Clubby Bulls

[Snider_Angus]

1. Everything, Everywhere is ridiculed by someone. Nothing exists that isnt ridiculed by someone somewhere

If all it takes to be a club calf winner is looks then man I need to move to the US and start breeding[/quote]
2. Good luck. You wont get anywhere with the views you have towards Terminal steer bulls.


Statistically speaking Angelina Jolie wins the most "most beautiful woman in the world" titles. Same thing bucko. Try again.[/quote]
3. Well statistically speaking Heat Wave wins the "most winning steer sire in the world" titles. Same thing! YOU TRY AGAIN

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

If there are better cattle then why are they not beating the Heatwaves??? Remember, our cattle don't go in the ring with their info plastered on their side. The judge does not know who they're out of so there goes your popularity theory, what else?

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

What? There is more competiton. Looks AND carcass. They have a led and carcass competition combined cowboy... So not only does your calf have to look as good as a club calf it also needs to have some practical beef value. FYI you couldn't just take an animal out of the paddock. Have you ever been to our shows? I think I might take some photos at my next show or maybe the Perth royal will be better so you can see what our competitions are like.


Snider:
1. So...?
2. What is my attitude to terminal steer bulls? That they should breed quality animals consistently?
3. So what I was saying was just because Angelina Jolie is statistically the most beautiful woman doesn't mean she is. And you just used the same example for Heat Wave being the best, therefore it also doesn't mean he is... Thanks for agreeing with me.

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

If there are better cattle then why are they not beating the Heatwaves??? Remember, our cattle don't go in the ring with their info plastered on their side. The judge does not know who they're out of so there goes your popularity theory, what else?

Cowboy, our animals don't go in with their pedigrees on their necks, they go in with weight, fat measurement and age. They are beating HW's which is why his progeny don't win everything and this is where popularity does come in. If 70% of a ring line up is out of HW then the chances of one of his progeny winning is higher. Of course the judge knows. Can you guess a calf's parentage from looking at it at a show? Or do you know where a calf has came from by looking at the handler? Sure you can. Not always but you can. Same as within stud show animals you can guess lines by looking at animals. I used to be able to tell who's bull was who's in a number of breed because I knew the phenotype. And anyway, apparently judges go and talk to handlers in these club calf comps. Info can be easily found that way.

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

I imagine I could. Theres been plenty of australian cattle posted on this board. I think I have a few show winners just laying in the pasture. We seperate the two, makes it more interesting. You have to be first or second to be eligible for the carcass show. I've had a couple in there, I'll see if I can't find some pics tom. And in 10 years showing at a major have never had a judge ask me more than my animals weight. In purebred cattle its fairly easy to recognize lines, true. In club calves, not so much. They come in all size, shapes and colors.

 

[Keren]

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

Yeah but have they been show steers? Because as far as I know I had been one of the only ones posting my steers on here that is from Australia... Presumptions like that are just arrogant anyway. You're pretty much saying our standard of cattle are rubbish compared to every day paddock cattle from the US.

How does that make it more interesting? The standard for quality is raised in a hoof AND hook competition. You are having to prove that your animal goes past showiness and looks and has some market relevance BUT then you are ALSO having to show that you don't just have a dopey looking brown cow, but a showy, well presented steer. That makes it exciting because the standard is so high.

What's the point of having to be 1st or 2nd on hoof to be able to be judged on the hook? That doesn't prove anything except maybe tiffs over who should have gotten champion/reserve champion.

That's funny because I have seen post from people talking about the judge coming up and talking to them about their animal... And they were showing club calves... Then how every now and again I can pick a club calf's sire from looking at it, and I'm not even from the US? In pure breds the genetics are similar so there for they should be harder to guess?

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

Cheeky...

Hey have you seen any of the Murdoch University Veterinary student's show steers? Man they clean up every year. Stunning cattle and they formulate feed and what not according to each animal and monitor them like a lab rat. Amazing...

 

[Keren]

Cheeky...

Hey have you seen any of the Murdoch University Veterinary student's show steers? Man they clean up every year. Stunning cattle and they formulate feed and what not according to each animal and monitor them like a lab rat. Amazing...

Cant say I have ...

