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thoughts I fell asleep to and woke up to...

rockridgecattle

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So I got to thinking today. I was on another web forum, and they have alot of religion and politics there. I pretty much stay away from that section cause it gets to "rowdy" for me. However there was a thread on the dollar collasping. Some of the things in the thread got me thinking.
Here are my thoughts and ponders

1. Our generation (I am in my 40's) and the previous generation and the one up and coming have never seen a world war. We have seen wars yes, but not a world war. Our countries (US and Canada) have fought in the Middle East yes, a war on terror. But so many are against these wars we find ourselves in. The "just" cause for most is not there.
2. Our veterans from the world wars are almost all gone. Gone then are the first hand accounts of when they fought in the wars. Now the up and coming generations, who, are against the wars we wage now, have no idea on the price our freedom cost. Some challenge the validity of the world wars; some even challenge validity of the holocaust...because there are few survivors left. All we have is stories in history books.
3. Our grandparents, and for some, our parents generation saw what the cost of many of the diseases that we now vaccinate for cost us in lost lives, pandemics, and those that did survive the disease, were left crippled, or worse. Disease like diphtheria; tetanus (lockjaw); pertussis (whooping cough);polio; rubella (German measles);measles (red measles); mumps; hepatitis B; and Haemophilus influenza type b disease.
Because these diseases are now, not of our time, we are raising a generation that seems to feel these vaccines are not warranted or needed so we are seeing a lot of children not vaccinated against these perils. Don’t get me wrong, freedom of choice to vaccinate or not, but how will this affect us later on down the road? Will we see a resurgence of these diseases we were once protected from?
4. A lot of our children, maybe not on this board, but all around the world, thinks that milk comes from cartons or jugs. Food comes from the grocery store. They have no concept of the beginning of food production. We are now raising a second generation who fight for animal rights; a generation who value animals above human life. We have a generation who does not know about raising their own food. Are going to end up starving ourselves because we have no idea how to raise our own food? Have we lost the ability to be self sustaining in the event of an economic collapse or some other catastrophe? I had this brain fart the other day. We said grace at the dinner table. We had one of those Kraft delicious pizzas. “bless the hands that prepared our food”…all I did was put it in the oven, cut and serve….but the host of people who had a hand in making the pizza was a lot…grain farmers, dairy, livestock producers, vegetable growers, sausage makers, cheese makers, flour producers, people who chopped everything, grated the cheese, the people who made the packaging, the one who packaged, the truck driver, the distributors of the product, the store clerks who stocked the shelves….and so on.

What is going to happen if our dollar does collapse? Where are these people going to find food if we have no monetary power to buy food? How will we protect our young from diseases that were once cured if we end up becoming like a third world nation? How do we not let history repeat itself if the generations who fought in the great wars are all dead, and no one can relive the history for us to remember, they become like fables and stories handed down and there is no real context to it any more?

Understand this in my ramblings. And I am not trying to start a debate with the people who do not vaccinate their children…
…It’s just we do not have the first hand account of what happened to our nations that brought about the changes like life saving cures. In the end, have we lost the freedoms our grandfathers fought so hard for?
 

Frankie

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Why do you say there are no "first hand accounts...."? Of course there are.

For example, the Holocaust Museum has thousands of video accounts from death camp survivors. There are plenty of first hand accounts of major battles in wars and overcoming diseases. The problem is that different groups refuse to accept them. For example, animal rights people will tell you with a straight face that using animals to test medical procedures is a waste of money. There's a book on developing the polio vaccine that asserts animals were not used at all! It's ridiculous.

Then, in one US state, the committee buying the history textbooks for use the next ten years in their high schools want to remove biographies of George Washington, Jefferson, Thurgood Marshall, etc., and put more about how religion influenced the development of this country!

The information is there. Some people just don't want to learn. If something doesn't fit in their little box, they deny it. I think school systems should stick to their guns and refuse to let kids in school if they haven't had their vaccinations. I don't believe the US dollar is going to fail. Spreading rumors and fear on the internet can't help anything, but I refuse to buy into it.

I hope you can keep this thing non-politicial. Good luck.....
 

