places because of coyote damage and saw their work. But also living in a state where trapping is now against the law because of the PETA crowd, I know that some methods need to be use carefully. Having killed lots and lots of coyotes I believe properly set leg hold traps and snares are the most effective way to control coyotes.
Dave
 
Medic24":2dsm6srq said:
When it rains it pours.............
Just got back in and found one of my smaller calf's gutted out above the barn.

I did hear the damn coyotes howling just above here last nite and the dog was going nuts. and running out. crossed my fingers.
Apparently it was not enuff.

Guess it's time to start the holocaust once again. snares, poison, traps. grease soaked foam rubber.

any other suggestions?

Satan's canines. Hate them. :mad: :mad: :mad:

you may want to consider this

Lithium chloride may be used in aversive conditioning baits. Ingesting it will cause the predator to experience short-term, acute digestive discomfort and vomiting. It is neither a poison nor a repellant and has no long-term physical effects on the species that consumes it. However, lithium chloride is effective at persuading a would-be predator to revert to other food sources. Specifically designed, sheep-like bait or laced carcasses are used to make sure the predator makes the physchological connection between the effects of the taste-aversion bait and the species being protected. More information and instructions for using lithium chloride can be found in the Manitoba Agriculture and Food factsheet entitled, "Aversive Conditioning of Sheep Predators."

i was unable to find the actual fact sheet..just this reference to it..so am unsure of the amt of Lithium chloride to use.
 
I am totally against killing animals with methods that you have no control over. It is easy to bait with poison or hooks and walk off. Too many pets and animals die from this type of control. A man had a horse that died, drug it to the bottom, put the Temik to it. He was amused at the different kinds of animals that were laying around the body. Coyotes, possums, buzzards, racoons, and dogs.
In this area, if word is spread of poison being put out, the Wildlife officers will hunt you down. All it takes is a buddy telling a buddy telling another..... then the wife hears it, phone calls can be made. They look with planes, helicopters and on foot. When they catch you, it will take thousands of dollars and prison time. Here, not only do they charge you with "unlawful use of a restricted use chemicals" such as Temik, you, then you are charged with killing protected or animals on the endangered list. These are the only two charges that I recall, but along with these two charges, more were added to it. Then the man that gave him the Temik pays the price and is charged also. A long prison sentance is given with a fine that could buy you some acreage and a herd of cattle. You get to pay this before or after you get out of prison. And that isn't including when you walk into the lawyers office. This would probably cover the price of a new four wheel drive pickup. This has happend twice that I know of.
 
I have used the poison. I did find coons, possums, and a armadilla. I switched back over to the glass. Coons and possums eat slower they do not ingest the glass. The coyotes will swallow the whole thing. I'm not saying its right or wrong. It just worked for me.
 
I'm not about to doubt anyone's coyote problem/story, but to be honest I think a lot more calf loss is from the sum beach that buys a puppy, and it outgrows the apartment and aint cute no more, so this brain donor, drives out to the country, and dumps Rover off.The trouble begins when this dog meets up with several other dogs, form a pack and the rampage begins.Happens round' here a lot, I lost 5 calves two years ago, due to dogs,I used to take the thought that they were someone's pet, but never again.Being someone who likes dogs, it's hard to do, but the only way to control them is with bullets. I guess people are stupid, and think because they dumped that dog, a Farmer or Rancher will be kind and take it in. Not the case.There's been reports here of 8-10 calves being killed at one time, bit I believe a lot can be blamed on dogs. Just my 2 cents worth.
 
I had no idea such a controversy would start over this......as for any lingering doubts about the health of my calf prior to being fed upon, I am SURE it was healthy. I check my cattle regularly through out each day. And I know when one is even feeling a bit off. While like all producers, I do have my losses through sickness and accidents, I also know when I loose something to predation. the fact that there are bite marks all over this calf, indicated to me , as well as the game warden that it in fact was alive and well, and fighting for it's life before it was evicerated and finally killed.

I am not Peta member, but I agree that inhumane methods of eradication are not the prefered method. But I sure as h*ll am not going to breed my cows for the sole purpose of feeding the coyotes baby beef!
The thing i have learned and been told about these devil dogs is that no one method of control works for very long, as they are extremely intellegent. One natural control method is parvo, one hust has to find an animal that has recently died from parvo and set it out. Effects canines only. It has been effectively used before, only wish they would do it again.
 
