Whole Corn start to finish - any thoughts?

[farmwife]

Anyone have any experience feeding whole corn (along with protein supplement) for commercial steers from start (700#) to finish (1200#)?

 

[TexasBred]

Anyone have any experience feeding whole corn (along with protein supplement) for commercial steers from start (700#) to finish (1200#)?

There are a lot of folks on here that do it if you're referring simply to "whole" corn. Personally I prefer the cracked corn but either will do you a good job. You'll still need to get some roughage into them as well.

 

[ChrisB]

That is how I finish mine (whole shelled corn & protein pellets). I start out with about 1% of their body weight and work up to full feed over a 3 week period. I start with good hay and after maxing out on corn I start switching over to cornstalk bales or hay that isn't fit for cows. If the hay is too good they get too fat. I finish heifers at 1300-1350 lbs. and steers about 1400-1450.

 

[snafuer]

what is the rate of gain with the whole corn and at what weight are the calves when you start feeding
Mark

 

[JustSimmental]

I have been doing it for years.
1. With a PTO mix mill, I put the large screen in and run half the corn first.
2. Then run half the coarse hay
3. Then add the 32% Supp in the side hopper + 50 lbs all purpose mineral.
4. Then run the rest of the corn
5. Then run the rest of the coarse hay
6. I let it mix for about 15 minutes.


1200 lbs Corn = 97.2 TP
400 lbs coarse hay = 12 TP
400 lbs 32% Supp = 128 TP
50 lbs All Purpose Mineral

97.2 + 12.0 + 128 = 237.2
237.2/2000 = 11.9% ration
I start steers out gradually and work them up to a full ration over two weeks.
Gains vary from 3.00 to close to 4.50

 

[TexasBred]

What is the 32% supplement??

 

[JustSimmental]

Protein Supplements -- Dry
Dry Feedlot Product Cattle grower 32 (Purina)
Protein 32%
(Min %) NPN 16%
(Max %) Fat 1.5%
(Min %) Fiber 20%
(Max %) Ca 3.5%
(Avg %) P 0.80%
(Min %) Salt 4.00%
(Avg %)
Potassium 1.00%
(Min %)
Selenium 1.00%
(Min ppm)
Vit A
(Min IU/lb) 30,000

http://cattle.purinamills.com/OurProducts/GrowFinishFeedlot/default.aspx

JustSimms

What is the 32% supplement??

 

[TexasBred]

Looks like the supplement has adequate vitamin/mineral supplementation. You can save yourself $25 a ton by leaving out the bag of mineral you're adding to your mix. Otherwise that mix should do the job for you. Is that coarse hay really only 3% Crude Protein?

 

[JustSimmental]

I always put a bag of all purpose mineral in a ton of feed. Mineral is cheap enough when you buy it on a ton basis--- anyway.... yes 3% CP hay that is course will go through the mix mill better using the big screen. All I want from the coarse hay is a source of roughage because when finishing calves you must keep the rumen active and most recommend 20% roughage-- works for me.
I dont use the higher % CP supplement because of potential acidosis problems (feed is too hot) and 32% is good enough.

I think you will still have a 5-6:1 (lbs of feed fed: to pound of gain) no matter what you do and this has worked for me for 30 years.

Thanks,

JustSimms

Looks like the supplement has adequate vitamin/mineral supplementation. You can save yourself $25 a ton by leaving out the bag of mineral you're adding to your mix. Otherwise that mix should do the job for you. Is that coarse hay really only 3% Crude Protein?

 

[TexasBred]

I always put a bag of all purpose mineral in a ton of feed. Mineral is cheap enough when you buy it on a ton basis--- anyway.... yes 3% CP hay that is course will go through the mix mill better using the big screen. All I want from the coarse hay is a source of roughage because when finishing calves you must keep the rumen active and most recommend 20% roughage-- works for me.
I dont use the higher % CP supplement because of potential acidosis problems (feed is too hot) and 32% is good enough.

I think you will still have a 5-6:1 (lbs of feed fed: to pound of gain) no matter what you do and this has worked for me for 30 years

I guess if it works no need to change even if change could make more money. If the extra minerals are not needed they'll just pass thru as will the excess protein. Acidosis is caused by starches (grain <corn>) not protein. "Hot feed" is feed that is high in calories, not protein.

 

[novaman]

I'm trying to figure out why one would use 3% protein hay. Heck I didn't even think it could get that low. Most of my straw tests out at 4%. Why not use a higher protein hay in your ration and cut back on expensive protein supplements? You will save lots of money by using a lower inclusion of supplements.

 

[TexasBred]

I'm trying to figure out why one would use 3% protein hay. Heck I didn't even think it could get that low. Most of my straw tests out at 4%. Why not use a higher protein hay in your ration and cut back on expensive protein supplements? You will save lots of money by using a lower inclusion of supplements.

