Can't decide on a Bull!

[SouthrnBlacks]

I recently had to sell My Best bull due to a bad foot, He was a black Limousine We used for the last two years ..... This year I have purchased a great set of REG. Angus Heifers that I want to get bred in JAN.....I Have been thinking about investing in a good quality horned hereford bull, But my dad who is also my partner is leaning toward a black bull (Angus,Limo,Maine). Anyone out there with experience putting hereford bulls on black cattle give me any pros and cons????? How do these look???


3 Herford Choices I Have considered. All 2 years 1500Lbs. or so

This Is A Maine-Anjou 2 years 1650lbs. but i dont know alot about this breed???

 

[CPL]

The pros about using a hereford would be the hybrid vigor, but (depending on your black cows) you could get some red baldies. The rest would depend on the quality of the bull. Also black baldies usually sell very well.

I can't tell much about the pictures. But I know I don't like the maine bull.

 

[TREY-L]

I can't tell much about the pictures. But I know I don't like the maine bull.

I would like to start by saying that I don't own any black cows, and I am stating this to show impartiality.
What is it exactly that you don't like about that Maine bull? From what I can see in the photos he looks like a pretty decent bull to me, I like the muscle continuation down the leg and the wide back end. It would be nice to see some other views of the bull. I wouldn't mind having him, he would be easy to spot in the middle of all my Charolais.

 

[TREY-L]

Go with Salers. They are the easiest calving beef breed. The calves grow as good if not better than charolais and you can get homozygous black ones as well. I will send you a pm if you want to check out my Salers herd bulls. You would more than likely having calving problems with the maine anjou if you arent careful.

Hey, send me some pictures of your herd bulls, I would like to see what all the hype is about. Do you have any pictures of some of your weened calves as well? I would also like to see your data on the growth claims.

 

[Frankie]

You should get black baldies from the Hereford-Angus cross. They're a popular cross in lots of places. They can qualify both for CAB and Certified Hereford Beef. But here in my area, solid black animals tend to sell better.

Be very careful using a Maine bull on heifers. They're a very popular show breed, but not an especially easy calving breed. Before you use him, ask about his EPDs and his own birth weight. If you can't get that info, move on to something else. There are too many choices to take a chance on damaging a first calver. Good luck....

 

[mule_skinner]

More pictures/information can never hurt, I would like to know birth weights and EPD's if calving ease is an issue and also any information on the pedigrees of these bulls. Based on these pictures and my knowledge of livestock I would go with the Maine-Anjou. My reasons being that that cross would provide you with really good females if you keep heifers and also make some dandy feedlot steers, especially if you retained any females out of your Limi bull. The Maine bull looks longer, deeper, and heavier muscled than any of the Herefords. Since you liked your Limi bull, I assume these are all traits that you want in your cattle and the way I see it, the Maine will put that into your cattle better than these Herefords. However, since you will need a bull for heifers make sure the birthweights are accetable on the bull you decide on, regardless of breed.

 

[SouthrnBlacks]

I have a young angus bull I can use on the heifers to get their first calf without any trouble, I Just dont think he is the quality bull to make my herd any better, I only plan on breeding about 8 heifers and 40 or so cows..... My cows are all fancy black Angus/Brangus with a couple baldies.... We have always had success with solid black animals, But i just want to raise some heavier heifers, Larger frames.... I dont think there will be that big of a difference in price here Baldies or solid black I just want to improve on what i have now.

 

[dun]

Gelbvieh

 

[3waycross]

Gelbvieh

Here is a super calving ease Gelbvieh bull plus his others EPD's are outstanding. The only place where he can possibly be faulted is he is a little high for milk. He is a Bull Barn sire. They probably have the best collection of Gelbvieh sires of any of the suppliers out there. The great thing about the Angus Gelbvieh cross is you can register the calves as balancers. They will give you explosive growth. We have been crossing them on Shorthorns for 3 years and weaning 650lb av calves off the Shorthorn cows. I forgot one thing. The Gelbvieh's crosses should have outstanding dispositions. They are great cattle to work with.

http://bullbarn.com/gelbepd.asp?ID=187

 

[dun]

Gelbvieh

Here is a super calving ease Gelbvieh bull plus his others EPD's are outstanding. The only place where he can possibly be faulted is he is a little high for milk. He is a Bull Barn sire. They probably have the best collection of Gelbvieh sires of any of the suppliers out there. The great thing about the Angus Gelbvieh cross is you can register the calves as balancers. They will give you explosive growth. We have been crossing them on Shorthorns for 3 years and weaning 650lb av calves off the Shorthorn cows. I forgot one thing. The Gelbvieh's crosses should have outstanding dispositions. They are great cattle to work with.

http://bullbarn.com/gelbepd.asp?ID=187

Have you ever used them on Herefords and kept the heifers?

 

[3waycross]

No we don't have any Herefords. Just Shorthorn and a little Angus. don't see why they wouldn't throw some great baldies with the Herefords. We are very happy with the heifers from the Gelbvieh/Shorthorn cross.

I'll ask some of the Gelbvieh breeders around here if anybody they know does that.

 

[mule_skinner]

But i just want to raise some heavier heifers, Larger frames.... I just want to improve on what i have now.

Continental breeds will give you more growth than British breeds. If you are looking to increase the size and weight of your cattle then go with a Maine, Gelbveih, Limousin, etc.

Improving your herd is what bull selection is all about, choose the bull that you think will improve it the most.

 

[3waycross]

But i just want to raise some heavier heifers, Larger frames.... I just want to improve on what i have now.

Continental breeds will give you more growth than British breeds. If you are looking to increase the size and weight of your cattle then go with a Maine, Gelbveih, Limousin, etc.

Improving your herd is what bull selection is all about, choose the bull that you think will improve it the most.

I agree on the growth factor but am puzzled as to why you want to increase frame size. Why not just breed for more pounds weaned. The Gelbvieh's in most cases will moderate frame size, but still give great growth.

The whole world(at least most of it) are going away from larger framed cattle and you seem to want to go out of your way to increase your feed bill, by going bigger.

 

[SouthrnBlacks]

Thanks.... I agree with breeding for heavier weaning ..... I guess thats what i meant..LOL
I think i will try to find someone around my area with a Gelbvieh Bull I could possibly look at. Thanks for all the advice.

 

[KNERSIE]

I don't particularly like any of the three herefords although I think that if you want to retain heifers a herefordbull is the way to go. If i had to use one of the three bulls, the first one would win hands down, but even he isn't without his problems.

The Maine bull lacks capacity and although he will likely sire very good terminal calves i don't see him as a herd improver.

For what its worth the best way to stay profitable is to have moderate very easy keeping, low input cows and using a bull that will increase value in the calf crop. If you increase the size of the cows you better be sure the calves increase proportionally not to go backwards. Don't get Doc Harris started on this!

 

[Bonsman]

Take a peek at a Bonsmara Bull. The entire breed in the USA is all natural. My website is http://www.smith-bonsmara.com There are only a few Bonsmara breeders in the USA. They also have a buy back program for your calf crop that includes a $40.00 bonus per calf. These animals are well adapted to Eastern Oklahoma.