Medic, I would'nt say you started a contoversy, I'd be madder than hell too. I'd just choose my eradication method, and keep it under my hat. A man's gotta do what he has to do in the way he protects his stock.You never know who's watching.
 
After some livestock around here were killed, they staked out the area. It turned out to be several large dogs that were bored. Once a dog gets the adrenaline rush of killing, they will hunt for it. They kill it, leave it where it dies, then the scavengers finish it off. That includes coyotes, buzzards, hawks, coons, possums, etc.... I am sure there are instances of coyotes that have killed livestock, but my method would to be find out for sure. I live a mile from the neighbor to the left and one lives almost half a mile to the right. No neighbors in front or back of me. The neighbor to the right has a pug and a yard dog. They have a buried electric fence to keep them both in. Many times I am on the front porch, I see something going across the field that appears to be deer. I get my binoculars out, and it will be large dogs. I have no idea where they come from or who they belong to. A Rottweiler mix, German Shepard mix and a dog that appears to be a Rhodesian Ridgeback mix. Sometimes two large black dogs. If one of these dogs begins to chase a calf, you can bet the others will join in. I remember when I was a kid, a neighbor had two dogs that came and killed a large number of our chickens. It was their second visit. My dad shot both dogs with a shotgun and called the neighbor to tell him what had happened. The neighbor said that no way it could have been his dogs since they don't leave the yard and they were there at his house now. My dad told him that he thought one might make it back to his house but he wasn't sure about the other. Nothing else was ever said between the us and the people, but both dogs lived, and we never saw them at our house again. He penned them up. I hate any animal that kills livestock. If it is coyotes, then they need to be killed. If I could, I would beat one to death with a baseball bat if I caught him doing it, and feel no remorse as I saw blood splattering and it's brains hanging out. Neighbor's loveable pet dog, he needs to go too. At that point, my adrenaline would be pumping and I would beat him to death too. But I will make sure that I get the right one. If a coyote is killed thinking it is the culprit, it might be the reason that people think two replaced the one. The dogs are still out there and they get addicted to killing once they start it. I have a Jack Russell terrier that had rather kill rats as to eat. She will wound them if there are many and then go back and finish killing them if they are still alive. But she always leaves them laying. Say the word rat, and she starts to hyperventilate. They pass other people's house's and their dogs go along. It is nature. They will always return to kill eventually. They are not hungry and they will leave it where it is. They may chew a bit, but there is a big difference of when a coyote and a dog kill the livestock. An animal that is hungry, it will be eaten and dragged off if it is small enough. I have had a goat or two to die. I buried it in a shallow grave, but low enough that it would stay covered. This goat weighed in the area of 100 lbs. Coyotes (I think) will dig it up, pull it out and then I see no sign of it except where it has been dragging it to a an area that they think is safe to eat it. I never go look to see where they took it. I don't want to see it, but since the animal was dead already, then I don't get upset about the pet goat. I did bury it close to a path that I see the coyotes frequent, and have a path down into a deep ditch with cover of plum trees, honey suckle etc... That is the only evidence I have that it might be the coyotes. I am not upset with that they are scavengers and that is one of their purposes in life. What does upset me is when a small pet is poisoned and no one can find where the poison comes from. I hear of people taking hotdogs and lacing them with poison where they think coyotes frequent. I am far from being an animals rights activist, I do eat meat, and will continue to do so. But I will make sure what I kill is responsible for the death of my livestock.
 
One more thing, the last thing we need it PETA attacking this site or the members here. I do not want to defend myself or the site over this kind of practices. If the Porn site attached itself to a heifer before she has her calf, imagine the red flags this is sending out to this group. I can honestly see why they would be upset. The random poisoning, treble hooks on wires, glass in meat, and placing kittens in cages would be like pouring blood into a school of sharks. A few people may practice these methods, but it doesn't mean that all do. I imagine a very very small percentage do. I think all in all, cattlemen and women are good decent people and will humanely take care of the problem.
 
A couple years ago a couger thinned my herd, killed 2 - wounded 1. I had a fish and wildlife rep. friend of mine tell me to implement the 3-S's

1-SHOOT
2-SHOVEL
3-SHUT-UP

works for Me :roll: :roll: :cboy:
 

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