Bez+

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rockridgecattle":2djnu248 said:
So I got to thinking today. I was on another web forum, and they have alot of religion and politics there. I pretty much stay away from that section cause it gets to "rowdy" for me. However there was a thread on the dollar collasping. Some of the things in the thread got me thinking.
Here are my thoughts and ponders

1. Our generation (I am in my 40's) and the previous generation and the one up and coming have never seen a world war. We have seen wars yes, but not a world war. Our countries (US and Canada) have fought in the Middle East yes, a war on terror. But so many are against these wars we find ourselves in. The "just" cause for most is not there.

IMO this comes from an "entitled" society - especially in Canada - and I am Canadian. The average person in Canada is so socially re-engineered that anything even close to centre politics in other countries is considered far right wing in Canada. The country has never had to fear anything - it has been protected by the big brother to the south. The average Canuck will not stand and draw a line in the sand for very many things.

2. Our veterans from the world wars are almost all gone. Gone then are the first hand accounts of when they fought in the wars. Now the up and coming generations, who, are against the wars we wage now, have no idea on the price our freedom cost. Some challenge the validity of the world wars; some even challenge validity of the holocaust...because there are few survivors left. All we have is stories in history books.

Buried two family members that served in the second world war and one in Korea within the past two years - all very moving for me

3. Our grandparents, and for some, our parents generation saw what the cost of many of the diseases that we now vaccinate for cost us in lost lives, pandemics, and those that did survive the disease, were left crippled, or worse. Disease like diphtheria; tetanus (lockjaw); pertussis (whooping cough);polio; rubella (German measles);measles (red measles); mumps; hepatitis B; and Haemophilus influenza type b disease.

All from tough stock.

Because these diseases are now, not of our time, we are raising a generation that seems to feel these vaccines are not warranted or needed so we are seeing a lot of children not vaccinated against these perils. Don’t get me wrong, freedom of choice to vaccinate or not, but how will this affect us later on down the road? Will we see a resurgence of these diseases we were once protected from?

Maybe not - but there will be new ones come along

4. A lot of our children, maybe not on this board, but all around the world, thinks that milk comes from cartons or jugs. Food comes from the grocery store. They have no concept of the beginning of food production. We are now raising a second generation who fight for animal rights; a generation who value animals above human life. We have a generation who does not know about raising their own food. Are going to end up starving ourselves because we have no idea how to raise our own food? Have we lost the ability to be self sustaining in the event of an economic collapse or some other catastrophe?

Lots of folks in the city will move to the country to eat - and you will not stop them if they are truly hungry

I had this brain fart the other day. We said grace at the dinner table. We had one of those Kraft delicious pizzas. “bless the hands that prepared our food”…all I did was put it in the oven, cut and serve….but the host of people who had a hand in making the pizza was a lot…grain farmers, dairy, livestock producers, vegetable growers, sausage makers, cheese makers, flour producers, people who chopped everything, grated the cheese, the people who made the packaging, the one who packaged, the truck driver, the distributors of the product, the store clerks who stocked the shelves….and so on.

What is going to happen if our dollar does collapse? Where are these people going to find food if we have no monetary power to buy food? How will we protect our young from diseases that were once cured if we end up becoming like a third world nation? How do we not let history repeat itself if the generations who fought in the great wars are all dead, and no one can relive the history for us to remember, they become like fables and stories handed down and there is no real context to it any more?

Understand this in my ramblings. And I am not trying to start a debate with the people who do not vaccinate their children…
…It’s just we do not have the first hand account of what happened to our nations that brought about the changes like life saving cures. In the end, have we lost the freedoms our grandfathers fought so hard for?

We have not lost the freedom - we have squandered it.

Been here for 13 months - only 11 more months in the desert and I can come home - and I come home a changed man - we are so spoiled.

Bez+
 

rockridgecattle

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Frankie":3up6awhv said:
Why do you say there are no "first hand accounts...."? Of course there are.

