AI for the rich and famous!!

[ENNOT]

There are several large operations that AI each year, commercial and registered. Lots of outfits in Idaho, Utah, Nevada, Oregon, Montana, California, Washington are using AI on all of their heifers each year to get accurate calving ease sires. This allows for alot of these females to marketable in large loads and allows top of the line genetics to be added to your herd. A guy not far from us bought 800 heifers last fall, ran them for the winter and Ai'd the whole bunch last fall. He averaged $1,200 on 600 this spring on the Western Video Market. Profitable, probably, but it was alot of work.

There is no way that you can say AI is not profitable in some sort. It may not be just the dollars, but you are also adding genetics to your herd from the best bulls available.

 

[S.R.R.]

I started this thread after reading through post after post on the BEGINNERS board about fancy cows and all the fancy bulls they were being AIed too. I have absolutely no problem with people that AI their cattle and more power to them for having the time, money ect. to do it! But......... along with the advent of AI and people with time and money to spare, we are starting to lose sight of the fact that there is a lot to be said for the cow/calf operation that is based on the fundamentals. Fundamentals that have been proven to work for hundreds of ranches over hundreds of years!!

When a person NEW to the cattle business logs on to the BEGINNERS board I do not want them going away thinking that to raise cattle you have to buy fancy cows and AI them to such and such fancy bull ect., ect. There is still such a thing as raising a herd of cross bred cows, culling the bad ones when needed, and buying good bulls to put on them.

I realize many will disagree but I believe AI has its place and that place is not in a large cow/calf operation! Yes maybe the day will come when we can force our cattle to come into heat at the same time and then force them to take with the first straw but it is not here yet and I personally hope it never comes!!

 

[KNERSIE]

I am a hereford breeder in SA that also run a commercial herd of straightbred herefords. In my purebred herd I go 100% AI and out of these AI sired calves I select bull for my own use in my commercial herd. This way I feel I can produce better bulls for my commercial herd than I can afford to buy.

Here the cost of AI (offcourse depending on the bull you use) over two seasons is very close to the price of a good breeding bull. Just a good breeding bull and by no means one of the top bulls available in the breed. In my purebred herd which is of good quality, but still a young herd and therefore not of the uniformity that I am hoping to achieve in the future, I don't think any one bull can meet my needs. I use 3 AI bulls on about 35 cows to match to different needs I feel I have to improve on. Now AI may be time consuming and expensive, but it would be unaffordable to to buy 3 or 4 different top bulls to match my cows to a more ideal mating, even if I could still use those bulls on the commercial cows.

In my opinion you will reach the ceiling of herd improvement soon if you don't use AI. Any breeder will at some time reach the point where the type of bull that could improve his herd would be just too expensive to make economical sense. This is where the selective use of AI can benefit every herd in the world.

 

[dun]

I started this thread after reading through post after post on the BEGINNERS board about fancy cows and all the fancy bulls they were being AIed too.

I believe thta the reason that AI is frequently recommended on the beginners board particularly is the simple reason that it is a beginners forum. Someon without the basic knowledge of care and management of cows doesn't need the added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
You're mixing apples and oranges when you talk about people just starting out and people with a couple hundred head.

dun

 

[aplusmnt]

I started this thread after reading through post after post on the BEGINNERS board about fancy cows and all the fancy bulls they were being AIed too.

I believe thta the reason that AI is frequently recommended on the beginners board particularly is the simple reason that it is a beginners forum. Someon without the basic knowledge of care and management of cows doesn't need the added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
You're mixing apples and oranges when you talk about people just starting out and people with a couple hundred head.

dun

Also it seems a lot of the times the people everyone recommends to A.I. instead of a bull is because they have 1-5 cows or heifers they want to breed. So many times there has been recommendations to not worry about a bull it would be more economical not to use one.

 

[S.R.R.]

I started this thread after reading through post after post on the BEGINNERS board about fancy cows and all the fancy bulls they were being AIed too.

