Cattle for the south?

[novatech]

I found this article this morning and thought it may be of interest.
I am not a grass fed fanatic although I know all cattle eat grass.
I don't know anything about this Bonsma person or how credible he is.
Just found it interesting and may help some of those wishing to have help when trying to select a breed.
http://www.stockmangrassfarmer.net/cgi- ... cgi?id=570

 

[TexasBred]

I found this article this morning and thought it may be of interest.
I am not a grass fed fanatic although I know all cattle eat grass.
I don't know anything about this Bonsma person or how credible he is.
Just found it interesting and may help some of those wishing to have help when trying to select a breed.
http://www.stockmangrassfarmer.net/cgi- ... cgi?id=570

Nova I try to open the link and it says "forbidden".

 

[novatech]

I found this article this morning and thought it may be of interest.
I am not a grass fed fanatic although I know all cattle eat grass.
I don't know anything about this Bonsma person or how credible he is.
Just found it interesting and may help some of those wishing to have help when trying to select a breed.
http://www.stockmangrassfarmer.net/cgi- ... cgi?id=570

Nova I try to open the link and it says "forbidden".

I just tried it and it worked for me.
You might try Google search for; "Heat and cattle genetics by Allan Nation" and get to it that way.

 

[KNERSIE]

I found this article this morning and thought it may be of interest.
I am not a grass fed fanatic although I know all cattle eat grass.
I don't know anything about this Bonsma person or how credible he is.
Just found it interesting and may help some of those wishing to have help when trying to select a breed.
http://www.stockmangrassfarmer.net/cgi- ... cgi?id=570

:lol: He's pretty credible

 

[Black Coos]

He has wrote alot of books, I know , that does not mean he knows what he is talking about.

 

[backhoeboogie]

He seems to know more than a lot of the horse traders pushing breeds in this forum.

 

[EAT BEEF]

I found this article this morning and thought it may be of interest.
I am not a grass fed fanatic although I know all cattle eat grass.
I don't know anything about this Bonsma person or how credible he is.
Just found it interesting and may help some of those wishing to have help when trying to select a breed.
http://www.stockmangrassfarmer.net/cgi- ... cgi?id=570

:lol: He's pretty credible

 

[djinwa]

Though I'm not is a serious heat region, heat tolerance has been an area of interest of mine. Your article is in my collection – some others are below.

In hot times, cattle accumulate heat during the day and dissipate heat at night, if cool enough. They need every advantage they can get to stay ahead of the heat. Getting rid of heat takes work. Cattle don't sweat well, so rid heat by increased respiration or panting. That takes work and increases maintenance requirements, at the same time the heat causes decreased feed consumption. Roughage processed in the rumen causes heat to be produced just like a compost pile, so cattle want to eat less if hot.

Black cattle obviously absorb more solar radiation and are much more prone to heat stress. For heat tolerance, you can either add more ear and decreased performance, or you can choose light colored bos Taurus breeds, as discussed in the third article below.

I see the heat tolerance issue as the biggest problem with black cattle. The whole industry is heading in the wrong direction.

http://www2.dpi.qld.gov.au/health/3551.html

http://vetmed.iastate.edu/vdpam/extensi ... eef-cattle

http://nimss.umd.edu/homepages/home.cfm?trackID=11616

Here's the report on the feedlot death losses from a 1995 heat wave in Iowa.

http://www.iowabeefcenter.org/Cattlemen ... 0study.pdf

"Producers with the nonshaded
lots reported highest death loss in dark-hided
cattle. Thirty out of 36 producers indicated higher death
loss in black cattle and the other six producers
indicated higher death loss with red cattle and had no
black cattle on feed. One producer indicated only 20%
of the cattle in the pen were black, but 80% of the
death loss was black cattle."

 

[Lon]

He seems to know more than a lot of the horse traders pushing breeds in this forum.

:lol:

 

[B&M Farms]

Thats the main reason we like a brimmer cross down here. Even the black ones.

 

[KNERSIE]

He has wrote alot of books, I know , that does not mean he knows what he is talking about.