For example, the Holocaust Museum has thousands of video accounts from death camp survivors. There are plenty of first hand accounts of major battles in wars and overcoming diseases. The problem is that different groups refuse to accept them. For example, animal rights people will tell you with a straight face that using animals to test medical procedures is a waste of money. There's a book on developing the polio vaccine that asserts animals were not used at all! It's ridiculous.
Yes there are videos. However in our day and age of technology there are people who say it is made up, doctored, was not really like that. They deny the validity of the videos. The people who actually were there are almost all gone. In a few years there will no one to physically eye witness account of what happend. There will be a more vocal anti- it happened. It has already started.

Then, in one US state, the committee buying the history textbooks for use the next ten years in their high schools want to remove biographies of George Washington, Jefferson, Thurgood Marshall, etc., and put more about how religion influenced the development of this country!
Again, we are rewriting history to fit what is tolerable in today's society. A few years down the road, who will know what is truth and what is fiction....will we be doomed to repeat history?

The information is there. Some people just don't want to learn. If something doesn't fit in their little box, they deny it. I think school systems should stick to their guns and refuse to let kids in school if they haven't had their vaccinations. I don't believe the US dollar is going to fail. Spreading rumors and fear on the internet can't help anything, but I refuse to buy into it.
The information is there, the history is there, but we are so ready to re write it or to not teach it in its entirety.. How long before the history is changed beyond our recollection of what realy happend?

I hope you can keep this thing non-politicial. Good luck.....
 

rockridgecattle

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Bez+":33mk20oi said:
We have not lost the freedom - we have squandered it.

Been here for 13 months - only 11 more months in the desert and I can come home - and I come home a changed man - we are so spoiled.

Bez+

I have no doubt that you will return a changed person. I agree, we are spoiled, and we have squandered our freedoms rather than lost it...poor choice of words.
 

peg4x4

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Ok-I may have to delete this,but let me try--Yes there is a lot wrong here in the USA,but look at the rest of the world-and at the people risking everything to get here--Yes,we have a lot of dimwits that can't see past their own hobbyhorse--be it no death penalty animal rights or if you pray hard enough,you will be healed. There are too many who don't know where food comes from,too many who don't know measels can be deadly--Too many fools~~All we can do is try to educate .. this is a poor response at best----but what makes you think these people would believe anything that didn't fit in with their notions?? Just because someone was there doesn't mean they're going to be belived...
 

Frankie

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Peg's right. Today there are still survivors of the Holocaust and soldiers who rescued them. But there are many people, groups, organizations that deny it ever happened. There will always be people who will deny facts staring them in the face.

In the past, the NCBA has offered training for people who were interested to go out and educate people on ranching. They encouraged people to speak at Chamber of Commerce events, schools, etc., in order to educate those out of touch with farm/ranch life. See if your state cattlemen's group is involved with that.

There has been a big push for Farmers Markets nationwide the last couple of years. Even in my small town, there's been one for the last few years. The OK Ag people are supporting them. People who shop there meet and talk with producers about how their food is produced and better understand the problems facing farmers/ranchers. That's a good place to get involved with people who don't live on farms/ranches.

If you're concerned that people are losing touch with how food is raised, do something about it.
 

rockridgecattle

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I do do something about it. I participate in a farmers market weekly in the summer! And i see how out of touch people are with farming
 

peg4x4

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Alot of people are out of touch with everything natural..They've never been off pavement-them or their parents/grandparents before them-Mabe it's the books I read,but we/they are going to be in a world of hurt when the food supply is interupted..Actually,if anything in the supply chain goes wrong..Asked the young woman who cleans for me if she knew where peanuts came from-she guessed a tree from the list I gave her.
There were troops from the North that were starveing in sweetpotato/peanut fields during the Great Unplesantness. Aah well,hope I'm gone before the fecal matter hits the windmakeing machine.
 

larryshoat

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peg4x4":y5pey4ot said:
Alot of people are out of touch with everything natural..They've never been off pavement-them or their parents/grandparents before them-Mabe it's the books I read,but we/they are going to be in a world of hurt when the food supply is interupted..Actually,if anything in the supply chain goes wrong..Asked the young woman who cleans for me if she knew where peanuts came from-she guessed a tree from the list I gave her.
There were troops from the North that were starveing in sweetpotato/peanut fields during the Great Unplesantness. Aah well,hope I'm gone before the fecal matter hits the windmakeing machine.

