Black Like Me

[inyati13]

I described someone to an individual once as, the building inspector, 6 ft. tall, slender, black.... I was interrupted telling me I was a racist. So if I describe someone am I a racist? So is black incorrect?

I was in a carpet store getting a bid on redoing the entire house. I asked the salesman, "Who installs your carpet?" He told me I was a racist and walked away from me.

Why are some many people so sensitive about skin color? What does carpet installation have to do with race?

I understand what you are saying. I still remember watching the news a few years ago, and there was a story about a young boy. they were showing the young boy, his parents, and an African American social worker walking along. The social worker was black and everyone else was white. The reporter wanted to point out the social worker and said something like, "The social worker is the one in the striped shirt, jeans, and baseball cap." He could have described him in a less wordy fashion, but I knew the reporter was scared he would offend someone, but what's wrong with using skin color as a descriptive characteristic?

Herofan, it is a sensitive issue. Sometimes it may be appropriate but most of the time, it will get you in trouble. I served 33 years in the Federal Work Force, a white Caucasian non-disabled, rural, male has to keep his wit or maybe better to say, walk on eggshells, because it is difficult to not slip up and offend some "group" that is ready to accuse you of discrimination. When you do, you got the entire administration in your shirt with you. It happened to me more than once. One was when I worked in Denver in 1980. I offended an African-American woman (back then, African-American was the preferred reference). I went to my office one morning and the partitions around my space were gone. I observed that the secretary had taken them because she wanted to seclude herself from view of the staff. I started the process of retrieving my partitions and she stopped me. I honestly thought she was going to get physical. I had the sense not to push her. When our supervisor came in she filed a complaint against me for harassment. It went all the way up to the Regional Administrator and I was required to take a class in sensitivity training. BTW: I accept the way things are. I understand why and hold no ill feelings.

PS: If you are a "White Caucasian Non-disabled Male" in the federal workforce, there is no such thing as being Discriminated against. That is probably appropriate and personally I appreciate why it is that way.

 

[highgrit]

Now that's BS, I think. I'm not sure what your trying to say Inyati. But the working white man is at a serious disadvantage in the public service work force. And the government doesn't want to see a white owned small business be successful either. The government denies allowing the all white male owned company from bidding on some government projects. Talk about discrimination it doesn't get any worse than that in my eyes. You want equally, earn it.

 

[inyati13]

Now that's BS, I think. I'm not sure what your trying to say Inyati. But the working white man is at a serious disadvantage in the public service work force. And the government doesn't want to see a white owned small business be successful either. The government denies allowing the all white male owned company from bidding on some government projects. Talk about discrimination it doesn't get any worse than that in my eyes. You want equally, earn it.

From the perspective of affirmative action, in the Federal Work Force, a White Caucasion Male who does not suffer some form of disability is not the focus. The focus is to address gender, race, disability, and other forms of historic discrimination. Whether you agree with it or support it is your right.

I accept the fact that these policies are intended to right the "wrongs of the past". Thus, I understand why they are structured as they are. I am ok with that. That is a personal choice. At the same time, I understand your logic and the basis of your personal choice.

Minority bid contracts: You don't have to tell me.

BTW: Many fail to realize that there are numerous "affirmative actions" that favor veterans of the armed forces. For example, I was involved in the Reagan Era Reduction In Force orders that came out of the administration, veterans receive preferential treatment when it comes to retention. A 3 year-service Vet can bum a non-vet who has 30 years of service. All these policies come down from legislative action. You have to roll with the punches.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

The government needs to get out of the business of picking winners and losers.

Equal opportunity is one thing but guaranteed outcome is quite another.

 

[inyati13]

Did you know the minority bid contract has become as crooked as a dog's hind leg? What contractors are doing are fronting their business with decoy minorities and using the strategy to take contracts away from honest contractors. Been there, seen that.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Ron, the next time we're together I'll tell you about my one and only up close and personal experience in trying to work with our illustrious government on a small construction project I was involved in back in 1992 here in Tennessee.

Reagan's famous quote "we're from the government and we're here to help you" was never more evident to me.

Thanks but no thanks.

 

[highgrit]

Yes, I know first hand how the minority bidding works. My wife's the majority owner of our businesses, and it's not by chance or choice. We've rolled or been made to roll with the punches for to long already. The more our government tries to appease the minorities, the further we fall. When this country was the most segregated, was also the same time frame that we led the world in everything. Now a days it's not that way, and this is better? Not in my eye's.

