Breeding Decisions -- how far in the future do you plan?

[WalnutCrest]

When making a breeding decision, do you breed one or two years out ... or a decade or more out? And, when making decisions, do you go for one sort of extreme for a few years (milking, marbling, etc.) and then some sort of offsetting extreme the next time you're picking a bull or two?

Here's a story from an unrelated business that may shed some light on how we think about bull choices.

Early in my career, my boss asked me to analyze the investment returns for college and university endowments over the prior decade. The most notable thing I uncovered was ... was something that's stuck with me all these years ... and that was that every single one of the colleges and universities who were in the top 10% for the decade never had a single annual ranking lower than being in the top 50%. In other words, having a bang-up year or two wasn't enough to get you top decile performance for the decade ... and beating at least half of everyone else each and every year was enough to be considered absolutely elite.

I'd love to hear about the time horizon you consider when making your bull / AI / ET choices.

 

[dun]

In the fall I make a breeding plan for the next spring, we only calve once a year in the spring. We never breed for extremes in anything, jut boring middle of the road. But out of some cows we may go real heavy on carcass traits as long as the other traits are balanced with the cow

 

[bse]

About 60 days i try to match the bull to the cow for what i may need to improve or maintain if i dont like the results i change next year. If she has a heifer ill probably change the next year anyway. With a bull im sure id plan for the long term.

 

[3waycross]

I breed for saleable bulls. I try to breed for at least 2 generations down the line if it's a heifer.

 

[WalnutCrest]

About 60 days i try to match the bull to the cow for what i may need to improve or maintain if i dont like the results i change next year. If she has a heifer ill probably change the next year anyway. With a bull im sure id plan for the long term.

Which is a whole other very interesting topic ... compensatory matings vs just using the "best proven bull" on as many cows as possible.

 

[Putangitangi]

My plans are always for the calves of the (hoped for) heifer the current mating will produce.

 

[cow pollinater]

Choosing sires is my default setting when I'm not otherwise occupied. I can easily waste two hours looking at genetics and still not have a favorite. Genetics is what got me excited about cattle in the first place. I start watching AI sires the minute they hit the catalog but NEVER use them until either their epd's trend up from where they started or they are extremely proven. The proof is in the progeny.
I myself am commercial with a small herd of seedstock cows mixed in but have registered herds that I service. I have semen on hand for the seedstock for the next three matings if I need to take it out that far but will likely find something else that fits in between here and there and that's okay as well. On the commercial cows I'm digging up genetics for next breeding season which is right around the corner in November.
There is a ton of money left sitting on the table in the cattle industry by either ignorance to genetics or apathy in its application.

 

[cowgirl_jenna]

We shoot for the balanced approach when selecting bulls to use. We are mostly commercial cows with a small show string for the kids. We have got the frame size to where we want for the most part, so are focusing on cows that will produce live calves that will grow and do well in a feed lot setting. I'm always trying to better the herd looking 3-5 years in the future as to where we want the herd to go.

I choose AI bulls that will compliment each individual cow. I just don't believe in the idea of using the 1 or 2 "hot" bulls out of the catalog. This is the greatest advantage of AI I believe to use the a certain bull on this cow, but a different one on that one. With the dairy cows, they are each mated individually by a herd analyzer. With choosing beef herd/clean-up bulls, we try to match our goals as good as we can.
Jenna

 

[Ohrmundt Simmentals]

For us and only having 40 or so cows to breed it's not to bad. I start looking at what we're going to AI and start picking out bulls a couple of months before breeding. I also like to see what we get out of the bulls we used for Ai the spring before. The cows that go to the bulls I actually hold a selection draft kinda like the nfl. More for fun then anything else. I look at which bull will compliment each cow the best. Usually breeding for better heifers with a little more growth and keep a few bulls from that to sell as breeders or backups.