I've never heard it put that way before, peg you have a good way with words :tiphat: .

Larry
 

farmwriter

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larryshoat":lp6odtab said:
peg4x4":lp6odtab said:
There were troops from the North that were starveing in sweetpotato/peanut fields during the Great Unplesantness. Aah well,hope I'm gone before the fecal matter hits the windmakeing machine.

I've never heard it put that way before, peg you have a good way with words :tiphat: .

Larry

Oh yes, The Great Unpleasantness, The War of Northern Agression, etc. A polite euphemism is a hallmark of good, Southern gentility. :nod:
As far as the original topic goes, you can't grant people the common sense to do what is best for them. Do what you can, don't worry about the rest. Each day has enough worries of its own.
 

TexasBred

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Was watching the news from DFW early this morning. They were estimating that over 10,000 children would NOT be admitted to school today (1st day) for lack of current immunizations.
 

rockridgecattle

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TexasBred":3p59vty0 said:
Was watching the news from DFW early this morning. They were estimating that over 10,000 children would NOT be admitted to school today (1st day) for lack of current immunizations.

WOW
 

Lammie

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rockridgecattle":9edw0fu0 said:
TexasBred":9edw0fu0 said:
Was watching the news from DFW early this morning. They were estimating that over 10,000 children would NOT be admitted to school today (1st day) for lack of current immunizations.

WOW

My understanding around here is that you just have to claim some sort of religious right not to have your kids immunized and you were off scott free. I get my kids immunized as a matter of course. I had measles and mumps. It was no fun. Not to mention missing school for six weeks. My older son had chicken pox before the vaccine came out. My younger one had the vaccine and never had to go through that. I don't know why people don't allow their kids to be immunized. These same folks will go to a dentist if they have a tooth ache but deny disease protection to their kids. Makes no sense.
 

peg4x4

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No vaccination is because some actress had a child who developed autisim after vaccination. It is a conicidence
(I think) that this happened,but much like beliefe in evil spirits that took Granny,who was only 103,timeing is everything. I've read that autisim is geneticly linked.. Don't know--It's also said most bussinessmen/politicions have slight autisim,giveing them that laser attention to only what interests them..that's why they have so much trouble with wives/family/anything outside of work.
 

TexasBred

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Religious???? Heck you're not asking them to give blood.....and they're not sick so you don't need a faith healer. It's a preventive measure.
 

farmwriter

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As I understand it, the autism/vaccination issue is a case of correlation or causation?
If 90% of inmates chew gum, does that mean gum causes criminal behavior? If most children diagnosed with autism have been vaccinated, does that mean vaccines cause autism? Some people also claim mercury contents in vaccines are dangerous.
 

peg4x4

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The age children are getting vaccinations is the age autisum starts---Something either does not connect,or connects in the wrong spot. There are all ranges of autisum,from the ability to focus on one thing at a time,to not being able to focus on anything else. That's why it's staying in the bloodlines,in it's milder state it's helpful.
 

Ryder

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farmwriter":1km3ehsy said:
As I understand it, the autism/vaccination issue is a case of correlation or causation?
If 90% of inmates chew gum, does that mean gum causes criminal behavior? If most children diagnosed with autism have been vaccinated, does that mean vaccines cause autism? Some people also claim mercury contents in vaccines are dangerous.

Maybe. Maybe not. Correlation is not a proof, but it is a possible clue.
That knife cuts both ways.
 

Lammie

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peg4x4":2ji7os4i said:
No vaccination is because some actress had a child who developed autisim after vaccination. It is a conicidence
(I think) that this happened,but much like beliefe in evil spirits that took Granny,who was only 103,timeing is everything. I've read that autisim is geneticly linked.. Don't know--It's also said most bussinessmen/politicions have slight autisim,giveing them that laser attention to only what interests them..that's why they have so much trouble with wives/family/anything outside of work.

Having worked with the developentally disabled for a number of years, I have heard every theory about why people are born differently. If I had an autistic child, I might blame vaccines or any number of things. I can understand not wanting to admit that things just happen sometimes, that it is out of our hands.
 

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