 

[inyati13]

Yes, I know first hand how the minority bidding works. My wife's the majority owner of our businesses, and it's not by chance or choice. We've rolled or been made to roll with the punches for to long already. The more our government tries to appease the minorities, the further we fall. When this country was the most segregated, was also the same time frame that we led the world in everything. Now a days it's not that way, and this is better? Not in my eye's.

Highgrit, I believe that I am a fair and compassionate person. Thus, I don't get joy out of anyone being taken advantage of, mistreated or cheated. I am sympathetic to your cause. I will acknowledge that the pendulum has swung far to the left, but that is the price we are paying for past discrimination.

 

[highgrit]

Your big on Africa and it's history. I have a couple of questions, first one is what's the average life span of a African? And second what's the average life span of a African American? I will be willing to bet the farm on that the African American has a longer life span. And life is priceless, on this I think we can both agree on. No matter how bad it was or is here, it's been way better here than there for the minorities.

 

[inyati13]

Your big on Africa and it's history. I have a couple of questions, first one is what's the average life span of a African? And second what's the average life span of a African American? I will be willing to bet the farm on that the African American has a longer life span. And life is priceless, on this I think we can both agree on. No matter how bad it was or is here, it's been way better here than there for the minorities.

Africa is composed of third world states many undeveloped with poor nutrition and sanitary facilities. That they have a shorter life span is for those reasons. But to assume it is acceptable to remove people from their homeland against their free-will is not going to fly if that is where you are flying.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Is it true that if Lincoln hadn't been murdered he had plans to repatriate many freed slaves back to Africa? I heard that a few times over the years but never really dug into it to see if it was true.

I do know that blacks captured and sold other blacks into slavery and that the slave trade is still practiced around the world in some of these Third World countries you mentioned Inyati.

 

[TexasBred]

Your big on Africa and it's history. I have a couple of questions, first one is what's the average life span of a African? And second what's the average life span of a African American? I will be willing to bet the farm on that the African American has a longer life span. And life is priceless, on this I think we can both agree on. No matter how bad it was or is here, it's been way better here than there for the minorities.

Africa is composed of third world states many undeveloped with poor nutrition and sanitary facilities. That they have a shorter life span is for those reasons. But to assume it is acceptable to remove people from their homeland against their free-will is not going to fly if that is where you are flying.

WE didn't remove them....our ancestors simply purchased them on the open market once they got here and the US wasn't the only destination. Many times they were removed by their own people.....greed is not a new thing.

 

[inyati13]

The trade in humans off the continent of Africa has been documented in several books. There is not to my knowledge anything in recorded human history that matches it. James Michener wrote one of his books about it. It is impossible to make generalizations because numerous countries including the colonies of North America were involved. It is true that alliances were formed with tribes to capture natives to be sold into the slave trade. In some cases, tribes sold their own people.

Slave ships were large cargo vessels. The slaves were shackled in the holds. At the beginning of a voyage, the sailors would go down and unshackle those they died. As the death rate increased the odor got so bad, sailors would refuse to clear the hold of the dead bodies. It was said you could smell a slave ship coming into harbor a day before it got there. The enterprises that engaged in the business of slave transport ran it like you were transporting watermellons. They considered a 50% loss of their stock acceptable. Schools of sharks learned that following slave ships was an easy way to make a living.

TB: Greed probably began with the first spark of life!

Came back to edit this to add:
Here is a gruesome detail. Because infants could not survive the voyage, when the slaves were "harvested", the infants were taken off the mother and they would play catch the infant on the end of a spear. If that got old, they simply took the infant by the heels and bashed his head on a rock.

 

[inyati13]

Is it true that if Lincoln hadn't been murdered he had plans to repatriate many freed slaves back to Africa? I heard that a few times over the years but never really dug into it to see if it was true.

I do know that blacks captured and sold other blacks into slavery and that the slave trade is still practiced around the world in some of these Third World countries you mentioned Inyati.

I don't know about Lincoln or who did it but the US repatriated slaves to Africa. Liberia was formed for that end.

Might be better to say - resettled. They did not go back to their country of origin.