 

[Putangitangi]

...I choose AI bulls that will compliment each individual cow. I just don't believe in the idea of using the 1 or 2 "hot" bulls out of the catalog. This is the greatest advantage of AI I believe to use the a certain bull on this cow, but a different one on that one. With the dairy cows, they are each mated individually by a herd analyzer. With choosing beef herd/clean-up bulls, we try to match our goals as good as we can.
Jenna

I used a selection of different bulls in my first few years and found that I produced a real range of calves, rather than the sort of uniformity I was eventually wanting. I found it was better to use a good bull or two which would suit most of the cows. The daughters were more similar than they'd be with different sires and so bull selection in the next generation was simpler again. It got easier still when I bred the sort of bulls I really wanted to use and could use them over most of the herd. I found trying to rectify a weakness in one cow with an apparent strength in a particular bull was often a track to nowhere good.

 

[ANAZAZI]

I found it was better to use a good bull or two which would suit most of the cows. The daughters were more similar than they'd be with different sires and so bull selection in the next generation was simpler again. It got easier still when I bred the sort of bulls I really wanted to use and could use them over most of the herd. I found trying to rectify a weakness in one cow with an apparent strength in a particular bull was often a track to nowhere good.

Hear! Hear!

 

[cowgirl_jenna]

I used a selection of different bulls in my first few years and found that I produced a real range of calves, rather than the sort of uniformity I was eventually wanting. I found it was better to use a good bull or two which would suit most of the cows. The daughters were more similar than they'd be with different sires and so bull selection in the next generation was simpler again. It got easier still when I bred the sort of bulls I really wanted to use and could use them over most of the herd. I found trying to rectify a weakness in one cow with an apparent strength in a particular bull was often a track to nowhere good.

Oh come on where's your sense of adventure ;-) , I like to try out a few and see some actual results from them in "my" herd. Then like you if they are a hit I'll use them more widely the following year.
Jenna

 

[Jake]

I have a plan for the herd that is 10 years down the road. The bulls in which I use to reach that goal may vary over the course of the year and a lot will depend upon what we end up buying or raising ourselves. There is a huge difference in opinion of how to work our breeding plan within our family.

 

[Putangitangi]

I used a selection of different bulls in my first few years and found that I produced a real range of calves, rather than the sort of uniformity I was eventually wanting. I found it was better to use a good bull or two which would suit most of the cows. The daughters were more similar than they'd be with different sires and so bull selection in the next generation was simpler again. It got easier still when I bred the sort of bulls I really wanted to use and could use them over most of the herd. I found trying to rectify a weakness in one cow with an apparent strength in a particular bull was often a track to nowhere good.

Oh come on where's your sense of adventure ;-) , I like to try out a few and see some actual results from them in "my" herd. Then like you if they are a hit I'll use them more widely the following year.
Jenna

I still buy in semen for the pedigree cows, to create the next round of bulls. Some work, some get a ring and make nice steers. There's adventure enough, still.

 

[glacierridge]

I like to breed for well muscled but still feminine females with growth, we need the females to give us growthy calves, the fewer days it takes to get a steer to the freezer, the better profitability.
Also pushing for females that are fertile easy keepers.

The weak females cull themselves out.

I've been only helping my brother pick AI sires a short time, but I see a lot of strong young females.
I'm excited to see them become cows in a year

 

[Stocker Steve]

I plan out at least 2 generations. The harder question is how often does the plan change? :shock:

 

[WalnutCrest]

I plan out at least 2 generations.
<snip>

So, if you find a particular cow and a particular bull seem to really click in terms of putting a great calf on the ground, will you collect him, and AI him to her for the rest of her life (or until she puts a lower quality calf on the ground by this particular bull) ... or will you cycle bulls through on her in hopes of getting something good from her via a different bull?

<snip>
The harder question is how often does the plan change? :shock:

This made me laugh!

 

[WalnutCrest]

I would expect that most seedstock guys have to think further down the road than the pure "sell 'em at the sale barn" guy needs to plan ... as the former is breeding the next generation of donors and bulls that the commercial guy will choose from to try to top out the local market. One is thinking at least 4-5 years down the road, and the other is thinking 18 months or so down the road ... but both are trying to anticipate the demand of their buyers.