auction

[msscamp]

You should be able to find an experienced cattle buyer at the auction that would be willing to buy what you want and sell them to you for a small (maybe $25-$50 a head) profit.
There would still be a bit of a gamble, but not as much as you buying them yourself.

Why would I want to pay someone a 'commission' when - if I've done my homework and found a good mentor - I can buy my own cattle at the salebarn and the only additional cost to me will be lunch for my friend?

:roll: msscamp,
This from your original reply to the posters question...

Cons:

What you see is what you get, and health problems/disease/infertility are not always apparent.

The possibility of bringing home something you would really rather not have - be it disease or the animal.

Just because someone raises cattle does not mean he/she has any scruples, and drugging wild/crazy/problem cattle has been known to happen.

The very real possibility of having to pen and haul said animal (not to mention repairing pens, fence, and who knows what else) back to the sale and absorb the loss when the drugs wear off and he/she goes ballistic.

No information on vaccinations, health programs, blood lines, problem calvers, bad mothers, etc.

The seller will not stand behind his/her cattle if a problem occurs.

Unless the cattle are guaranteed bred/open, it's strictly a buy them at your own risk situation.

Even if they ARE guaranteed bred, it's still pretty much a buy them at your own risk situation because you don't know what they were bred to.

Impossible to really determine their nature because they are in strange surroundings and have probably been hot-shotted and handled by inept people so they are good and riled up.

Pros and cons of private treaty - pretty much the opposite of everything I've listed, but add in the factor of a disreputable seller who is less than honest.

That's all I can think of at the moment, sorry.

_________________
Naturally if he had, or could find a good mentor that would do it for the price of a lunch that would be the way to go.

If not I don't think my idea would be out of reason.

Call me cheap but, assuming I could'nt find a good mentor, I would do a little research of a different kind and buy via private treaty. Commissions are not something I'm willing to pay.

 

[msscamp]

As a beginner I'd jump at the chance to get an expert to pick my cattle @ 1 or 2% of the sale price.
I wouldn't buy a house without getting it surveyed either. Not the same I know, but not too different.
regards

How does one determine who is truly an 'expert'? There are a lot of people out there that can talk the talk, but come up a bit short on walking the walk. I personally would rather take my chances than rely on someone else to choose my cattle for me - but I'm a bit independent and bull-headed. I am perfectly capable of doing the research, going into it with as much information as possible, making the best decisions I can, and any wrong decision will be a learning experience that I will NOT make a second time. Another factor to consider is that if I cannot choose a good cow vs a reject, I'm not ready for this in the first place and need to look elsewhere or re-think my plan. Plus, if I rely only on myself I know exactly who to blame if something goes wrong. Just my .02.

 

[auctionboy]

As a beginner I'd jump at the chance to get an expert to pick my cattle @ 1 or 2% of the sale price.
I wouldn't buy a house without getting it surveyed either. Not the same I know, but not too different.
regards

Why would you just go and bid $20 higher 2% of 1000 what you want. Unless the new to a auction person was affraid of getting bid up by the owner? It seems pretty simple if a group of 6 heifers comes threw and they are bidding .85 go bid .86. What is so hard? If you are exspecting to breed the heifers why don't worry about paying $100 to much after ten calfs it won't seem so bad. Everybody is so affraid of the auction, Why when you can watch the buyers and figure it out very quick would you pay them.

 

[auctionboy]

different levels of risk are exceptable for different people. I think if someone is serious about buying some heifers and making some money they should be interested enough to learn what a good heifer is. I'm not against someone starting out with a few heifers they pick and getting there feet wet. In a few years of having those cattle they could see if they really want to farm and learn about what they want. If they have no other option they could send me some pics and I could tell them what to buy. lol.

 

[backhoeboogie]

The consequence of buying a bad bull has been highlighted many times on this board. Same goes for heifers I guess.
regards

Sort of, but the bulls genes go into the entire herd. Most folks would never take a bull from a sale barn.

 

[msscamp]

Picking an "expert" may be harder than picking good cattle , but a good one can help take the $ting out of the learning curve. Even professional buyers will discuss the pros and cons of different lots with each other.

You're absolutely right, but the place to determine whether a particular person can assist you or not is not the sale barn - it is in their day to day operations, how their cattle perform, how many problems he/she has with them, and whether that person has the patience to correctly and thoroughly answer (please forgive me for this, but I've been where you are and I honestly believe it to be true) many questions that will seem dumb to him/her because he/she has probably been raising cattle long enough that they have forgotten what it was like to me new.

The consequence of buying a bad bull has been highlighted many times on this board.

I, personally, would never buy a bull at the salebarn.

Same goes for heifers I guess.
Paying a small premium to ensure the future of my herd is money well spent IMHO.

Even an "expert" can get caught with his/her pants down. There are no guarantees of anything when one buys through the barn - too many unscrupulous(sp?) people out there. Just my .02.

regards

 

[mnmtranching]

Order buying its called up here, you pay an expert to put together a bunch of cattle for you from 1 head to thousands.
You hire a guy to get you say 10 fancy black Angus open vacinated heifers and he will do a good job for you. Get a recommeded guy from the management of the auction co.
Best way to go if you don't know your stuff. I'm not saying its better then private treaty, but lots of high quality healthy animals are sold at public auction.

mnmt

 

[NOPLCLKNEB]

Here is my experience. I grew up on a cow-calf farm. I had never been in a sale barn until 4 years ago. I'm what some of you would call a hobby rancher, I into cattle because I love it and the last four years it has made me some money. My dad bought and sold all his cattle private treaty. When I bought my place it had nothing but some run down fences. I could'nt afford to buy cows and a bull, plus haying equipment, no hay anyway, no buildings to store it in, no shelter for winter ect. So I have over the last 4 years bought 4-500 lbs steer calves in the spring and sold them in the fall. I buy them at the local sale barn and sell them there to. (knock on wood) I have not lost one yet. Had some sick ones. Each year I add more good fence and usually get anouther piece of equipment with my profits, (used headgate, good corrall panels, ect.) When I told my dad my plan 4 years ago he said I was crazy to buy from the sale barn. Maybe I'm just lucky but it has worked for me. Now I know the local cattle producers and try to buy their cattle at the sales, and then I fill in the rest with some good looking, high risk steers. The single steer for sale that no one knows where it came from. Those are the ones you can make $300 on in 5 months of grazing, but they are also the high risk of having a problem.

I started real small and have learned (I think) a lot in the last four years, with much more to learn. The sale barn works great for me. I have a job that doesnt allow me to take much time off except in the winter. The local sale barn has sales on Sat afternoon and I can get all my calves bought in about 3 Saturdays. I then sell them all in one day in the fall.

It has gotten to the point that the same few cattle feeders come to buy my cattle in the fall and I think I get a better price due to the compitition.

My experience with sale barns has been good, but you could get screwed if you don't have any expericence or get to excited and buy something you don't really want.