what to breed to?

[Tman]

Did that information mean that 878 has no genes for marbeling? If so how well does it correlate in respect to the carcass discussion that we have been having?

Ollie, Been meaning to get back with you things have been hectic. What it means is Bon View New Design 878 is homozygous for Calpastatin gene and New Design 878 is heterozygous for the Calpastatin gene while niether one of these bulls carries the gene for Caplain.

Simply put they score this way, consider we are looking for the Calpastatin gene, the animal has the possiblity of having two copies. If the animal has no copies he gets a score of zero, if he has 1 copy then he is considered heterozygous and gets a score of 1 star, if he has 2 copies/homozygous then he gets 2 stars.

As mentioned above Bon View New Design 878 is homozygous (2Stars) so he has two copies of the Calpastatin gene.

I believe you are looking for a bull with 4 stars, homozygous for both Caplain and Calpastatin . Ideally you would cross this bull with a female who is also homozygous for both Caplain and Calpastatin thus making your odds of passing this trait to the offspring 100%.

Did this help or make it worse ?

 

[Tman]

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

 

[bwranch]

We've used 878 for some of our spring calvers. The calves are really growing well and I'm pleased so far. Guess we'll see what weaning time brings. We also had some really nice heifers and an outstanding bull calf last fall from Advantage. He's dead now but if you can find semen, it's another option and he's an excellent heifer bull. Anybody seen any calves out of War Alliance 9126?

 

[Dee]

I also have an alliance 2 year old, and will be AI'ing her to 878. Last year I used Pfred on heifers, and am impressed with his calves so far, except not alot of depth, but that may come with age? This year I am using PFred again, New Level, a few Objective, and I think I made a poor choice with some Strategy. I have heard from others that his calves seriously lack muscle. I looked hard at 4.8 also, but will wait and see what his #'s are next year. I kinda like Destination and Vision, but I like a framey cows, and Visions #'s for muscle are a little low too if I recall right.

 

[dun]

If you want frame use Northlander, as yearlings his calves are monsters.
The ones we had were about 50-55 lbs at birth.

dun

I also have an alliance 2 year old, and will be AI'ing her to 878. Last year I used Pfred on heifers, and am impressed with his calves so far, except not alot of depth, but that may come with age? This year I am using PFred again, New Level, a few Objective, and I think I made a poor choice with some Strategy. I have heard from others that his calves seriously lack muscle. I looked hard at 4.8 also, but will wait and see what his #'s are next year. I kinda like Destination and Vision, but I like a framey cows, and Visions #'s for muscle are a little low too if I recall right.

 

[ollie]

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

 

[Tod Dague]

There are more than one set of genes that influence Marb. This is why marb EPD's are a better tool than the Gene Marker for marb. I've seen bulls that were low marb. that were 2 stars for marb. And I've seen high marb bulls that were 0 stars for marb. If your breed of choice doesn't have EPD's for marb. or tenderness then the Gene Star is better than nothing.

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

 

[la4angus]

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

Ollie
The feeders are looking at %RP, REA, besides the marbling.
More meat to sell. Higher cutout.

 

[ollie]

There are more than one set of genes that influence Marb. This is why marb EPD's are a better tool than the Gene Marker for marb. I've seen bulls that were low marb. that were 2 stars for marb. And I've seen high marb bulls that were 0 stars for marb. If your breed of choice doesn't have EPD's for marb. or tenderness then the Gene Star is better than nothing.

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

Tod,
Your breed association propaganda is absolutely wrong. If I have a set of charolais cows that I am thinking about breeding to a angus bull and I want my calves to grade mid choice do you honestly think that there is a number value based on a expected progeny difference that would tell me which bull to use?" When we have all this actual data available ( carcass data , ultra sound , and actual kill data) why would we use epd's? If you disagree then tell me the correlation marbeling epd's to the target of mid choice. How many groups and progeny have been reported on 878 to the association compared to how many carcasses that Oldtimers friend has had. It is an amazement when we have real people with real data why some people use expected differences!

 

[ollie]

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

Ollie
The feeders are looking at %RP, REA, besides the marbling.
More meat to sell. Higher cutout.

I agree LA and they are probably considering the most profitable part of the equasion efficiency and feedability

 

[Tod Dague]

Are you saying the gene star is more accurate than EPD's that are based on actual kill data?
Do you believe that the gene analyzed by gene star is the only gene that affects marbling?
Will a 2 star bull always produce mid choise or better?

There are more than one set of genes that influence Marb. This is why marb EPD's are a better tool than the Gene Marker for marb. I've seen bulls that were low marb. that were 2 stars for marb. And I've seen high marb bulls that were 0 stars for marb. If your breed of choice doesn't have EPD's for marb. or tenderness then the Gene Star is better than nothing.

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

Tod,
Your breed association propaganda is absolutely wrong. If I have a set of charolais cows that I am thinking about breeding to a angus bull and I want my calves to grade mid choice do you honestly think that there is a number value based on a expected progeny difference that would tell me which bull to use?" When we have all this actual data available ( carcass data , ultra sound , and actual kill data) why would we use epd's? If you disagree then tell me the correlation marbeling epd's to the target of mid choice. How many groups and progeny have been reported on 878 to the association compared to how many carcasses that Oldtimers friend has had. It is an amazement when we have real people with real data why some people use expected differences!

 

[Anonymous]

I would look at Strategy for your heifer he is out of one of the top balanced trait calving ease cows in the breed. He has a super nice set of epds. I know the picture of him isn't great but I have seen some pictures of his daughters that look promising. His maternal brothers include Focus J30(full sib), the E161 sons that sold in Sydenstrickers fall sale, SAF Connection etc.

 

[Tman]

Ollie,

I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

I would have to agree 100%. The Genestar thing is relatively new, I have not been able to find EPD's on the ones that have all the genes we are interested in. If you any of the EPD's please let me know. To further agree with you if he only has one star, ones with all the stars theoritically should be off the charts.

 

[Tman]

Are you saying the gene star is more accurate than EPD's that are based on actual kill data?
Do you believe that the gene analyzed by gene star is the only gene that affects marbling?
Will a 2 star bull always produce mid choise or better?

There are more than one set of genes that influence Marb. This is why marb EPD's are a better tool than the Gene Marker for marb. I've seen bulls that were low marb. that were 2 stars for marb. And I've seen high marb bulls that were 0 stars for marb. If your breed of choice doesn't have EPD's for marb. or tenderness then the Gene Star is better than nothing.

Ollie,



I almost forgot, niether of the two bulls mentioned carry the gene identified for higher marbling.

Tman I enjoy your posts. With the bull not carrying the gene marker for marbeling and his calves in high demand by the feed lot , it makes you wonder .

Tod,
Your breed association propaganda is absolutely wrong. If I have a set of charolais cows that I am thinking about breeding to a angus bull and I want my calves to grade mid choice do you honestly think that there is a number value based on a expected progeny difference that would tell me which bull to use?" When we have all this actual data available ( carcass data , ultra sound , and actual kill data) why would we use epd's? If you disagree then tell me the correlation marbeling epd's to the target of mid choice. How many groups and progeny have been reported on 878 to the association compared to how many carcasses that Oldtimers friend has had. It is an amazement when we have real people with real data why some people use expected differences!

I would have to say I do not know as of yet. I have not been able to locate EPD's on the high scoring Genstar cattle as of yet. Also I would agree that simply picking a bull with all the right markers is only half of the equation. If the heifer does not have the same potential then you could have as low as a 25 % shot at it. My guess is that you need both male and female with all of the markers to determine whether or not this will work. Has anyone out their accomplished this yet that we know of ? The King Ranch is sure mulling over these genes pretty closely in the Santa Gertrudis and putting their money where their mouth is. My guess is it is a pretty safe gamble that you would hit the mark most of the time and I am looking for embryos that I can implant that have these characteristics.

 

[Anonymous]

Has anyone used Extra H6 out of the ABS catalog and if so how have the calves been. I have some calves on the ground out of a son of his and am wondering what to expect.