Absolutely. I agree on the 20% roughage but digestible fiber and higher energy is more preferable and although more expensive if purchased still gives you more bang for your buck. If that amount of hay was 10-12% protein you could definitely cut back on the protein supplement, justify the bag of mineral being added and end up with a higher quality feed giving more gain for less cost or at least save enough to pay for the cost of one pound of Rumensin-90 for the mix to really get'em going. ;-)

 

[Wyzona]

Have two questions. Sometimes in Arizona you hit a spell where you need to pull some calves off of their cows early because of drought and the cows body condition. Question, if you had to mix a ration to feed some 2 to 3 month old calves what would you suggest as a ration. Second question, what would you creep feed calves still nursing to help rumen development, in anticipation of early weaning.

 

[Texas PaPaw]

Have two questions. Sometimes in Arizona you hit a spell where you need to pull some calves off of their cows early because of drought and the cows body condition. Question, if you had to mix a ration to feed some 2 to 3 month old calves what would you suggest as a ration. Second question, what would you creep feed calves still nursing to help rumen development, in anticipation of early weaning.

Not sure what ingredients are available in your area. I buy 2-300# salebarn calves and feed them a 50/50 blend of corn gluten feed and soy hulls. others feed a 40% ddg 60% soy hull blend. With both of these a little roughage is needed. Mine have either grass or hay. There are a number of byproduct feeds that can be cost effective for these little guys. In your situation, with grass being scarce, you could topdress the byproducts with 1-2# whole cottonseed daily. This would give the roughage needed along with a lot of energy & protein. Have found the little guys are extremely feed efficient and grow like fertilized weeds on a good ration.

Here's a link to the OSU ration spreadsheet that I use:

://www.ansi.okstate.edu/software/

I use the 3rd sheet from the top. This will allow you to simulate scenarios using the various feed ingredients available in your area to come up with the most economical mix. Be sure to download the instructions also.

Hope this is helpful.

 

[c farmer]

Yhis might be a dumb question but I didnt think cows could digest whole corn.I thought it had to be cracked.

 

[TexasBred]

Have two questions. Sometimes in Arizona you hit a spell where you need to pull some calves off of their cows early because of drought and the cows body condition. Question, if you had to mix a ration to feed some 2 to 3 month old calves what would you suggest as a ration. Second question, what would you creep feed calves still nursing to help rumen development, in anticipation of early weaning.

Do you plan to mix your own feed? If so I'd probably put me together a mix using cracked corn, cottonseed hulls, cottonseed meal or distillers grain and shoot for about 16% crude protein. The same mix would work in a creep feeder. The hulls will give it "bulk" and hold down consumption some and also keep the rumen healthy.

If you plan to buy feed a good commercial grower ration.

 

[Wyzona]

Have two questions. Sometimes in Arizona you hit a spell where you need to pull some calves off of their cows early because of drought and the cows body condition. Question, if you had to mix a ration to feed some 2 to 3 month old calves what would you suggest as a ration. Second question, what would you creep feed calves still nursing to help rumen development, in anticipation of early weaning.

Not sure what ingredients are available in your area. I buy 2-300# salebarn calves and feed them a 50/50 blend of corn gluten feed and soy hulls. others feed a 40% ddg 60% soy hull blend. With both of these a little roughage is needed. Mine have either grass or hay. There are a number of byproduct feeds that can be cost effective for these little guys. In your situation, with grass being scarce, you could topdress the byproducts with 1-2# whole cottonseed daily. This would give the roughage needed along with a lot of energy & protein. Have found the little guys are extremely feed efficient and grow like fertilized weeds on a good ration.

Here's a link to the OSU ration spreadsheet that I use:

://www.ansi.okstate.edu/software/

I use the 3rd sheet from the top. This will allow you to simulate scenarios using the various feed ingredients available in your area to come up with the most economical mix. Be sure to download the instructions also.

Hope this is helpful.

Thank you theOSU Ration Spreadsheet will be alot of help.

 

[Wyzona]

Have two questions. Sometimes in Arizona you hit a spell where you need to pull some calves off of their cows early because of drought and the cows body condition. Question, if you had to mix a ration to feed some 2 to 3 month old calves what would you suggest as a ration. Second question, what would you creep feed calves still nursing to help rumen development, in anticipation of early weaning.

Do you plan to mix your own feed? If so I'd probably put me together a mix using cracked corn, cottonseed hulls, cottonseed meal or distillers grain and shoot for about 16% crude protein. The same mix would work in a creep feeder. The hulls will give it "bulk" and hold down consumption some and also keep the rumen healthy.

If you plan to buy feed a good commercial grower ration.

Thank You TexasBred, I do plan to mix my own feed, I am going to post another question as a new thred.

 

[dun]

Yhis might be a dumb question but I didnt think cows could digest whole corn.I thought it had to be cracked.

There is somehting like a 7% (don;t recall the exact %) between whole core and cracked and the same between cracked and ground. The paricles are just smaller with cracked so it isn;t as visible in the manure as whole corn.

 

[c farmer]

Makes sense, I see alot of whole kernals in the manure piles from our corn silage because the corn got a little hard before I got it chopped. I hope they are getting something out of it and not just passing it through.