Ignorance is bliss, you need to get out more son. :shock:

 

[novatech]

When I said I didn't know how credible he was I was being a bit facetious. Common sense would tell most people that black is not the way to go when the temps are soring above 100 degree and the sun is beating down on the cattle. If you don't have common sense then I challenge you to put on a black raincoat this summer an walk around in the sun. I was trying to be nice toward the Angus people that always seem to think we are bashing Angus if our opinion is given. The truth is that raising pure black cattle in my climate is borderline animal cruelty. I do not blame the Angus people for standing up for their breed and I praise them for it. I do think that the use of an Angus semen for terminal production for the cattle in this area is a good idea.
It is not just the breed. It is the selection of cattle within that breed. I certainly would not want to bring some Hereford down from Canada and expect them to make it in the Texas environment.
When I was a kid Hereford was the predominant breed. Pink eye and Cancer eye was a major problem. When Angus came along the farmers and ranchers swung over to them in part to shed themselves of this. With the advent of vaccines and more breeders adding pigment to the eye I see a swing back in that direction. More people keeping down the weed growth has helped also.
On a side note;
I agree with Bonsma on his selection of cattle to fit the climate and pasture conditions. But one must go further in their selection of beef animals. The animal may fit the conditions but the final product must be palatable. This is where the south has always taken a hit on the price they get for their beef. Through the use of EPD's and DNA selection this is slowly but surely changing the way beef is being bred in the south. For example the well known King Ranch is backing up and re breeding the Santa Gertrudis for better beef not just the tolerance to take the environmental conditions.

 

[backhoeboogie]

The old vet (who raises a lot of cattle - a heck of a lot of them) tells me it is not so much out 100 plus temp days. It is rather our over night lows being at or above 80 degrees that get these cold climate cattle in trouble.

As far as black go, my pasture is full of mostly long eared brangus.

There are many more issues than just the high points noted in that write up. Anyone refuting facts has some agenda or an axe to grind.

I have a few slick angus. They calve in the fall or else they get shipped. I have had one for 7 years now. These angus live on the edge of the cull list. They don't get a second chance for anything.

When I am at tha sale barn and the ring man says, " this next group has been running with an angus bull" I get up and go for coffee. Thanks for letting me know since I am expanding and not looking for terminal calves only.

When I go back to a terminal bull, I'll be producing super baldies.

Some people refer to angus brangus crosses as "A+". These are Actually a Brangus minus IMHO.

I am just one buyer at the sale. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and can bid to their hearts content.

 

[novatech]

The old vet (who raises a lot of cattle - a heck of a lot of them) tells me it is not so much out 100 plus temp days. It is rather our over night lows being at or above 80 degrees that get these cold climate cattle in trouble.

As far as black go, my pasture is full of mostly long eared brangus.

There are many more issues than just the high points noted in that write up. Anyone refuting facts has some agenda or an axe to grind.

I have a few slick angus. They calve in the fall or else they get shipped. I have had one for 7 years now. These angus live on the edge of the cull list. They don't get a second chance for anything.

When I am at tha sale barn and the ring man says, " this next group has been running with an Angus bull" I get up and go for coffee. Thanks for letting me know since I am expanding and not looking for terminal calves only.

When I go back to a terminal bull, I'll be producing super baldies.

Some people refer to angus brangus crosses as "A+". These are Actually a Brangus minus IMHO.

I am just one buyer at the sale. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and can bid to their hearts content.

The Brahman influence has made Brangus a more acceptable breed for my area. I still feel they are not the optimum breed just because they are black, they seem to do OK.
I believe you live far enough north of our area that it makes a deference. They in fact may be the optimum composite for your climate. Most any summer they will be soaking up the sun while floating in the pond on hot summer days (my area). After having done that they go back to grazing. Not like the pure Angus that will only graze at night. For some reason I have never had to pull a Brangus out of the mud. Certainly can't say that about the Angus I have had in the past. I have no clue why. Maybe just luck.
Just as I feel there are areas that black cattle will not be the optimum selection I also feel that the more Brahman influence cattle have the further south they should be.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

The old vet (who raises a lot of cattle - a heck of a lot of them) tells me it is not so much out 100 plus temp days. It is rather our over night lows being at or above 80 degrees that get these cold climate cattle in trouble.

