Whole herd infertile?

[Red Bull Breeder]

I would guess they are cycling and you are not catching them. i have saw cows riding and not set of the kamar patchs, and seen them walking under a tree limb and turn them red. If you have a yearling bull calf that is not old enough to breed them put him with them he will catch every one of them.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I totally agree with MM. First, you need to understand the "timing process" of Lut. "IF" they are in the right time frame to have a CL, than you should see standing heat 2-4 days after the shot. But, without a vet palpating them, you don't even know if they are actually cycling.
And, by the way, if you were giving the two shot system, the 2nd shot should be give 11 days after the first.
Also, did you place the K-Mar patches in the right place? If they are too far forward, they can be ridden to death, and the patch won't be compressed to break the red dye capsule.
As far as them stopping what they are doing because they expect you to feed them, you need to observe them longer. If you spend 1/2 hour with them, they will get bored and go back to what they were doing. Also, you need to observe when they are NOT being fed.
Pictures would be nice, but looking at them can't tell you what's going on inside - a vet can!

 

[dun]

Also, you need to observe when they are NOT being fed.

If I'm pressed for time, I'll bring them all up and only give them a very small amount of grain. That gets them all together and when the finish and start to drift away if there is any heat activity they'll usually show it in some way.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Dun wrote

when the finish and start to drift away if there is any heat activity they'll usually show it in some way

Yes, that's the thing, you have to WAIT & observe. Can't watch & expect to see anything while they are eating.

 

[TexasBred]

I would guess they are cycling and you are not catching them. i have saw cows riding and not set of the kamar patchs, and seen them walking under a tree limb and turn them red. If you have a yearling bull calf that is not old enough to breed them put him with them he will catch every one of them.

Best system I've found as well RB. :clap:

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

I don't want to put up with a gomer and i always have a few yearling bulls around TB they sure make great heat detecters.

 

[TexasBred]

I don't want to put up with a gomer and i always have a few yearling bulls around TB they sure make great heat detecters.

RB absolutely. For whatever reason sometimes my cattle don't seem to want to do much riding. But have one little 5-6 month old bull calf out there and he'll tell you who's in heat, when she's standing and when she quits standing. Very important is you AI everything. And he's free and 100% accurate.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Hopefully you guys run a commercial herd. As a buyer, I sure wouldn't be interested in purchasing PB offspring from a herd that used a YEARLING as a heat detector. Whether they are "supposed" to be able to breed or not - mistakes do happen - and with a YEARLING, I would suspect they were getting their fair share of girls pregnant.
And if the YEARLINGS were in such poor growth that you are THAT confident they COULDN'T get anything bred, then, again, I wouldn't be interested in anything out of that kind of a program.
Even in a grass program, yearlings have the possibility of getting cows settled.
People all around the country depend on YEARLING BULLS as their source of a breeding bull.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Maybe i should have said 7 to 10 month old calves instead of yearlings. But i did say not big enough to breed. Have not had one to breed a cow yet. But it could happen. But in the rookie ranchers case he would no his heifers were cycling.

 

[brandonm_13]

I had a wild theory(that is until you said you saw some riding each other), but since they are heifers, have they ever made it to their first heat cycle yet? I would think with their age they would have but... With the tubs and mineral, I wouldn't think it was a mineral deficiency, but I would probably consider adding some SBM or CSM, and switching to a repro mineral.

Other than that, there is a chance the Lutalyse isn't any good anymore. If he was recommended, I doubt if he left the container where it got too hot/cold/or was empty and filled with another substance like antibiotic, but who knows. The cows should probably be cycling on their own anyway, unless they are already bred, and good lutalyse should have made at least a couple of them abort.