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

Real quality hey. They experiment a bit with breeds too. Belgian Blues and what not. Sometimes we have people bring double muscled steers, god knows why. Good to look at but not much else. This is all I can find online image wise

 

[show steer up]

Hi guys and gals :clap:
Boy oh boy did I miss it, but here is my two cents worth. ;-)
I hate Heat wave, sorry everyone :cry2:
Every heat wave calf I bought the kids, which was three; had bad legs and the worst temperaments.
They looked great till they got around 1000 lbs and then fell apart. All three were from different breeders and heifers. Sorry if I made anyone upset just don't like the crap we have gotten out of him.
:cry2:

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

but he's popular therefore he must be good :roll:

 

[show steer up]

:lol: it's all hype :lol: :cowboy:

I told my kid, the reason they called him Heat Wave. Because he must be hot tempered and as he's running out the barn, everybody waves. :nod: oops :secret: JMO :wave:

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

:nod: :nod:

Alternatively, what bulls are you having luck with?

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

First off I did say your cattle was crap and I also did not say I had an average herd.

Why have to be first or second. Well, that leaves it on the judge to have to get close on his decision even though the champ hardly every wins the carcass show.

Well since I refered to the show as being a major and not a little jackpot, that would be why the judge doesn't talk to you. They have 2000 steers to make it through in 2 days, they don't have the time to talk to you. Sure ya can. Theres a couple, like the ones who throw white to follow, but you can't honestly tell me you can look at a pic and tell a black calf from any other one genetically.

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

:nod: :nod:

Alternatively, what bulls are you having luck with?

I never had any great luck with and Heatwaves. I think I had 3 but none of them fell apart, just weren't show stoppers, at least not an american show.

 

[aussie_cowgirl]

No offese to the cattle that y'all show, but I don't find them one bit apealing. I don't want to show in a show based on the animals carcass data, there's no sport to it. Put an animal in the barn and feed it. I'm not saying genetics doesn't have a part in it though. I could pull a plain calf out of the pasture and feed it out and win an Australian show, but where's the fun in that. It takes a considerable amount of time and effort to feed a class winner much less a champion over here.

A plain calf sounds like an average calf to me...

You are getting away from the point here. You said that because Heat Wave has sired the most winners he is the best club calf bull. And I said no. And I used my little Angelina Jolie example as an example. Just because people have touted him as the best, and statistically his calves perform better than most, doesn't make him the best bull. He is the most influential bull but not necessarily the best. And he is hyped up beyond what he is.

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

I mean, since he has sired the best, wouldn't that make him the best? Sure there are other good cattle, but he excels.

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

Hi guys and gals :clap:
Boy oh boy did I miss it, but here is my two cents worth. ;-)
I hate Heat wave, sorry everyone :cry2:
Every heat wave calf I bought the kids, which was three; had bad legs and the worst temperaments.
They looked great till they got around 1000 lbs and then fell apart. All three were from different breeders and heifers. Sorry if I made anyone upset just don't like the crap we have gotten out of him.
:cry2:

Alot of the problem that your talking about falls back on the breeder. People today are breeding them entirely too hot. Genetically the cattle cannot hold theirselves together with weight. Any high percentage exotic calf has a tendency of being high headed.

 

[splinter ridge farm]

First off, I apologize for even posting the question. This was not intended to be a free frawl...,but some how it has turned in to one. :stop: I am new to this, so I only asked the question to learn. Everyone has their opinions. I will say and strongly stand by this... When it was stated that the show calves are not made to eat, but show, then those believing this way have completely lost the concept and purpose of raising a steer. You can't make an average calf place more meat on the table, but you can take a good, meaty, thick calf to place more meat on the table. You can't raise a calf from a steer, you can't breed a cow, but you can eat it. That tells me that God's design for a steer is to eat first, show is secondary! In contrast, a good fitter can take an average calf and win at Grand Champion level. I have seen this done! That doesn't mean he was an excellent calf just because he had hair.. I am not intending to irritate anyone and I will not argue about this, however it sounds as though we need to rethink the purpose of a steer. In closing, when was the last time anyone has taken their steers or "Show stock" and had them "DNA" tested? Something to think about :???: