Conflict of interest

[callmefence]

Employees doing small jobs for customers on weekends. If I was just asked, most of the time I would be fine with it. But when done behind my back I see it as highly unethical. Both by the customer and the employee. And often deal with it harshly.
Seems like you can explain it to someone with employees and they understand completely.
When you try to explain it to someone who has never had employees, they look at you like the cows staring at a new gate.

 

[D2Cat]

If you feel like you need them real bad right now, let them know it's not approved. Let them know next time, they make you aware of their work on your customer jobs, or they're gone as soon as you find out!

If you can find as good or better help right now, tell them to keep on doing what they're doing. They just need to do it full time, 'cause you don't need them to be cutting in on your jobs.

I use the phrase, "You're not happy, and I'm not happy. Let's part company now and make it easier on both of us."

 

[Nesikep]

I've never had employees, but I agree with you..
When I was working for a company, I did moonlight as a mechanic, but in a completely different field (Worked in packaging equipment, moonlighted in performance automotive).

One of my friends works for BD diesel, and has his own shop at home, I don't think he advertises his home shop to BD customers though.

 

[wlamarparmer]

Have a friend in construction/remodeling business. Absolutely forbid outside work from his employees.
His idea is You're basically doing it on my name, and if successful gives them idea they are ready to go
on their own. He does and has however, sponsored several to leave and form their own company when he feels they have the expertise needed to succeed, and work to the standards he insists on.

 

[alisonb]

Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
- - - Albert Einstein

 

[dun]

Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
- - - Albert Einstein

Al was a pretty smart feller! Don;t often see that in the super intelligent types

 

[SteppedInIt]

If it's small jobs you don't have time for, I wouldn't care. Think it would bother me if it was intentionally hidden from me. I think the employee should have some respect to let you know before he did it. If the employee undercut your bid, he would be fired. Next job customer wants you to do, might be at a little higher rate.

 

[callmefence]

If it's small jobs you don't have time for, I wouldn't care. Think it would bother me if it was intentionally hidden from me. I think the employee should have some respect to let you know before he did it. If the employee undercut your bid, he would be fired. Next job customer wants you to do, might be at a little higher rate.

Your the first one to place any blame on the customer. That's what I'm interested in hearing. I don't have to much trouble with employees poaching. I often let them borrow tools and even have left over materials for side jobs. But they know not to poach off me. I'm not going to support my competition.
THE CUSTOMERS are where the problem usually lies. And people don't see it as dishonest. I see it as stealing. The customer today didn't understand or like being called a thief , I told him to find someone else. I packed my steel and left.
A little harsh, maybe. But I couldn't just let it go.
Very interested in opinions on this from a customer point of view.

 

[skyhightree1]

Employees doing small jobs for customers on weekends. If I was just asked, most of the time I would be fine with it. But when done behind my back I see it as highly unethical. Both by the customer and the employee. And often deal with it harshly.
Seems like you can explain it to someone with employees and they understand completely.
When you try to explain it to someone who has never had employees, they look at you like the cows staring at a new gate.

I have had that before and they were fired on spot... If I can't trust you I can't employ you. My guys will ask to use my equipment to do a job here and there for family or a friend and im ok with it as I don't particularly care for RESI work and they will give me money for the usage of my equip and fuel.

 

[SteppedInIt]

If it's small jobs you don't have time for, I wouldn't care. Think it would bother me if it was intentionally hidden from me. I think the employee should have some respect to let you know before he did it. If the employee undercut your bid, he would be fired. Next job customer wants you to do, might be at a little higher rate.

Your the first one to place any blame on the customer. That's what I'm interested in hearing. I don't have to much trouble with employees poaching. I often let them borrow tools and even have left over materials for side jobs. But they know not to poach off me. I'm not going to support my competition.
THE CUSTOMERS are where the problem usually lies. And people don't see it as dishonest. I see it as stealing. The customer today didn't understand or like being called a thief , I told him to find someone else. I packed my steel and left.
A little harsh, maybe. But I couldn't just let it go.
Very interested in opinions on this from a customer point of view.

I roofed for a while and I never liked the customer talking to my crew for those reasons. A lot of times you could tell shady clients and only dealt with them if I really needed the work. Dunno what happened in your situation but if someone was trying to use my employee then I guess it reverts back to the employee comments I made. If this is a recurring customer, you let em know how you do business. They either fall in suit or they find someone else to service them. Also reputations develop. If I hear a guy moonlights at decent rates, I don't see a problem contacting him for side work. I would never go and try to find a moonlighter while their employer and I have a contract.

 

[Bestoutwest]

I think that both the customer and employee are in the wrong here. I would never tell a customer that I can do it cheaper for them later. I knew a guy that did that as an auto mechanic and he had several jobs in the 4 years I knew him b/c people were sick of him. As far as the customer goes, well....I can understand why they would WANT to save the money, but after they contracted you to do it, it is their obligation to follow through with you. I have had several deals where that after the fact I learned I could have saved money. It became 'lesson learned' for me. I don't blame you for being upset, it's how you feed your family.