Here you go:
Liberia was founded by the United States while occupied by local Africans. Beginning in 1820, the area was settled by African Americans, most of whom were freed slaves. African captives freed from slave ships by the British and Americans were sent to Liberia instead of being repatriated to their various African countries of origin. The colonists established a new country with the help of the American Colonization Society, a private organization whose leaders thought former slaves would have greater opportunity in Africa and that the Black population in the United States would remain a permanent racial underclass.[5]

In 1847, this new country became the Republic of Liberia, establishing a government modeled on that of the United States and naming its capital city Monrovia after James Monroe, the fifth president of the United States and a prominent supporter of the colonization. The colonists and their descendants, known as Americo-Liberians, led the political, social, cultural and economic sectors of the country and ruled the nation for over 130 years as a dominant minority.

 

[TexasBred]

Best we could do. By 1820 there had already been many generations of slaves so most had no idea what part of Africa they came from let alone the "name" of the country and were as out of place and unaccepted in Africa as they were in the United States. Even today only a small percentage of the population of Liberia trace their ancestry to returned slaves.

 

[skyhightree1]

I didn't really get into posting on this topic but one thing bothered me mostly and thats the minority owned businesses. Minority owned businesses are at a disadvantage as well and all the gov't tries to do is help even the playing field. I can't speak on any other state but in Va. they encourage small minority or women owned businesses to bid on jobs. MIND YOU... THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE GUARANTEED TO GET THE JOBS YOU BID ON. In Va. I think some need to go back and check the wording because surely it can't say minority business bid only. If someone finds something that says that from the gov't im from missouri. The gov't gives a preference I think is the wording but not a guarantee. The same could be said about discrimination when jobs want veterans only... Just saying

https://eva.virginia.gov/library/files/swam/EO33.pdf

 

[Caustic Burno]

Best we could do. By 1820 there had already been many generations of slaves so most had no idea what part of Africa they came from let alone the "name" of the country and were as out of place and unaccepted in Africa as they were in the United States. Even today only a small percentage of the population of Liberia trace their ancestry to returned slaves.

The hypocrisy the largest slave trader ever was a Northern Senator.
Made his fortune in human trafficking.
http://www.tracingcenter.org/resources/ ... es-dewolf/

 

[TexasBred]

Can't disagree with you on that. They hypocracy is not that he was a northerner but that he was a U.s. Senator. Am only saying the US in general received more slaves overall than most all other countries combined. 15 million plus I read somewhere......Someone got rich for sure. And the attempt to establish a country in Africa made of of former slaves was a total failure for all intents and purposes. Most were a lot like "The Man Without A Country". They knew less about Africa and their civilization than they did about the US.

 

[TexasBred]

I didn't really get into posting on this topic but one thing bothered me mostly and thats the minority owned businesses. Minority owned businesses are at a disadvantage as well and all the gov't tries to do is help even the playing field. I can't speak on any other state but in Va. they encourage small minority or women owned businesses to bid on jobs. MIND YOU... THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE GUARANTEED TO GET THE JOBS YOU BID ON. In Va. I think some need to go back and check the wording because surely it can't say minority business bid only. If someone finds something that says that from the gov't im from missouri. The gov't gives a preference I think is the wording but not a guarantee. The same could be said about discrimination when jobs want veterans only... Just saying

https://eva.virginia.gov/library/files/swam/EO33.pdf

Sky a lot of gov't programs outwardly appear to be inviting to minorities whether by race, sex or even vets. but once you sit down at the desk they inundate you with requirements that basically insure that you ain't gonna be able to participate regardless.

 

[skyhightree1]

I didn't really get into posting on this topic but one thing bothered me mostly and thats the minority owned businesses. Minority owned businesses are at a disadvantage as well and all the gov't tries to do is help even the playing field. I can't speak on any other state but in Va. they encourage small minority or women owned businesses to bid on jobs. MIND YOU... THAT DOES NOT MEAN YOU ARE GUARANTEED TO GET THE JOBS YOU BID ON. In Va. I think some need to go back and check the wording because surely it can't say minority business bid only. If someone finds something that says that from the gov't im from missouri. The gov't gives a preference I think is the wording but not a guarantee. The same could be said about discrimination when jobs want veterans only... Just saying

https://eva.virginia.gov/library/files/swam/EO33.pdf

Sky a lot of gov't programs outwardly appear to be inviting to minorities whether by race, sex or even vets. but once you sit down at the desk they inundate you with requirements that basically insure that you ain't gonna be able to participate regardless.

That is very true as well. The state requires insurance that I don't need to have doing private work and If I carry that insurance all year and never get a state contract to warrant the extra $$ on insurance im just out of that $$ I understand what you are saying there.