Whole herd infertile?
- Thread starter Rookie Rancher
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Rookie Rancher
Active member
I had the vet check her Monday at 8am and she said there was definitely something in there, but that it wasn't in the birth canal yet and she couldn't tell yet which way it was positioned. Do I need to have her checked again, or just wait? The vet said she didn't detect any movement in the calf. By my estimation the heifer is 17 months old now, maybe 18. I hope she's not aborting. I'm tired, but would sure like some reward at the end of this. If my heifers all calve so early, will they be OK for future use as cows? I've seen people on the board talk about damaging them, but I don't really know what they mean or what to look for.
Rookie Rancher":2pk5rofx said:
If the heifer has had something sticking out of her for two hours or more, call the vet and tell her what's going on.
If they're able to have the calf, they'll probably be ok as cows, though they will likely be slower to rebreed because of the stress. It can be a problem if they require a C-section. And they'll need plenty to eat. They're babies themselves, still growing and building their bones, etc, and now nursing a calf.
This must be discouraging for you. I hope things get better.
Jeanne - Simme Valley
Well-known member
First, yes they could all be bred. That goes back to the honesty of the breeder/seller.
Second, if I remember correctly, you Lutalysed all these heifers trying to get them to cycle.
Hate to tell you this, but that shot could have aborted any fetus or killed the fetus.
When the vet was there, did you tell her you gave a Lut shot? Did you ask her to palpate the others? Didn't the vet offer any hints what to do next? With the Lut shot, & the vet saying she didn't feel movement, there's a possibility that the calf is dead. I would ask the vet what to do next, if anything, and have her palpate ALL the other heifers, so you know what you are dealing with. And, be sure to tell her that they got a shot of LUT & tell her what the date was.
Second, if I remember correctly, you Lutalysed all these heifers trying to get them to cycle.
Hate to tell you this, but that shot could have aborted any fetus or killed the fetus.
When the vet was there, did you tell her you gave a Lut shot? Did you ask her to palpate the others? Didn't the vet offer any hints what to do next? With the Lut shot, & the vet saying she didn't feel movement, there's a possibility that the calf is dead. I would ask the vet what to do next, if anything, and have her palpate ALL the other heifers, so you know what you are dealing with. And, be sure to tell her that they got a shot of LUT & tell her what the date was.
TexasBred
Well-known member
First post was 3/26 and cattle had already received lutalyse injection. That's 3 weeks ago.
Rookie Rancher
Active member
Well, the collective wisdom of 2 vets was bring her in so I did and found out that she had already passed the calf and was working on passing the many pieces of placenta. I had her in a 2 acre field that had been freshly mowed and was fenced to keep in sheep. I paced that field up and down more than once to make sure I hadn't missed it. My guess is she delivered in between my checking on her during the night and the coyotes got in somehow and dragged it off. Anyhow, she's OK. No damage according to the vet.
Now the dilema of the rest of the herd. I've got the AI man coming back on Sunday to preg check all of them. I'll take MilkMaid's advice and have him check the ovaries while he's at it. I sure never planned all this, but I'll be awfully glad to get some sleep tonight.
Now the dilema of the rest of the herd. I've got the AI man coming back on Sunday to preg check all of them. I'll take MilkMaid's advice and have him check the ovaries while he's at it. I sure never planned all this, but I'll be awfully glad to get some sleep tonight.
Rookie Rancher
Active member
The AI man came out and checked all 10 heifers. All 10 were open. 3 were said to be mature with developed ovaries. He was surprised that were not cycling. Or they are and not getting marked. 1 miscaried, and the other 6 he said were not mature (small ovaries). This is really surprising to me given their ages 16-18 months.
The buzzards finally showed up a week later to show us where the miscarried calf was. It appeared fully developed out of a 16 month heifer.
Now is decision time... Do I feed them a whole other year in order to have them on the calving schedule I want (early fall) or sell them and buy other replacements before breeding time?
Thanks to all gave your input. It was most helpful! :tiphat:
The buzzards finally showed up a week later to show us where the miscarried calf was. It appeared fully developed out of a 16 month heifer.
Now is decision time... Do I feed them a whole other year in order to have them on the calving schedule I want (early fall) or sell them and buy other replacements before breeding time?
Thanks to all gave your input. It was most helpful! :tiphat:
bigbull338
Well-known member
the 1s with small overies need tobe sent to the packers.no need in spending an losing more money on them.the other 4 id try to get bred.
#1 question is if your tech knows what he's doing. As my signature line says... your decisions are only as good as the information you base them on. Would he know what a cycling heifer felt like, or not? so I'm told, some AI techs have no idea what happens or is normal beyond the cervix, since that's as far as they have to go when AI'ing.