 

[TexasBred]

Hopefully you guys run a commercial herd. As a buyer, I sure wouldn't be interested in purchasing PB offspring from a herd that used a YEARLING as a heat detector. Whether they are "supposed" to be able to breed or not - mistakes do happen - and with a YEARLING, I would suspect they were getting their fair share of girls pregnant.
And if the YEARLINGS were in such poor growth that you are THAT confident they COULDN'T get anything bred, then, again, I wouldn't be interested in anything out of that kind of a program.
Even in a grass program, yearlings have the possibility of getting cows settled.
People all around the country depend on YEARLING BULLS as their source of a breeding bull.

I think I said 5-6 month old bull calves. They are running with 1400 lb. registered brangus cattle. We watch them constantly. They can't even start to breed a cow. All they have going for them is the "want to". The "can do" will come at a later date and when they are at least old enough to "show off" their equipment. Right now they can't even do this. I assure you there is no chance of one breeding a cow. And their growth is exceptional for their age. They're still sucking their mothers. But in time they will be great little registered bulls. Better than any heat detection patch ever made. :lol:

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Texasbred - I totally agree. We AI everything & when it's getting into the last 1/2 of our 60 day breeding, I KNOW which little guys are my spotters (some may actually be steers) & I check out what they are doing. I had trouble with the posts to use a YEARLING bull. That's a whole different ball game. If the guy wanted to natural breed, that's different, but he was trying to AI. Nothing like sticking semen in a female that MAY have been "poked" by a bull. :shock:

 

[TexasBred]

Texasbred - I totally agree. We AI everything & when it's getting into the last 1/2 of our 60 day breeding, I KNOW which little guys are my spotters (some may actually be steers) & I check out what they are doing. I had trouble with the posts to use a YEARLING bull. That's a whole different ball game. If the guy wanted to natural breed, that's different, but he was trying to AI. Nothing like sticking semen in a female that MAY have been "poked" by a bull. :shock:

Gotcha ;-) ;-)

 

[Brandonm22]

If the AI guy says feed them 5lbs of feed per head per day and since he has seen them and I haven't, my recommendation would be to do it. You already have enough money in these heifers, that another $200 isn't going to hurt much.

 

[TexasBred]

Jeanne, I think a lot of us use the word "yearling" sort of carelessly. Around here I here folks talking about yearlings and they might weight from 200 lbs. to 1000 and be well over a year old. lol. Used more as slang I think than anything else.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

TxB - I understand. Just did NOT want to give this guy incorrect info. A "calf" can be a great spotter, a "yearling" can be a great BREEDER!

 

[TexasBred]

:lol2: :lol2: You are absolutely correct :clap: :clap:

 

[Rookie Rancher]

Well, I've been feeding the 5 lbs./head/day and the girls are fattening up. The green grass is helping some too I think. Still only one of them has had her sticker show a sign of heat. Sunday, I noticed #5's udder looked half full and all her teats were full, tail half raised, back end saggy, peeing and pooping every 5 minutes. All these heifers were supposed to be open when I bought them. I've gone back to my calendar to do some checking for the last moment that they could have seen a bull. 3 of them were 9months old when I picked them up from their previous owner. 7 heifers were an estimated 11-12 months old when I got them. Is it possible that all these angus heifers but one of them could be bred that early? I guess I need to get the vet over to check all of them. In the meantime, I've spent 2 nights in a row watching one of the smallest heifers try and give birth. Right now all I can see is a foot long white/yellow thick string hanging out the back. How much longer do you think we have to go?

 

[Frankie]

Yes, it's possible they're bred. We just had a seven month old Angus heifer cycle. I noticed yesterday morning that she was laying at the fence across from a bull. But I looked and didn't see a discharge, so went on my way. That evening she was taking rides from the other heifers. I'm all for early fertility, but she's going to cycle many times before we breed her. If one of your heifers has been in labor for two days, you need to get the vet over and check her now.

 

[TexasBred]

Rookie it's not only possible but also very probable they are bred if there was a breeding age bull running with them. My heifers begin cycleing around the 9 month period but don't breed them til much older. Not much you can do now other than maybe have a vet or someone else to pregnancy test them to set your mind at ease. Keep a close eye on them.