I believe thta the reason that AI is frequently recommended on the beginners board particularly is the simple reason that it is a beginners forum. Someon without the basic knowledge of care and management of cows doesn't need the added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
You're mixing apples and oranges when you talk about people just starting out and people with a couple hundred head.

dun

Also it seems a lot of the times the people everyone recommends to A.I. instead of a bull is because they have 1-5 cows or heifers they want to breed. So many times there has been recommendations to not worry about a bull it would be more economical not to use one.

Yes you are right it seems to be a fault of mine that I regularly forget many of the members of these boards are hobby farmers with only a few head for fun, my bad.

Lets see if you two are right. I will start a poll to see how many people that are getting into cattle plan to make money off them by raising more then just a few. Should be interesting!

 

[Scotty]

What is your problem with people that do not have several hundred head of cattle that are just asking questions to better themselves. I can understand a beef with those that know it all and try to pretend to know it all.

 

[S.R.R.]

What is your problem with people that do not have several hundred head of cattle that are just asking questions to better themselves. I can understand a beef with those that know it all and try to pretend to know it all.

I said MY BAD that means I took responsibility for having forgot! You are reading it wrong I was not trying to imply that there is anything wrong with anybody!

 

[Scotty]

What is your problem with people that do not have several hundred head of cattle that are just asking questions to better themselves. I can understand a beef with those that know it all and try to pretend to know it all.

I said MY BAD that means I took responsibility for having forgot! You are reading it wrong I was not trying to imply that there is anything wrong with anybody!

OK.

 

[S.R.R.]

added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
dun

In a way dun you are proving my point! Why do we talk as if owning a bull is nothing but trouble and that the hay he eats is some how a waste?? Buying and owning bulls has been the norm for hundreds of years. If you wanted to raise cattle you bought a bull.

Don't you feel that if you had cattle for years but never owned a bull you would be missing out on a large part of the whole ranching experience?? I don't know about you but bull buying time around here it is one of the "fun times" of ranching!!

 

[badroute]

I dont know SRR, the last bull sale I went to I came home $15000 poorer and only had 5 bulls to show for it. That's not exactly my idea of fun, except for the open bar after the sale, that was fun.

But your right it is a nice time to bs with other guys that I only see a handful of times a year.

 

[dun]

added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
dun

In a way dun you are proving my point! Why do we talk as if owning a bull is nothing but trouble and that the hay he eats is some how a waste?? Buying and owning bulls has been the norm for hundreds of years. If you wanted to raise cattle you bought a bull.

Don't you feel that if you had cattle for years but never owned a bull you would be missing out on a large part of the whole ranching experience?? I don't know about you but bull buying time around here it is one of the "fun times" of ranching!!

We've only been doing this for 40 some odd years and this is the first year we've owned a bull. We used a bull on the partner cows in the canyons though. I don;t think I missed the great experience of owning a bull. But I know we've generated some awfully good cows/heifers/steers over the years.

dun

 

[Scotty]

If I may. The main reason I use AI is it did not take long to figure out if you want to sell bulls to comercial cattlemen you had to have the name brand, top of the line AI bulls. Not all, but most around my area know the names of top sires. Marketing bulls every year I am asked" Is this an AI sire or natural? Most of them sell first. Ususally the biggest in the pen sells first. MY 2 cents.

 

[aplusmnt]

added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
dun

Buying and owning bulls has been the norm for hundreds of years. If you wanted to raise cattle you bought a bull.

For hundreds of years the norm was to use Mules, oxen and horses to plow the fields. Than along came a tractor. I guess you would still be doing things the old way that was the norm for hundreds of years huh, tell you what I got a couple mules I will trade for a good tractor so you can be old school rancher ;-)

A.I. is the future, might work for you might not, some will make money doing it some will loose money doing it, much like guys with bulls loose sometimes and make money other times. And yes their is times that A.I. is cheaper and probably a better business plan than owning a bull.