What type of mineral program did you say your heifers were on? it seems unusual that only 30% of your herd would be normal and cycling, and the rest of them have major problems. I'd take into consideration the skill level of your AI tech and the mineral program for your heifers before you do any culling.
Run a search on the boards for "infantile reproductive tracts" too... I had 2 heifers last spring with underdeveloped reproductive tracts compared to their contemporaries, and another 2 months, dose of MultiMin, and both cycled and settled.
What type of mineral program did you say your heifers were on? it seems unusual that only 30% of your herd would be normal and cycling, and the rest of them have major problems. I'd take into consideration the skill level of your AI tech and the mineral program for your heifers before you do any culling.
Run a search on the boards for "infantile reproductive tracts" too... I had 2 heifers last spring with underdeveloped reproductive tracts compared to their contemporaries, and another 2 months, dose of MultiMin, and both cycled and settled.
Rookie Rancher
Active member
milkmaid":2cviaj1v said:
I sure hope so. That's what I'm paying him for. He AI's for the local large animal vet as well as number of farmers I know. Everyone seems to trust him. As far as minerals go, I've been feeding loose minerals free choice all you can eat since the fall. I bought Vigortone (I think) It's what all the local cattleman put out according to the feedstore owner. I agree somethings not right here. Only 2 indicate having cycled out of 10. I think at this point I'm going to hang onto them. Spring is here and I have more grass than they could eat for a long time. Hanging onto them shouldn't cost me anymore money until next Nov./Dec. or later if I stockpile the grass.
novatech
Well-known member
Do these heifers share any genetic blood line? If so, they could all be late maturing, or share something in their genetic make up that is contributing to this.
Do all the heifers seem to be the nervous type? Nervous cattle do not lend themselves to AI very well. When you work them through the pens is it done calmly? Heifers selected for AI should be trained early to work through the chutes. One bad apple in the bunch can get the rest of them screwed up when it comes to nervousness. I have seen cattle go from standing heat completely shutting down their cycle in mid stream because of nerves. These same cattle breed just fine when placed with a bull.
No matter what the cause is this trait something you want to pass along by continuing to try and AI them?
Do all the heifers seem to be the nervous type? Nervous cattle do not lend themselves to AI very well. When you work them through the pens is it done calmly? Heifers selected for AI should be trained early to work through the chutes. One bad apple in the bunch can get the rest of them screwed up when it comes to nervousness. I have seen cattle go from standing heat completely shutting down their cycle in mid stream because of nerves. These same cattle breed just fine when placed with a bull.
No matter what the cause is this trait something you want to pass along by continuing to try and AI them?
Rookie Rancher
Active member
#1-7 have the same dad. #8-10 share GAR Gridmaker as their daddy. #8-10 have been at the bottom of the pecking order since I put them together and they have grown the slowest and consequently were the least immature of the group. #6 was the one that ovulated. #5 was the one that miscaried.
None of them are nervous. They'll come up and just about eat out of my hand. They've been walking out the chute everyday after feeding. I don't use a stick, hot shot, or even yell. Usually I can move them where they need to go just by positioning without even shooing them.
As far as causes go I'm still not sure what the deal is, but we havn't even gotten to AI yet. It won't cost me anything to give them some more time, so that's what I'm leaning toward.
None of them are nervous. They'll come up and just about eat out of my hand. They've been walking out the chute everyday after feeding. I don't use a stick, hot shot, or even yell. Usually I can move them where they need to go just by positioning without even shooing them.
As far as causes go I'm still not sure what the deal is, but we havn't even gotten to AI yet. It won't cost me anything to give them some more time, so that's what I'm leaning toward.
I have a couple question after reading through this thread.
Those with knowledge of the AI process:
Are AI tech's trained to look for pregnancy after administration?
Would any kind of check be done before drugs and such to be sure each was ready?
Would he not have noticed one was already pregnant BEFORE going ahead?
Those with knowledge of the AI process:
Are AI tech's trained to look for pregnancy after administration?
Would any kind of check be done before drugs and such to be sure each was ready?
Would he not have noticed one was already pregnant BEFORE going ahead?
Irishred":16wur998 said:
AI techs are not routinely trained for preg checking. Don;t understand the "adminstration" part.
Depends on the drug and what is wanted to be accomplished.
Depends on how advanced the pregnancy is. Also depends on if he cared or not
TexasBred
Well-known member
Irish...a good AI tech SHOULD have noticed the difference almost the minute he put his arm up the rectum of the cow. BUT, when someone comes to AI only, that's about all he has on his mind. You tell him they're open and ready to breed and he takes your word for it and does his thing.
Red Bull Breeder
Well-known member
I was taught to check before you give the shot, its a little late to check after you give the lut.