As far as black go, my pasture is full of mostly long eared brangus.

There are many more issues than just the high points noted in that write up. Anyone refuting facts has some agenda or an axe to grind.

I have a few slick angus. They calve in the fall or else they get shipped. I have had one for 7 years now. These angus live on the edge of the cull list. They don't get a second chance for anything.

When I am at tha sale barn and the ring man says, " this next group has been running with an Angus bull" I get up and go for coffee. Thanks for letting me know since I am expanding and not looking for terminal calves only.

When I go back to a terminal bull, I'll be producing super baldies.

Some people refer to angus brangus crosses as "A+". These are Actually a Brangus minus IMHO.

I am just one buyer at the sale. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and can bid to their hearts content.

The Brahman influence has made Brangus a more acceptable breed for my area. I still feel they are not the optimum breed just because they are black, they seem to do OK.
I believe you live far enough north of our area that it makes a deference. They in fact may be the optimum composite for your climate. Most any summer they will be soaking up the sun while floating in the pond on hot summer days (my area). After having done that they go back to grazing. Not like the pure Angus that will only graze at night. For some reason I have never had to pull a Brangus out of the mud. Certainly can't say that about the Angus I have had in the past. I have no clue why. Maybe just luck.
Just as I feel there are areas that black cattle will not be the optimum selection I also feel that the more Brahman influence cattle have the further south they should be.

alot of folks dont know how little brahman influence they can get away with to, brangus is great for my area especially since al gore's theory has taken a nose dive this last two winters

 

[TexasBred]

When it's 105 in the shade with 50% humidity a cow is an idiot if she has access to a pond and don't get in it sometimes. My brangus would do it from time to time but mostly just laid under a shade tree naping and chewing their cud all day and grazed at night.

 

[Brandonm22]

alot of folks dont know how little brahman influence they can get away with to, brangus is great for my area especially since al gore's theory has taken a nose dive this last two winters

Heck a couple more winters like these last two and we will be on here talking about how we Alabama cattlemen prefer cattle with a long shaggy coat!! I don't want to sound too wimpy here given the weather than is common up north, BUT I have had a snow covered yard for ten days this winter (with another predicted two inches coming). From 1998 to 2007 there were only two days like that in the whole decade!! The "winter" of 2000-2001 I never used my jacket. We had cows in knee deep rye grass AND fescue both (in different fields obviously) on January 15th and hadn't put any hay out until Christmas (only started feeding then because the overflow was stored outside and was ruining). This (so far) is probably not the worst winter I can recall; but it easily is in the top 3 (and potentially climbing).

 

[ALACOWMAN]

well come sunday things are looking up, more spring like temps for awhile........which reminds me i left my electric blanket on... those things will spoil you never used one till last year :cowboy:

 

[Diamond G]

Santa Gertrudis perform well in the heat being from East Texas we see a lot of heat related issues such as daily gain and heat cycles in our females. The Gerts seem to have no problem in any enviroment they don't bring as much per pound as black calves but the large bone structure they usually have a higher weaning weight and the mature slaughter cows always weigh more so even at slaughter price bring more $$ home. Just my opionion I like Santa Gertrudis so I guess I am particial to the True American Beef

 

[backhoeboogie]

Santa Gertrudis perform well in the heat being from East Texas we see a lot of heat related issues such as daily gain and heat cycles in our females. The Gerts seem to have no problem in any enviroment they don't bring as much per pound as black calves but the large bone structure they usually have a higher weaning weight and the mature slaughter cows always weigh more so even at slaughter price bring more $$ home. Just my opionion I like Santa Gertrudis so I guess I am particial to the True American Beef

One of my grandaddies lived just west of Marshall, TX. His climate would have been really close to yours or almost the exact same. He ran gerts for as long as I can remember. They were an extremely hot commodity back in the 60's. People came from all over to buy his heifers.