 

[skyhightree1]

I like state contracts and dealing with other contractors for the reasons stated. My employees do not have the classifications needed to do state contracts and or large contracts with other contractors. I darn near had every job I went to some neighbor asks a guy how cheap could they do it not on company time.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I think the customer was wrong to poach one of the employees.
Nothing wrong for an employee with drive moonlighting to get ahead
shouldn't be doing it against where he gets his bread IMO.
From a business standpoint and I owned a couple through the years. I think I would have just packed my stuff and told the customer we can no longer do business.
One blow up in our small town will beat you home not worth it here whether I was selling hay or bulls.

 

[hillbilly beef man]

If the employee wants to make some extra $$ find a way for them to moonlight that helps you instead of taking jobs away. Give them jobs that are too small for you to show up with a crew and make money.

 

[Kingfisher]

It's such a deep and convoluted hole(subject) I hesitate to comment but from experience I've found when your guys respect you and you pay em well they don't do "side work". On the other hand some folks are "work a holics" and you can't keep em from wandering no matter what you do....
Some " customers" will never get it Fence so you just have to do like the dog and cover that chit w grass and move on.

 

[Bigfoot]

Customer was in the wrong. Nothing big time, but I'll build a spec house from time to time. Can't stand it when somebody on a crew I've hired wants to line up work for himself on the next one. I hire licensed and insured contractors for a reason. Stick with people I've used before. It's unwritten and unspoken, but I have an expectation for them, and they have an expectation for me.

 

[Craig Miller]

I don't see a problem with employee moonlighting as long as he's not taking your jobs. He's should tell you also to make sure your ok with it. The customer definitely should not be trying to get your guys. You said before you had laid off roughness working for you? I think. Or something that made me think that. I doubt you pay what they were making before. They are just trying to make up the difference. We all know they were over paid before.

 

[D2Cat]

In this opening sentence you said, "Employees doing small jobs for customers on weekends." What you did not say was "current" customers.

If you did work for someone in the past and one of your current employees moonlights for them after your job is completed, that is the property owners decision as to who to hire for any job he wants. If you think he's obligated to hire you for his next job, you're not thinking clearly!

If you choose to not work for him because he hires someone else to do a similar type of work as you do, so be it. You go on, and he goes on. That's the free market system. If he finds someone who does work to his satisfaction at a cost to his liking, he free to hire them.

You can not control him (the customer) you can only control you and your employees.

 

[callmefence]

In this opening sentence you said, "Employees doing small jobs for customers on weekends." What you did not say was "current" customers.

If you did work for someone in the past and one of your current employees moonlights for them after your job is completed, that is the property owners decision as to who to hire for any job he wants. If you think he's obligated to hire you for his next job, you're not thinking clearly!

If you choose to not work for him because he hires someone else to do a similar type of work as you do, so be it. You go on, and he goes on. That's the free market system. If he finds someone who does work to his satisfaction at a cost to his liking, he free to hire them.

You can not control him (the customer) you can only control you and your employees.

In this opening sentence you said, "Employees doing small jobs for customers on weekends." What you did not say was "current" customers.

If you did work for someone in the past and one of your current employees moonlights for them after your job is completed, that is the property owners decision as to who to hire for any job he wants. If you think he's obligated to hire you for his next job, you're not thinking clearly!

If you choose to not work for him because he hires someone else to do a similar type of work as you do, so be it. You go on, and he goes on. That's the free market system. If he finds someone who does work to his satisfaction at a cost to his liking, he free to hire them.

You can not control him (the customer) you can only control you and your employees.

My apologies if I didn't word the op properly.
I appreciate the comments. But I've had employees for twenty years. I wasn't looking for a solution. But how others my see it through their eyes. Not a question of control but of ethics.
This particular instance. I believe the man was in general a honest man. He had no idea how it was unethical. Saw it through a different pair of eyes.
Yes he approached my employee, on my time, while I was not there. The employee told me about it. Fwiw I actually told the employee to go ahead and do it and get the money. The following Tuesday I talked with the customer about it and we parted ways.....now you know.

 

[JMJ Farms]

I know what you're dealing with Fence. I own a construction business. Here's my rules for my crew.

1) M-F you work for me.
2) What you do on the weekends is your business.
3) you are not to borrow anything from me to use to make money. Buy your own stuff.
4) if it's your own stuff you're working on, or if your mamas floor is rotten and needs replacing, you can borrow anything you need, just not to make money with.

Unwritten rule for customers.

1) you call me. If I decide I want to help you save a little money, then I will arrange for my crew to help you at my discretion. Don't call or try to "hire" my employees "on the side" This ain't friends helping friends. This is my livelihood.