 

[S.R.R.]

added headaches of dealing with the unpredictability of bulls. Alos, a bull will eat feed that could be better run through a cow to generate income in the form of a calf.
dun

In a way dun you are proving my point! Why do we talk as if owning a bull is nothing but trouble and that the hay he eats is some how a waste?? Buying and owning bulls has been the norm for hundreds of years. If you wanted to raise cattle you bought a bull.

Don't you feel that if you had cattle for years but never owned a bull you would be missing out on a large part of the whole ranching experience?? I don't know about you but bull buying time around here it is one of the "fun times" of ranching!!

We've only been doing this for 40 some odd years and this is the first year we've owned a bull.
dun

Now I understand! dun you do not know what you are missing!! Bulls are a big part of the whole cow/calf operation and I can see now how you have missed out on one of the enjoyable parts of ranching. Glad to hear you have bought a bull this year how about a pic??

 

[C HOLLAND]

How much does he get for them?

Of course it depends on the year and the demand, but I would say he gets as much as many purebred herds are getting for theirs.

I wouldn't think the regular cattleman is buying them then????

We WILD,,,,,We have a replacement cow sale in my area every month and bred heifers AI to good quality Angus bulls always bring $1,250-$1,400 each, some have a calf on the ground and some are 6-8 months bred. Some of the biggest cattle producers in my area usually buy several trailer loads at each sale, and he is a commercial producer only. (he runs over 1500 head)

I plan to supply him with several next year and have an agreement to sell right off the farm. GOOD quality bred heifers continue to sell very good, even with the hay shortage here.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Call them heinz 57 and look down your purebred nose at me, but we are alive and well. Boone

I think they had already had to much to drink. I couldn't understand their post.

Wewild, I totally understood exactly what Boone meant.

My family was driving cows to New Orleans, long before there were trail drives north out of Texas. They've even got my family history with cattle on the internet. For 7 generations back we were cattlemen in Texas. Hence, Boone's statements make perfect sense to me.

One the other AI subject:

They are punching gas wells on my East Texas property right now. They are about to punch 6 Barnett Shale gas wells on the property the wife inherited. I probably could liquidate some investments and go out right now and buy 2,000 head if I wanted. Retire and enjoy the gas nickels. So if anyone calls me a "hobby farmer" I don't really care. I can make more money on 160 acres of river bottom coastal hay right now, sell0ing hay. I am doing better farming this year than a whole bunch of full time cattlemen in this area. Since the drought has me down to 10 cows and a bull, I am buildng back up on my part time hobby venture. I bought some heifers this very week. The appear to be pure bred brangus but I have no proof.

Deep down inside I am a cattlemen and I don't have anything to prove, and frankly, I am not much worried about it. Call me any "hobby" insulting name you so choose. The truth doesn't hurt at all.

I am totally ignorant to AI. It is something dealing with cattle that I have never experienced. I enjoy the infomative posts in that regard.

In 8 years I will be 55 and eligible for early retirement from my engineering job. I may go full time then. It makes more sense to do it then rather than now. Maybe I will AI a little too, who knows. In the meantime, I will enjoy informative posts and laugh at the hobby farmer insults.

 

[dac1]

you know from all of the post on here i understand the ai school of thought but we always use a bull to breed our cows maybe old school but it seems like on here if you can't tell people on this board what kind of pure bred cows you are breeding this or that you are behind time so you can't say anything on these boards i think thats why so many folks don't have comments on here thats why i dont ask many questions on the boards .

 

[NamVet_Farmer44]

I tried AI a time or two with a few cows from my herd, wasn't such a big fan of it, but I did get a few good heifers from it though

 

[S.R.R.]

you know from all of the post on here i understand the ai school of thought but we always use a bull to breed our cows maybe old school but it seems like on here if you can't tell people on this board what kind of pure bred cows you are breeding this or that you are behind time so you can't say anything on these boards i think thats why so many folks don't have comments on here thats why i dont ask many questions on the boards .

:nod: :clap: That is the point I have been trying to make!!